Bray Gardai dangerous driving!

fortuneteller

At aprox 3.20 am on yesterday morning i observed a marked garda car driving at speed along bray prom.No flashing lights just speeding along what is strictly a pedrestian walk way, How dangerous is this!.There were hundreds of drunk people wandering around at the time,and lots of people use that area to get some air or snog after the disco.I rang bray garda station to report it but got the text book reply.Ya,,right...Whats your name!

XJR

and what reply did you expect - sure don't you know the rules of the road don't apply to them - remember Mary Seavers?

Turner

Ah yes remember the 2 gardai firing shots into the bus that their patrol car was pinned to wihle being used a a battering ram down the naas road.

You see sometimes in the course of their duty gardai need to drive and put themselves in places that others might consider dangerous.

Why not contact the garda ombudsman and make an official complaint, let them investigate and find out if it was necessary for them to drive where they did??

Maybe they got a report of a young lady being raped, maybe they left their chips and burgers at their picnic spot on the beach, i doubt they were doing it for the craic!!

fortuneteller

The blue lights are on the cars to warn people they are responding to an emergency.they were not using them.It was reckless pure and simple.In my humble opinion! of course.

parsi

fortuneteller wrote: »

At aprox 3.20 am on yesterday morning i observed a marked garda car driving at speed along bray prom.No flashing lights just speeding along what is strictly a pedrestian walk way, How dangerous is this!.There were hundreds of drunk people wandering around at the time,and lots of people use that area to get some air or snog after the disco.I rang bray garda station to report it but got the text book reply.Ya,,right...Whats your name!

TBH complaining on boards isn't going to do much and the responses will fall into two broad categories - "all Guards are wasters - just last week I saw...." or "Guards work in mysterious ways that you the punter cannot understand".

If you strongly believe that there was an issue and "that something should be done" then make a formal written complaint - this applies to everything (buses, service, exchange rates etc) : sometimes as a nation we expend our energy complaining in the wrong way.

That prom sounds like a fairly dodgy place to be - "hundreds of drunks"

Turner

Blue lights in open spaces like a beach front give criminals plenty of time to escape.

I presume they had their headlights on, yes?? which are very high visibility.

Blue lights are for areas with traffic so other road users can easilly identify a police vehicle. Afaik no other cars drive down the prom in bray.

Come out of anonymity and contact the garda ombudsman if you think it was dangerous.

fortuneteller

Im a great supporter of the gardai.I dont want to make those guys have to answer a charge to their superiors or be confined to foot patrol for a month,I just wanted to say,cop on lads there was no need for that!That was the jist of my conversation with the station.I just told the guy on the phone im not making an issue of it i just think its a bit dangerous with all the people wandering around thats all.:rolleyes:

Bluetonic

fortuneteller wrote: »

I just wanted to say,cop on lads there was no need for that!That was the jist of my conversation with the station.

I'm lost here, how do you know there was no need for the urgency in the driving? Do you know where they were headed? What they were reacting to?

As far as I am aware there is no law that states the blue lights must be flashing with reacting to an emergency call. If there is one maybe then someone can point us in the direction.

Turner

There is no law regarding blue lights, they offer no legal exemptions to a garda driver while travelling with them on.

They are simply an aid to the garda driver.

If they were to have them on every time they were going to a call.... in some districts they would be on all the time!

fortuneteller

All very well guys,stating the law,Im driving 20 years and i have probably reversed further than most of you will ever drive.I know what i saw and it was reckless given the icy conditions and the fact that it was done on a pedestrian area at 3am.I have no more to say on the matter.

Turner

Have you completed a standard or advanced police driving course.

The driver of the garda car just might,

then again he might not.

nomorebadtown

They are the police, it is extremely difficult to mount a successful complaint against them with regard to anything let alone something as 'minor' as a speeding offence. The law simply does not apply to them in the way it does to you and me.

monument

I wasn't there, so any comments I make here are general ones and not a judgement on the case outlined by the OP... Oh, and just a note, this isn't the After Hours board, so I'd expect most posters here would have a good deal more respect for the Gardai than on that section of this site.

As posted on the other recent tread on garda driving...

Driving skills of gardaí criticised in road policing report

THOUSANDS OF gardaí who are not properly trained to drive patrol cars are causing a “serious safety issue”, the Garda Inspectorate said yesterday.

