Thread missing??

DAMO72

There was a thread on here earlier today regarding dealers and it seem's to be removed , any1 know the reason why . Personally i would have thought it is a good idea . ????

FuttBucker

ye i saw this too, Mods must have removed it, dont knw why tho....

5starpool

Mods are discussing it for a couple of reasons. In theory it sounds like an ok idea, but there are a couplr of things around it we are looking at for now.

DAMO72

5starpool wrote: »

Mods are discussing it for a couple of reasons. In theory it sounds like an ok idea, but there are a couplr of things around it we are looking at for now.

Fair enough Dom. In general i would agree with the idea , but i think that the operator that any post would be made about would be given the opportunity to answer any Q's from the dealers in private b4 it is allowed to go on view here, other wise it will only become another witch hunt that has become all too frequent on boards recently.

5starpool

That is probably the main point that we are discussing tbh.

Goodluck2me

I think that it's important that it's not censored too much though, as it's about the only retribution the dealers get from dodgy operators. People will most likely still go to any event they see as good value regardless of how badly the dealers are treated, and here is the only place where they can voice their opinion and have the whole story open to all.

bohsman

goodluck2me wrote: »

I think that it's important that it's not censored too much though, as it's about the only retribution the dealers get from dodgy operators. People will most likely still go to any event they see as good value regardless of how badly the dealers are treated, and here is the only place where they can voice their opinion and have the whole story open to all.

Id say its coming to a stage where most operators will find it near impossible to get dealers if they dont look after staff well, so its certainly not the only outlet.

KevIRL

goodluck2me wrote: »

I think that it's important that it's not censored too much though, as it's about the only retribution the dealers get from dodgy operators. People will most likely still go to any event they see as good value regardless of how badly the dealers are treated, and here is the only place where they can voice their opinion and have the whole story open to all.

Fair point Joe, however we would rather avoid having brand new accounts set up just to come on and post allegations. This isnt helpful, in fact as opposed to getting something done about a possible situation it just creates unsubstanciated rumours.

A better course of action would be to contact the promoters privately and then if nothing comes of this to post up a thread. If the poster is a new poster on boards then a PM to give mods a heads up is appreciated.

We have a recent spate of new accounts making allegations/spreading rumours about organisers. The organisers of tournaments are open about their identity obviously, for these sort of allegations/rumours then imo the poster should be too.

There is a seperate issue to be considered around possible legal issues etc

zuroph

the anonymity of it is surely going to become an issue though. good tourney runners should have no problem dealing with such an "unofficial union" publically, and welcoming them to tourneys, but they chose to go covert which can always cause problems. If I was a dealer, i wouldnt be touching this.

Ste05

zuroph wrote: »

the anonymity of it is surely going to become an issue though. good tourney runners should have no problem dealing with such an "unofficial union" publically, and welcoming them to tourneys, but they chose to go covert which can always cause problems. If I was a dealer, i wouldnt be touching this.

Neither will we be allowing anonymous posting about things like this...

opr

When did boards become a public vehicle to voice discontentment about your employer ?

Besides which this is a poker forum not an employment one. How mods are even giving this consideration is beyond me.

Opr

Goodluck2me

@ OPR
because it directly affects the poker tournaments in the country.

I agree completely about anonymous posting, but so long as people put their name to their post if they aren't well known then it's fine imo.

I think PE have found it much tougher this year to get dealers, if they get them, because of misgivngs in the past, and rightly so, the same for anyone who does so.

Ste05

The thing is, people need to do more than sign their name, there'd have to be some way to verify that the person is who they say they are. They'd have to already have a reputation on here or someone (known here) would have to vouch that the person is who they say they are. Without these checks serious damage could be done to an organisers reputation that is completely unwarranted, and IMO that will not be allowed here.

Everyone knows how powerful this forum has become over the years in the industry and I don't think we should ever let an opportunity arise where someone with a grudge can use it to cause someone damage without risking their own reputation should it be proven to be wrong.

RoundTower

even if the mods hadn't taken it down, the company involved could have got them to take it down by sending an email along the lines of "totally untrue....slanderous.....scurrilous....we demand....considering legal action" and it would have disappeared without a second thought.

