Manning wins 3rd MVP award

davyjose

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/9019240/Peyton-Manning-wins-third-NFL-MVP?MSNHPHMA

Only himself and the Favre have won that many. You could argue for another player, maybe, but back after 2 operations on his knee to throw his 9th 4,000 yard season, taking the Colts into a 9 game winning streak (incuding the Pats, Chargers and Steelers), it'd be hard to argue another player in the league is more valuable than he is to the Colts.

eagle eye

davyjose wrote: »

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/9019240/Peyton-Manning-wins-third-NFL-MVP?MSNHPHMA

Only himself and the Favre have won that many. You could argue for another player, maybe, but back after 2 operations on his knee to throw his 9th 4,000 yard season, taking the Colts into a 9 game winning streak (incuding the Pats, Chargers and Steelers), it'd be hard to argue another player in the league is more valuable than he is to the Colts.

It was easy for him this season with the legend that is Tom Brady sidelined.:)

Edit to add, if the Saints had a defense he would not be getting the award.

Hazys

Probably the most deserving, but then again there wasn't much competition really. It wasnt an overly exceptional season for Manning.

His performance this year wouldnt have come close to winning it last year. He would have come 5th behind Brady, Romo, himself, and Farve last year.

davyjose

eagle eye wrote: »

It was easy for him this season with the legend that is Tom Brady sidelined.:)

Edit to add, if the Saints had a defense he would not be getting the award.

Them grapes sour enough for you? :rolleyes:

Brady was the best QB for 1 of the last 10 years - Manning was/is the best QB for 9 of them. If you really believe Tom Brady would have thrown 51 TD's this season, then you've lost the plot.


And yeah, we all know how amazing the Colts Defense was this year!!!!

eagle eye

davyjose wrote: »

Them grapes sour enough for you? :rolleyes:

Brady was the best QB for 1 of the last 10 years - Manning was/is the best QB for 9 of them. If you really believe Tom Brady would have thrown 51 TD's this season, then you've lost the plot.


And yeah, we all know how amazing the Colts Defense was this year!!!!

No need to get annoyed, you didn't notice the little smilie beside the first comment. I don't have anything against Peyton Manning, he has a fantastic season. Although we'll never know what Tom Brady could have done this season, its very unlikely he would have come close to last years achievements.

On the second part, Brees was outstanding this season but unless you make the playoffs its very unlikely you can get that award. So Brees was unfortuante to be in a team with such a weak defense. As bad as the Colts D was at times, they are far better than the New Orleans equivalent.

ArmCandyBaby

I don't like seasonal awards like this going to players who've only played well for half a season but in this case half a Peyton Manning is arguably still more deserving than any other player. I didn't like some of the reasons for this decision given by a few NFL analysts: "... because he lead them out of a 3-4 slump" (which he lead them into!) and another one saying that he had the best stats for the last 9 weeks (it's a season long award, not for the length of Peytons streak - this is outrageous confirmation bias)

How come Kurt Warner didn't get more votes?

Hazys

davyjose wrote: »

Brady was the best QB for 1 of the last 10 years - Manning was/is the best QB for 9 of them.

What?

ReacherCreature

davyjose wrote: »

Brady was the best QB for 1 of the last 10 years - Manning was/is the best QB for 9 of them.

Eh?

DonkeyPokerTour

ArmCandyBaby wrote: »

How come Kurt Warner didn't get more votes?

Kurt Warner had it all sown up until the Cardinals came unstuck against the Giants and pritty much from there on Sucked!

I didn't hear Any mention of Drew Breeze (Breese? neh you know who I mean) or Philip Rivers. But one man who should have been mentioned more was Chad Pennington. Simply amazing year with the Dolphins, sure his numbers arn't amazing but he is in a very large way responsible for turning a 1-15 team into a 11-5 team! How many Jets fans out there are wondering how they would have done with Chad at QB.

Looking forward to the play off's, anyone else expect 4 away win's at the weekend? Personally I hope not, would rather see the eagles out. Personally I'm routing for a Colts - Giants Superbowl.

