Pavee Lackeen

ro_boat

I watched Pavee Lackeen on RTE last night. It wasn't what i expected. It wasn't a documentary and it wasn't based on a true story but there was something holding the story back. Perry Ogden has made some wonderful photographs of kids on horses at the smithfield market but there was nothing wonderful about the cinematography. compared to 'the garage' which i saw recently - it was well below par.

The story was 'lacking' for want of a better word, there was no character development and no real insight into the way the travellers actually get by. except for at the very end (i loved the way she used her little sister as a counterweight for the water bucket). Every moment that had potential to reveal something about the characters was cut short. The relationship Winnie had with the woman in the craft shop?

the older brother appearing in jail?

the relationship between the mother and her neighbours? how can we empathise with these characters if we dont get to know them. All we ever see is the glazed look of indifference. where were the emotions?

The travellers are in a hopeless situation and can't help themselves. Even the 'travellers activists' that came back to help them were useless. Anyone who tried to help them was just faced with more demands - can you do that for me, thanks, can you get me something better? thanks. But the social workers didn't do anything for them, just filled them with false hope.

It was a dirty trick for the council to move them off their land instead of finding somewhere better for them to stay.

it certainly raises a lot of issues about how we treat the bottom tier of our society - just to let them rot away...

I'm not sure what Perry Ogden wanted us to experience but the message i got was that these guys are living in a bubble with no connection or contribution to a society that can't engage with them on any meaningful level, even if they try. if nothing else, it was a snapshot documenting a moment in time for dublin where house prices and immigration were at their peaks and these guys were left on the side of the road...

How can we have so much sympathy for people without running water in the third world when there are malnutritioned, illiterate people in our backyard?

Apologies, I'm new to this forum, can we discuss the issues or just the film? because i often watch films that raise issues and never get to explore them fully with anyone else, they just get forgotten...

MagicMarker

I find it odd how you despair at how they were treated in a fictional film.

As for malnourished illiterates, they choose the lifestyle they lead. Maybe stop driving brand new cars and buy a potato or two?

I didn't bother watching it tbh, can't be arsed. If they were paid I hope they paid taxes.

ro_boat

well thats the question i wanted to raise....
since it's fictional and not based on a true story...
is this a fair depiction of a traveler family?

obviously you have some personal issues with the traveling community. but that's not the way i want this thread to go... a place for people to vent

but rather, how accurate this movie is in portraying an arbitrary traveling family. how real are the problems they face - is it just a lifestyle choice?
what was the directors intention?

Zwillinge

I watched this film awhile ago and I found the story line kind of baffling.
Mostly cause there wasn't a story to it.

The characters don't have backgrounds and we don't know their future, yet we see their lives and at present what happens to them. If anything, I thought the overly scripted parts - the social workers and the Gardai - were a little unnatural and wooden, 'cause I'm not even sure if the children were acting half the time. There was more of a flow with them.

But it is interesting learning more about how they live and what they consider the norm.

SoupyNorman

My thoughts on zee matter.

professore

ro_boat wrote: »

Every moment that had potential to reveal something about the characters was cut short. The relationship Winnie had with the woman in the craft shop?

the older brother appearing in jail?

the relationship between the mother and her neighbours? how can we empathise with these characters if we dont get to know them. All we ever see is the glazed look of indifference. where were the emotions?

Have you ever actually met a traveller? Spoken to one? This is exactly how they are. This film was a very accurate portrayal. They don't show any emotions, at least not to non-travellers. I have nothing against travellers, all I can say is every experience I have had with travellers has been negative, including one where a traveller encouraged his pony to trample my 4-year old daughter. I am sure that there must be travellers who are not like this and they probably have their reasons but I haven't met any yet. I can't believe I wrote the last paragraph but I'm just speaking from personal experience. And for those who say they don't understand this can you tell me that you live near travellers or would be happy if travellers moved in next door?

SoupyNorman

professore wrote: »

including one where a traveller encouraged his pony to trample my 4-year old daughter.

That's just their playful nature and I'm not talking bout the Pony.



Back OT, it was a terrible terrible film.




terrible!

Pigman II

ro_boat wrote: »

it certainly raises a lot of issues about how we treat the bottom tier of our society

No it didn't. I watched this docudrama and just felt it was a cod. A composite of anecdotes that was sellotaped together with the odd negative scene (eg the shoplifting scene) tacked on to purposly try to give the movie an unbiased look.

Furthermore Travellers are not the bottom tier of our society. They're not any part of our society. Living in your own filth on the side of the road and making your kids grow up in the same conditions is not social.

evil-monkey

MagicMarker wrote: »

I find it odd how you despair at how they were treated in a fictional film.

As for malnourished illiterates, they choose the lifestyle they lead. Maybe stop driving brand new cars and buy a potato or two?

I didn't bother watching it tbh, can't be arsed. If they were paid I hope they paid taxes.

Well put. The fact we're even giving that shower of *insert any derogatory word here* discussion time at all is bad enough. The day I meet a decent traveler is the day I'll change my view...but until that day I wouldn't waste my time with this kinda flick...

Nolanger

It was made along the lines of recent Euro-art films hence the story's ambiguity.
Unlike most Irish movies this one tried to get the audience to think.
As for the bad photography - that was the point.
Shot on hand-held digital video it was a reaction to most Irish movies where too much importance is given to the photography resulting in bad tourist board-type films.