The inspectorate noted in a review of roads policing that about 2,600 gardaí were driving Garda cars on “chief’s permission”. This is a situation where senior gardaí allow untrained officers to drive patrol cars because of a shortage of fully trained members.

“This is a serious safety issue for police officers and the public. It must be addressed urgently,” the report states. It said the issue was also highlighted in a report last year.

- The Irish Times

I know a guy who was related to the man killed by a Garda car about a year ago now... you'd think they'd change a bit after that, but from what I see all too regularly in Dublin City Centre, I'm surprised they haven't yet killed more people.

Some of the more notable things I've seen include a Garda car going extremely fast along the side of the St Stephen's Green Shopping Centre and coming very close to knocking down three gardai outside the shopping centre's doors, countless of times going too fast at Luas stops in the city centre (sometimes with lights flashing, others not), and recently, five mins after a few Garda cars and a van cross O'Connell Street west bound along Abbey Street reasonably safety by slowing down, comes a Garda in an unmarked car who made no attempt to slow down until the last min and came very very close to hitting a car.

Going too fast in the above examples is in the context of the semi-pedestrianised street along St Stephen's Green Shopping Centre and near Luas stops with high volumes of people around with the expectation that even out of service trams slow down passing stops.

Chief--- wrote: »

There is no law regarding blue lights, they offer no legal exemptions to a garda driver while travelling with them on.

They are simply an aid to the garda driver.

If they were to have them on every time they were going to a call.... in some districts they would be on all the time!

...

Blue lights are for areas with traffic so other road users can easilly identify a police vehicle. Afaik no other cars drive down the prom in bray.

There's no law about it, so what? And the aid they give is -- just like construction lights etc -- is not aimed at the driver, it's to give warning to others. It's nonsense to say warning lights should not be used just because there are no cars in the area, if it's a pedestrianised area (of one sort or another) then pedestrians are the main users of the space. Again, this is all general comment and not aimed at the events outlined by the OP.

parsi wrote: »

TBH complaining on boards isn't going to do much

Welcome to boards.ie, this is a discussion board. There's a large community here. People talk about things here. It's fine saying complaining to X, Y, or Z if you want something done, but the "complaining on boards isn't going to do much" line is getting sicking around here (I mean boards in general and on different topics, not just this one).

Besides anything else I don't think the point is valid. Speaking generally, again, there's the point of informing the community here. That might not do anything, but some times it does. You've got to be kidding your self if you don't think people read this website (and a lot more read than just the numbers posting). And in some cases on Commuting & Transport that could be somebody for a council, a transport company, or somebody that knows somebody etc etc. For example, I know for a fact there's a lot of journalist posting and watching boards.ie.

AugustusMaximus

It always gets me on here how some people will defend Garda driving no matter how bloody stupid it is, yet the same people slam the ordinary motorist for going 5kph over the speed limit.

Bluetonic

fortuneteller wrote: »

All very well guys,stating the law,Im driving 20 years and i have probably reversed further than most of you will ever drive.I know what i saw and it was reckless given the icy conditions and the fact that it was done on a pedestrian area at 3am.I have no more to say on the matter.

Something tells me the issue isn't with the Gardai.

Seems you have it all sussed out.

parsi

monument wrote: »

Welcome to boards.ie, this is a discussion board. There's a large community here. People talk about things here. It's fine saying complaining to X, Y, or Z if you want something done, but the "complaining on boards isn't going to do much" line is getting sicking around here (I mean boards in general and on different topics, not just this one). .

Thanks for the welcome.

Read the context - complaining on boards in isolation does not have the desired affect. Publicise the issues on boards but without formal complaints there won't be formal action.

Did you document the events you noted above and make a formal complaint ? Was there a response ?

I'm aware the media read boards (and some say they plagiarise it) but it's still hearsay unless boards postings are backed-up by formal complaints to the organisations involved.

Let's complain about issues here, right after we've put our money where our mouths are. It's dangerously close to off-topic but the great BT threads were a prime example of publicising complaints that we had all made directly to BT. The BT thread gave people useful info on where to complain and how to complain effectively.

We can work up a fierce head of steam here about driving but no-one is going to investigate and change anything without the full information.

CLADA

monument wrote: »

I know a guy who was related to the man killed by a Garda car about a year ago now... you'd think they'd change a bit after that, but from what I see all too regularly in Dublin City Centre, I'm surprised they haven't yet killed more people.