ReacherCreature

DonkeyPokerTour wrote: »

I didn't hear Any mention of Drew Breeze (Breese? neh you know who I mean) or Philip Rivers.quote]

Would have loved to have seen Brees get it but the Saints record wasn't good enough for a post season berth therefore really limiting his chances. Looking now, Brees didn't even get a vote!
Rivers got a mention with two votes.

Karlusss

Cards were only good against NFC West opposition. They're a playoff team but they're not a great team, and Warner wasn't always MVP material.

Brees played insanely well, but it's hard to be the MVP with that record.

Turner or AP? Another year maybe.

For me it's Manning all the way. Definition of automatic, and he is the prototype of an NFL quarterback. Without him, that team didn't make the playoffs. With him, they could win a ring.

Plus:

http://www.theonion.com/content/node/54781
http://www.theonion.com/content/node/41613
http://www.theonion.com/content/news_briefs/manning_to_take_some_time

Vikings

Karlusss wrote: »

Turner or AP? Another year maybe.

The difference between Turner and AP is in the QB position.

Turner had this season with Matt Ryan - rookie of the year. To earn an award like that obviously he has played to a high standard and helped take his team places.

AP had his season with a slow start from Tarvaris Jackson and a mediocre performance from Gus Frerotte.

In my (albeit rose tinted) eyes AP's accomplishment is much greater. It's also why he won the Bert Bell award.

I think Manning did deserve the MVP this season, he led his team to where they are now.

If you can't get your team to the most season you arent exactly valuable are you, Drew Brees? Not hating on the saints here just pointing out that a QB who does not get his team into the playoffs will not win the MVP award regardless of how good or crap the rest of their team is. (not sure if it has happened in the past, probably not though!!)

Arthur Daley

Karlusss wrote: »

Plus:

http://www.theonion.com/content/node/54781
http://www.theonion.com/content/node/41613
http://www.theonion.com/content/news_briefs/manning_to_take_some_time

Peyton Manning's Wife Tired Of His Constant 'Audibles' At The 'Line Of Scrimmage'

:pac::pac:

LOL

Come on you Colts

davyjose

Hazys wrote: »

What?

I just meant that Manning has consistently played at a higher level than Brady. Don't mind me though, I'm dying of the flu and grumpy as hell.

themont85

davyjose wrote: »

I just meant that Manning has consistently played at a higher level than Brady. Don't mind me though, I'm dying of the flu and grumpy as hell.

True Manning has been 'the man' for the Colts for the past years, he is the definition of 'franchise QB' and MVP of the decade. Manning is more valuable to the Colts than any other player, without him they would definately struggle imo. We saw this year the Pats can do it without Brady, they would have walked the no 1 seed with Brady though in fairness. Bill Bellichek is the most valuable asset for the Pats. Brady is quality though obviousely and his clutch ability and incredible stats show he is up there with Manning as the two best.

davyjose

themont85 wrote: »

True Manning has been 'the man' for the Colts for the past years, he is the definition of 'franchise QB' and MVP of the decade. Manning is more valuable to the Colts than any other player, without him they would definately struggle imo. We saw this year the Pats can do it without Brady, they would have walked the no 1 seed with Brady though in fairness. Bill Bellichek is the most valuable asset for the Pats. Brady is quality though obviousely and his clutch ability and incredible stats show he is up there with Manning as the two best.

Yeah I agree with pretty much all of that. Like I said, I was just grumpy lol, but Brady is an incredible QB.

eagle eye

themont85 wrote: »

True Manning has been 'the man' for the Colts for the past years, he is the definition of 'franchise QB' and MVP of the decade. Manning is more valuable to the Colts than any other player, without him they would definately struggle imo. We saw this year the Pats can do it without Brady, they would have walked the no 1 seed with Brady though in fairness. Bill Bellichek is the most valuable asset for the Pats. Brady is quality though obviousely and his clutch ability and incredible stats show he is up there with Manning as the two best.

Firstly Tom Brady has three rings and Peyton has only one so there is a good battle for QB of the decade without going into the yardage, unbeaten seasons, td and all that. Secondly the Patriots did not make the playoffs this year so they did not do it without Tom Brady.