5starpool

As would their right to ever post here again, so not exactly a win for them either RT.

DAMO72

Ste05 wrote: »

The thing is, people need to do more than sign their name, there'd have to be some way to verify that the person is who they say they are. They'd have to already have a reputation on here or someone (known here) would have to vouch that the person is who they say they are. Without these checks serious damage could be done to an organisers reputation that is completely unwarranted, and IMO that will not be allowed here.

Everyone knows how powerful this forum has become over the years in the industry and I don't think we should ever let an opportunity arise where someone with a grudge can use it to cause someone damage without risking their own reputation should it be proven to be wrong.

Simple . If the boards community and "dealers union" togeather appoint 2 well known representatives each. The dealers union can submit there report on any event to the appointed boards reps who will then scrutinise it , clear it with a mod for legality's and then it can be jointly posted on here for the operator to answer any Q's that may need adressing. At least then evry1 will be aware of where it has come from, and any other post that appears without the joint approval can be deemed as Bullsh1t and deleted. Just my opinion

Lao Lao

DAMO72 wrote: »

Simple . If the boards community and "dealers union" togeather appoint 2 well known representatives each. The dealers union can submit there report on any event to the appointed boards reps who will then scrutinise it , clear it with a mod for legality's and then it can be jointly posted on here for the operator to answer any Q's that may need adressing. At least then evry1 will be aware of where it has come from, and any other post that appears without the joint approval can be deemed as Bullsh1t and deleted. Just my opinion

Seems like a very long winded way to sort out your problems. If a dealer has a problem with a tourney organiser, why not just go to the organiser? Surely we're all old enough to be able to speak out and put our case forward when we feel aggrieved.

Kimba

Dealers do go to the tourney organisers and air their grievences (I certainly have in the past) but one dealer complaining or several sometimes dont make any difference. Some organisers think that it doesnt matter how bad you are to the staff you employ there will always be dealers who want work.

The next step for the dealer is then to post on boards as it is a voice that will be listened to.

Provided that what is being stated is the truth, I think dealers and players should be aware of employers such as this.

Poker has certainly got much bigger than it used to be 9 years ago when I first came to Ireland. Then it was a case of put up or shut up but not now.

Danielle

Goodluck2me

Kimba wrote: »

Dealers do go to the tourney organisers and air their grievences (I certainly have in the past) but one dealer complaining or several sometimes dont make any difference. Some organisers think that it doesnt matter how bad you are to the staff you employ there will always be dealers who want work.

The next step for the dealer is then to post on boards as it is a voice that will be listened to.

Provided that what is being stated is the truth, I think dealers and players should be aware of employers such as this.

Poker has certainly got much bigger than it used to be 9 years ago when I first came to Ireland. Then it was a case of put up or shut up but not now.

Danielle

Totally agree

Lauralashes

In my experience of both dealing and dealer management the most important quality that is missing at many events is common courtesy to dealers from management.

Any dealer will tell you that if they are treated with respect and kept informed of situations that affect them such as dealer shortage etc, they are happy to work towards the common goal of making the event a sucess, regardless of whether it means working a few extra hours or having a few less breaks. They do this because they feel that they are part of a team rather than there as a spare part to be used as others see fit.

I have been to many events where dealers are treated like second class citizens but also to many events where dealers have been treated fairly and honestly. The difference in dealer morale at both events cannot be measured.

At the end of the day it doesnt cost anything to be NICE.

Donkathon

is there not some way to only allow people with like 100+ posts to post there because frankly i cant see anyone posting over a 100 posts to take a dig at someone or some tournament?

KevIRL

Right, this thread is going very seriously off topic. The matter has been discussed amoungst the mods and we got some input from DeVore on it as well.

If some dealers wish to put forward some sort of arrangement to provide feedback on events then we are all for it. But it must be done properly and with a reasonable approach. Anonomous postings slagging off a tournament/organiser is not the way to do this.

If the OP of the deleted thread (username : insideDealer) or indeed anyone else wishes to follow up and get this started then please contact the mods seperately.

This thread has served its purpose, also it was getting personal with posters having go at others and events, so its locked now, and I've also removed a few posts to keep the peace.