This is the second time i've seen this post in the last week or so, not sure what other thread it appears on but it implies that the Garda driver was at fault.
If it refers to an accident in the Tallaght area then you should establish what the result of the Ombudsmans investigation was, also enquire what charges the DPP directed against the Garda driver.

You should easily be able to get this information as you have stated " I know a guy who was related to the man killed by a Garda car.....".

When you have this information maybe you would come back and enlighten those you have left with the opinion that this tragedy was a result of a speeding badly controlled Garda car.

monument

parsi wrote: »

Read the context - complaining on boards in isolation does not have the desired affect. Publicise the issues on boards but without formal complaints there won't be formal action...

With some of the first cases I seen I thought there were just once off so didn't even think about getting details, with the ones driving fast around the Luas stops would be likely viewed as so minor in the scale of things that any formal complaint would be dismissed.

In any case complaining to a Garda station and you're open to get the same type of response as the OP got, and the Ombudsman is already finding it hard to deal with its current general case load.

Furthermore, the Garda Inspectorate had recently released a critical report on current practices, including as the Times reported that "Thousands of gardaí who are not properly trained to drive patrol cars are causing a 'serious safety issue,'" … if they are not taken seriously I don't see how a few complaints will be.

But I'm just getting sick of that line about talking about it on boards will do nothing, so sorry for pointing builtup sickness of the phrase at you.

CLADA wrote: »

This is the second time i've seen this post in the last week or so, not sure what other thread it appears on but it implies that the Garda driver was at fault.

Sorry if it looked like I was implying fault, I didn’t and should have been more careful with my words. Everybody can still be more careful on the roads, and I that’s what I meant. I’m sorry again, and I won’t bring it up again.

Keith186

Chief--- wrote: »

Blue lights in open spaces like a beach front give criminals plenty of time to escape.

I presume they had their headlights on, yes?? which are very high visibility.

The picture painted by the OP sounds too dangerous for the Gardai not to have the blue lights on. Even though the criminal might see the lights and get away that won't matter if somebody was seriously injured or killed by the Garda car.

Headlights are high vis but when you see the blue lights you expect the car to be coming at high speed and you give it plenty more space whether walking or driving.

I think the OP was right to ring the police station, the garda involved might hear about the complaint and think twice about doing it again.

djtechnics1210

They might have been driving down that way to assist members that were holding a violent prisoner or members that needed transport for a prisoner.
Since ye all know Bray so well.. I'm sure you know the distance between the road and the prom is quiet a distance if you have to try and bring a violent person across it.
Not to mention the steps,bollards etc etc along the way.
Its a lot safer to drive a car down the prom than to try and bring a violent prisoner/prisoners through a large crowd.
That whole prom is also covered by c.c.t.v which is monitored in the garda station.. the car could have been going to something the c.c.t.v operator had seen on camera.

monument

djtechnics1210 wrote: »

They might have been driving down that way to assist members that were holding a violent prisoner or members that needed transport for a prisoner.
Since ye all know Bray so well.. I'm sure you know the distance between the road and the prom is quiet a distance if you have to try and bring a violent person across it.
Not to mention the steps,bollards etc etc along the way.
Its a lot safer to drive a car down the prom than to try and bring a violent prisoner/prisoners through a large crowd.
That whole prom is also covered by c.c.t.v which is monitored in the garda station.. the car could have been going to something the c.c.t.v operator had seen on camera.

Nobody said the the Garda car should not have been there, it was only said it should not being going so fast or at least not without its lights flashing... so, what's your point?

Tiesto

fortuneteller wrote: »

All very well guys,stating the law,Im driving 20 years and i have probably reversed further than most of you will ever drive.I know what i saw and it was reckless given the icy conditions and the fact that it was done on a pedestrian area at 3am.I have no more to say on the matter.

I completely agree. This is a total disgrace. There could have very easily been drunkards, couples stumbing about. If they were infact chasing criminals,they should have let them go instead of putting the general public's safety at risk!

Relevant

There could have been drunkards or couples in the way, but there could also have been a girl getting raped. The people who give out about gardai acting recklessly saying that they should put public safety first are the same ones who give out saying "i saw a fight and no gardai came for twenty minutes"

@ OP - If you think it was dangerous report it to the local super. Since there is CCTV is will be possible to establish whether this was the case.


(sorry for dragging this up again)