Now about the coaches, you say Bill Belichick is the most valuable 'asset' to the Patriots but you more or less disregard Tony Dungy who has been in the playoffs with his teams for the last ten seasons. He is every bit as important to the Colts as Belichick is to the Patriots. My personal opinion but its biased obviously is that Bill is the best Coach ever.

I think you should jut accept that there is a good argument for both players and both coaches and I am certain that neither Brady nor Manning would be as successful if it were not for the head coaches of their respective teams who just happen to be two of the best in the history of the NFL.

themont85

eagle eye wrote: »

Firstly Tom Brady has three rings and Peyton has only one so there is a good battle for QB of the decade without going into the yardage, unbeaten seasons, td and all that. Secondly the Patriots did not make the playoffs this year so they did not do it without Tom Brady.

Now about the coaches, you say Bill Belichick is the most valuable 'asset' to the Patriots but you more or less disregard Tony Dungy who has been in the playoffs with his teams for the last ten seasons. He is every bit as important to the Colts as Belichick is to the Patriots. My personal opinion but its biased obviously is that Bill is the best Coach ever.

I think you should jut accept that there is a good argument for both players and both coaches and I am certain that neither Brady nor Manning would be as successful if it were not for the head coaches of their respective teams who just happen to be two of the best in the history of the NFL.

Bellichek is the best coach ever imo also. Dungy is a excellent coach, he builds excellent teams but in terms of breaking down the opposition, nobody is like Bellichek. Also you sighted the 3 rings to 1 for Brady vs Manning, well the same is true for Bellichek and Dungy! I can't see how you can argue that Bellichek isn't the Pats best asset(i use the word for lack of another), i mean he went 11-5 with a QB who had been a back up basically since college! Going 11-5 and missing the playoffs is a freak occurance really, it hasn't happened for 20 odd years. Bellichek is the mastermind behind the Pats having such a versatile team with the ability to compete every year in the face of many challenges. He has been lucky to have 2 of the greatest clutch players on his rosters for his 3 SBs in Brady and Vinaterri, two future HOF players. Brady along with Montana is the greatest clutch QB of all time.

I'm not trying to get into an argument of who's the best QB between the 2. Both have their incredible abilities, Brady is clutch-he can put up numbers if you give him the chance-he has the championships. Manning is consistant, 4000 over 9 seasons is incredible and he has carried the Colts franchise for a decade. But imo Manning is the most valuable player of the decade. When he was just coming back from surgery at the start of the year the Colts really struggled then as soon as he got into his rythem they kicked into gear. Without Manning i could definately see the Colts not winning half as many games as they did this year. The Pats could survive without Brady albeit in a more limited form this season.

I'm not trying to belittle Dungy or Brady here. The Pats are known as been a TEAM in a far more stricter sense than any other of the decade. Brady and Bellichek are the crucial compoments in their success, however, its just my opinion but i believe Bellichek is the major factor. I think it flips in Indy, Manning is the most important factor along with Dungy.

eagle eye

themont85 wrote: »

Bellichek is the best coach ever imo also. Dungy is a excellent coach, he builds excellent teams but in terms of breaking down the opposition, nobody is like Bellichek. Also you sighted the 3 rings to 1 for Brady vs Manning, well the same is true for Bellichek and Dungy! I can't see how you can argue that Bellichek isn't the Pats best asset(i use the word for lack of another), i mean he went 11-5 with a QB who had been a back up basically since college! Going 11-5 and missing the playoffs is a freak occurance really, it hasn't happened for 20 odd years. Bellichek is the mastermind behind the Pats having such a versatile team with the ability to compete every year in the face of many challenges. He has been lucky to have 2 of the greatest clutch players on his rosters for his 3 SBs in Brady and Vinaterri, two future HOF players. Brady along with Montana is the greatest clutch QB of all time.

