When did Turkey become part of Europe?

metrovelvet

Ok I have been living under a rock but I had no idea Turkey has become European. When did this happen? I noticed it because of bbc.co.uk when I was browsing the Europe section and the headline was about Turkey. Then you can scroll down the list of European countries and Turkey is listed.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/default.stm

Random

Looking at wikipedia Turkey is only a candidate country for EU membership at the moment. It suggests geographically it is part of Europe though.

Brigantes

metrovelvet wrote: »

Ok I have been living under a rock but I had no idea Turkey has become European. When did this happen? I noticed it because of bbc.co.uk when I was browsing the Europe section and the headline was about Turkey. Then you can scroll down the list of European countries and Turkey is listed.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/default.stm

Good point. I always pictured Turkey half in and half out of Europe. Once you get beyond Istanbul, I thought you were in Asia?

Zebra3

I think 2% of Turkey is in Europe. Part of Istanbul is also in Asia.

I can never understand why people describe being in the EU as "being in Europe". Does that mean Norway and Switzerland (to start with) aren't in Europe?

Also Cyprus is in the EU despite being in Asia.

metrovelvet

Ok, so the EU is not exclusively European as is geographically understood, but neither is Europe? eh? Europe is now politically not geographically defined?

Hookey

Many geographers would argue that Europe isn't a real continent anyway, and that "Eurasia" is the real continent. After all the boundary between European and Asian Russia is completely arbitrary. As for Turkey, if Russia can be regarded as "European" then so can they, unless of course Europe is an really an idea and a culture rather than a place...discuss.

pablomakaveli

Hookey wrote: »

Many geographers would argue that Europe isn't a real continent anyway, and that "Eurasia" is the real continent. After all the boundary between European and Asian Russia is completely arbitrary. As for Turkey, if Russia can be regarded as "European" then so can they, unless of course Europe is an really an idea and a culture rather than a place...discuss.

The Ural mountains in Russia are usually considered to be the border between Europe and Asia.

Most of Turkey is in an area that is known as Asia Minor but some of the country is in Europe.

In my opinion i don't consider Turkey to be part of europe.

Hookey

pablomakaveli wrote: »

The Ural mountains in Russia are usually considered to be the border between Europe and Asia.

Most of Turkey is in an area that is known as Asia Minor but some of the country is in Europe.

In my opinion i don't consider Turkey to be part of europe.

I know the Urals are the boundary, but as I said, it's an arbitrary distinction. There's no real geological reason to say "Europe ends here". The Dardanelles is another arbitrary "border" between Asia and Europe, but as Turkey sits on both sides of it, then, as I said, their claim to be in Europe is valid, if, geography is what defines Europe. Now, what we all know, but kind of don't want to talk about because it opens a huge can of worms, is that the geographic boundaries of Europe are not what people are thinking about. Turkey is a secular republic and a democracy (albeit with a dodgy human rights record, but then so did Spain when they were accepted into the EU), so what's the objection? Could it be their religion perhaps? Or the fact that they're a little browner than the rest of us "Europeans"? Might be a difficult to subject to broach if you're French (4M moslems), or British (2M moslems), or German (3M moslems). How do you say Turkey doesn't count (when geographically it does), and yet still appease these populations?

Serenity Now!

Hookey wrote: »

Turkey is a secular republic and a democracy (albeit with a dodgy human rights record, but then so did Spain when they were accepted into the EU), so what's the objection? Could it be their religion perhaps? Or the fact that they're a little browner than the rest of us "Europeans"? Might be a difficult to subject to broach if you're French (4M moslems), or British (2M moslems), or German (3M moslems). How do you say Turkey doesn't count (when geographically it does), and yet still appease these populations?

LOL! Talk about flying off the sanctimonious handle! :rolleyes:

pablomakaveli

Hookey wrote: »

How do you say Turkey doesn't count (when geographically it does), and yet still appease these populations?

Russia geographically is in Europe but isn't traditionally regarded as european, turkey is in the same boat. Geographically part of europe but not traditionally considered european.

metrovelvet

So on a geographic map its in Europe but on a Political map its somewhere else?

Hookey

pablomakaveli wrote: »

Russia geographically is in Europe but isn't traditionally regarded as european, turkey is in the same boat. Geographically part of europe but not traditionally considered european.

Er, most Russians would disagree with you! They certainly do consider themselves European.

pablomakaveli

Hookey wrote: »

Er, most Russians would disagree with you! They certainly do consider themselves European.

Even the ones that live closer to the pacific than to europe?

Hookey

pablomakaveli wrote: »

Even the ones that live closer to the pacific than to europe?

It depends. If they're Siberian, no, but if they're ethnic Russians, yes. Russians have always considered themselves as "The bulwark against Asia", and think the rest of Europe is rather ungrateful for their protection of us from the Tatar hordes down the centuries.

Serenity Now!

metrovelvet wrote: »

So on a geographic map its in Europe but on a Political map its somewhere else?

Partly in Europe but politically 'outside'.
Norway is situated in Europe yet is politically outside Europe, for example.

Ireland is part of the British Isles (geographic) but is not part of Britain (political).

pablomakaveli

Serenity Now! wrote: »

Ireland is part of the British Isles

Careful. That might open a whole other can of worms here.;)

Pride Fighter

Turkey used to own huge chunks of Europe, the entire Balklands penninsula more or less. It then began to lose its territories pretty quickly and was known as the sick man of Europe. The key being the last word.