I'm not trying to get into an argument of who's the best QB between the 2. Both have their incredible abilities, Brady is clutch-he can put up numbers if you give him the chance-he has the championships. Manning is consistant, 4000 over 9 seasons is incredible and he has carried the Colts franchise for a decade. But imo Manning is the most valuable player of the decade. When he was just coming back from surgery at the start of the year the Colts really struggled then as soon as he got into his rythem they kicked into gear. Without Manning i could definately see the Colts not winning half as many games as they did this year. The Pats could survive without Brady albeit in a more limited form this season.

I'm not trying to belittle Dungy or Brady here. The Pats are known as been a TEAM in a far more stricter sense than any other of the decade. Brady and Bellichek are the crucial compoments in their success, however, its just my opinion but i believe Bellichek is the major factor. I think it flips in Indy, Manning is the most important factor along with Dungy.

If you read what I said again, I didn't say who was better. I don't want to get into that argument. I was just pointing out that there are arguments for both players. I have my own opinion on that subject and I really don't care after that. I won't try and force it on anybody else.

All I was saying to you really is that Dungy has made the playoffs ten seasons on the trot. Thats an incredible achievement. He has only been with the Colts since 2002 so he did it a lot before he got there.

I'm not belittling anything that Peyton Manning has achieved by saying the above. But there is a lot more to a team than just the QB. Obviously the QB is hugely important but he is no good without an offensive line to protect him and receivers who can get open and catch the ball and of course a successful playbook.
Indianapolis in particular have had a great O line for most of Peyton Mannings career and have always had a lot of good receivers, and don't forget that Marvin Harrison was considered by many to be the best receiver in the game for a couple of years.

Look at the Patriots over the years since Bill Belichick took over. Tom Brady got his starts due to injury and held onto it after showing his class. For a long time he did not have receivers near the talent of those at Indy. It was only last season that he got a real elite receiver and look what happened with both him and Moss breaking records all over the place. Of course there was the addition of Wes Welker as well, and Donte Stallworth had a great year also which helped him to a huge deal with the Browns. But if you look at the receivers that have left New England for big deals elsewhere, can you tell me how many have been successful? I don't think anyone had done particularly well.
Now I know that sounds a little one sided and I'm not arguing either side, just showing that there are things there without mentioning rings or bowls that make a case for Tom Brady.

Who knows for certain, it could be Manning who made Harrison look that good, but we knew that Moss was the business before he came to New England but he got better than he had ever been before with Brady and this year proves he was nowhere near the figures of last season, and guess what there was no Tom Brady.

However if you look at both coaches you can see that a lot of players have improved under them and you could say that it was Belichick that got the impressive displays out of Deoin Branch, Donte Stallworth and Terry Glenn. You could also say the same about Dungy with Harrison, Wayne and the latest one Anthony Gonzalez among others.

Now I know this sounds biased but hey I never said I wasn't.:D

Anyways this just started because of a little comment I made regarding the MVP award. I really believe that its a bit unfair to give it to a player because of who he is and his history, over the course of the season he was certainly a contendor but so was Drew Brees and Phillip Rivers and a couple of others as well. I just think that Brees with all that he did should have got it, I know he didn't make the playoffs but he was so impressive this year.

davyjose

eagle eye wrote: »

Firstly Tom Brady has three rings and Peyton has only one so there is a good battle for QB of the decade

So that makes Aikman better than Favre in the 90's?

themont85

eagle eye wrote: »

If you read what I said again, I didn't say who was better. I don't want to get into that argument. I was just pointing out that there are arguments for both players. I have my own opinion on that subject and I really don't care after that. I won't try and force it on anybody else.

All I was saying to you really is that Dungy has made the playoffs ten seasons on the trot. Thats an incredible achievement. He has only been with the Colts since 2002 so he did it a lot before he got there.

I'm not belittling anything that Peyton Manning has achieved by saying the above. But there is a lot more to a team than just the QB. Obviously the QB is hugely important but he is no good without an offensive line to protect him and receivers who can get open and catch the ball and of course a successful playbook.
Indianapolis in particular have had a great O line for most of Peyton Mannings career and have always had a lot of good receivers, and don't forget that Marvin Harrison was considered by many to be the best receiver in the game for a couple of years.

Look at the Patriots over the years since Bill Belichick took over. Tom Brady got his starts due to injury and held onto it after showing his class. For a long time he did not have receivers near the talent of those at Indy. It was only last season that he got a real elite receiver and look what happened with both him and Moss breaking records all over the place. Of course there was the addition of Wes Welker as well, and Donte Stallworth had a great year also which helped him to a huge deal with the Browns. But if you look at the receivers that have left New England for big deals elsewhere, can you tell me how many have been successful? I don't think anyone had done particularly well.
Now I know that sounds a little one sided and I'm not arguing either side, just showing that there are things there without mentioning rings or bowls that make a case for Tom Brady.

Who knows for certain, it could be Manning who made Harrison look that good, but we knew that Moss was the business before he came to New England but he got better than he had ever been before with Brady and this year proves he was nowhere near the figures of last season, and guess what there was no Tom Brady.

However if you look at both coaches you can see that a lot of players have improved under them and you could say that it was Belichick that got the impressive displays out of Deoin Branch, Donte Stallworth and Terry Glenn. You could also say the same about Dungy with Harrison, Wayne and the latest one Anthony Gonzalez among others.

Now I know this sounds biased but hey I never said I wasn't.:D

Anyways this just started because of a little comment I made regarding the MVP award. I really believe that its a bit unfair to give it to a player because of who he is and his history, over the course of the season he was certainly a contendor but so was Drew Brees and Phillip Rivers and a couple of others as well. I just think that Brees with all that he did should have got it, I know he didn't make the playoffs but he was so impressive this year.

Man i agree about Brady, given the chance he puts up the numbers. My point is that BB is the most valuable part of the Pats and Manning is for the Colts imo of course. Therefore Manning is my MVP for the past decade and BB the Most Valuable Coach, all in my opinion of course.

eagle eye

themont85 wrote: »

Man i agree about Brady, given the chance he puts up the numbers. My point is that BB is the most valuable part of the Pats and Manning is for the Colts imo of course. Therefore Manning is my MVP for the past decade and BB the Most Valuable Coach, all in my opinion of course.

If there was no Manning, Dungy still makes the playoffs every year. Now tell me that wouldn't happen.

Now if he does that with 10 different QB's what would you say then?

eagle eye

davyjose wrote: »

So that makes Aikman better than Favre in the 90's?

What about the post just above this post, the Moss and Harrison factors?

I attribute the lack of success of former Patriot wide receivers at other teams down to Brady making them look better than they actually were. He finally got a top class receiver last year and look what happened.

Maybe Peyton make Marvin look good also, but I still think he would have been great anywhere as Moss was.

tallaghtoutlaws

themont85 wrote: »

Man i agree about Brady, given the chance he puts up the numbers. My point is that BB is the most valuable part of the Pats and Manning is for the Colts imo of course. Therefore Manning is my MVP for the past decade and BB the Most Valuable Coach, all in my opinion of course.

I dont agree with this either Dungey would have made it to just as many playoffs his job was made easier with Peyton Manning. Same can be said for BB. Tom Brady made his job easier also. And in strange way Cassel stepped up and did it this year only falling short to a nervy start and injured D.

But both Dungey and BB get the best out of their personnel and this makes both them great coaches. Only thing that seperates them is 2 rings.

Hynzie

themont85 wrote: »

Man i agree about Brady, given the chance he puts up the numbers. My point is that BB is the most valuable part of the Pats and Manning is for the Colts imo of course. Therefore Manning is my MVP for the past decade and BB the Most Valuable Coach, all in my opinion of course.

Good point. But I have to go with Brady for MVP of the last decade. Obiously both are amazing QBs and i think its real close, but theres one thing that Brady has over Manning and that is winning in the clutch. I know payton has won a superbowl so he can do it, but hes 7 - 8 all time in the playoffs. Brady is 14 -3 . Winning in the postseason is what matters for me. you can win 12 + games every year but if you dont win when it matters it doesnt mean nearly as much.

themont85

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

I dont agree with this either Dungey would have made it to just as many playoffs his job was made easier with Peyton Manning. Same can be said for BB. Tom Brady made his job easier also. And in strange way Cassel stepped up and did it this year only falling short to a nervy start and injured D.

But both Dungey and BB get the best out of their personnel and this makes both them great coaches. Only thing that seperates them is 2 rings.

Ye and so did BB, he got them to 11-5 with all those injuries at the D, QB and RB. He is a genius of coaching and in a game to game situation is better than Dungy imo. If you asked me last year i would have said Brady hands down is the most valuable part of the Pats organisation. However this year he got them to 11-5 with a team ramsacked with injuries not just with their future HoF QB, they missed the post season and were incredibly unlucky to do so. The focus of the Pats has switched between th offence and defence in almost equal measure and that has to come down to the coach.

Dungy is an excellent coach too. He built an awesome D in Tampa, got them to the playoffs but ultimately was fired because he couldn't improve the offence. He was brought into the Colts because they needed a defence of some description because the D was so poor. He admits himself that the Defence while improved has never been upto the standard he would wish of them. He has got them to the playoffs consistantly and won a SB but imo with the talent on offence he had they should have won more. What i'm really trying to say is that BB is a better overall coach in the sense that his gameplans and coaching fit both offence and defence and he can shift the focus like he did this year between differennt areas. I've never been confidant that Dungy could do so to nearly the same effectivness.

I'm not necessarily saying Manning is a better player than Brady and that Brady couldn't do exactly the same thing if he was with the Colts, just that PM is more valuable to the Colts than anyone else. I mean look at them, there defence and running game has been patchy but the one leading light has been Manning for 10 years now. Without him I highly doubt they make as many post seasons. And whilst Manning is their best compoment, his greatness has undermined the Colts in many ways. Other areas of the team have been incosistant like the D and have largely left it on his shoulders in the post season. The Colts won in 06 because the D finally stepped up and took some pressure of. Look at against the Chargers in OT, looking at Manning on the sideline you got the feeling he had no faith in the D stopping them. At 3rd and 2 to win the game they go 5 man shotgun and he gets sacked because the blocker completely goes to sleep, why didn't they run? Because they didn't have faith in the tun game and once again left it to Manning. This has been the story of the Colts for every year barring 06.

davyjose

It's safe to say that the Colts have undermined Manning also. I mean, there was Vanderjagt's miss against the Steeler's in '05 (the best Colts side there's been, probably). We weren't able to run, or defend the run AT ALL this year (If Dungy is such a great defensve mastermind, then his D against the run this year is nothing short of criminal), and so again the US media are questioning Manning's legacy. Now, that's hardly fair ... if you put Manning in the Steelers this year, IMO it woud be "no contest" as to win the SB. I daresay if you'd put him in the Cowboys last year, there could be a different NFC Champion right now, and so on. What I'm trying to say is that Manning has been part of a team that, rarely, have had the full array of qualities needed to be the best.

I'm not saying this because I'm a Manning, not a Colts, fan. But it's pretty obvious at times who not to blame when the Colts fail each season. Without him, we'd have more losing than winning records over the last ten years - that makes him, perpetually, a pretty big contender for MVP in my book.

themont85

davyjose wrote: »

It's safe to say that the Colts have undermined Manning also. I mean, there was Vanderjagt's miss against the Steeler's in '05 (the best Colts side there's been, probably). We weren't able to run, or defend the run AT ALL this year (If Dungy is such a great defensve mastermind, then his D against the run this year is nothing short of criminal), and so again the US media are questioning Manning's legacy. Now, that's hardly fair ... if you put Manning in the Steelers this year, IMO it woud be "no contest" as to win the SB. I daresay if you'd put him in the Cowboys last year, there could be a different NFC Champion right now, and so on. What I'm trying to say is that Manning has been part of a team that, rarely, have had the full array of qualities needed to be the best.

I'm not saying this because I'm a Manning, not a Colts, fan. But it's pretty obvious at times who not to blame when the Colts fail each season. Without him, we'd have more losing than winning records over the last ten years - that makes him, perpetually, a pretty big contender for MVP in my book.

Exactly what i think and im a Bills fan for my sins so no bias here:(