Accident = Penalty Points?

OldmanMondeo

Question, do you think people who are at fault for accidents be given penalty points or do you think it is adding insult to injury?

Personally I think that all accidents are avoidable and therefore people who cause them should been both fined and given points. The reason being that even the smallist fender bender can cause major delays in peak hour traffic. In advance for those who reply that the accident was caused by someone who was not invovled woth the collison and drove away, surely then no-one should get the points, my answer would be they were not paying enough attention to the road and could have avoided the collision.

The benefits I think would be people paying more care and attention therefore less accidents, less claims (lower insurance) and less delays on our roads.

Saab Ed

Nah I dont agree. More relevant fines kinda like the system in Finland were by the size of the fine is defined by your level of income. The straight forward handing out of points for pre defined offences is ok with me but not when its based on opinion of a Guard.

Danbo!

Although most accidents can be avoided, the introduction of penalty points would not have any impact. People don't* break the speed limit because they know they'll get points, similarly they don't* park/drive in bus lanes or break red lights, because of the punishment. If penalty points were introduced, it wouldn't make people think, 'Oh, I probably shouldn't rear-end anyone on my way to work', the accidents would still happen as a result of a momentary lapse in concentration, distraction etc.. I think having to pay out or lose a no claims bonus is a harder hit to take than a few points on the licence, so the motivation to avoid accidents is already there.


*Read: Shouldn't

OldmanMondeo

Saab Ed wrote: »

but not when its based on opinion of a Guard.

Since most insurance companies will us Garda reports when liability is in doubt then surley the Gardai would be able to decide who is at fault. Most are clear cut, hitting from behind, breaking lights etc, but I agree some are not so clear cut.

hobochris

The system is already in place, If a gard attends the scene of an accident and deams a party to have caused it through dangerous driving then that party may recieve points at the digression of the gard or may even be pursued through the courts by the state to recover all costs involved. not just vitim costs but the cost of emergency services attending the scene aswell as legal costs.

JackFrosty

No way, we have enough penalty point offences all ready.

Maybe a big fine!

Guards dont always get it right, I was driving down a one way street (the right way) in tallow Co. Carlow when a NI reg car decided to reverse the wrong way up the street, i stopped and he reversed straight into me1

Local cop said in his report it was a 50/50 which made me as much to blame as the NI reg driver.

the_syco

Saab Ed wrote: »

Nah I dont agree. More relevant fines kinda like the system in Finland were by the size of the fine is defined by your level of income.

Wouldn't be fair here, as the scumbag would probably only have to pay €50 as he's on the dole, but someone workings pays treble that?

bazz26

The gardai can charge a motorist with dangerous/careless driving if they suspect their actions resulted in a colision or injury to another motorist or pedestrian. This can lead to a prosecution/conviction and resulting punishment worse than issuing penalty points.

I don't agree with issuing penalty points for each and every accident known to man, by definition an accident is just that. Where their is a clear element of cause/blame defined then I think it sufficently falls under the existing law imo.

OldmanMondeo

Fair points raised, excuse the pun.

How about the usual 4 car pile up on the N7/N1/N4 we hear about most mornings where in fact it is a stupid rear ending one car into another, these are the type that usually cause most greif and heartache for other commuters trying to use these routes. Yet these is minor-ish damage, nobody needs hospital treatment, But hold people up for hours on end.

JackFrosty

Sounds like you are really pissed off with bad drivers1

How about a system where by a person causing an accident is made resit the driving test or has to take a refresher driving course,
Maybe something on those lines would make a bad driver aware he is a bad driver!

Saab Ed

Yeah but how do you prove who hit who so who gets the points i.e in a 4 car pile up ,were the first 3 cars stopped and the last car pushed them all into each other or did they all hit each other one after the other. If a guard feels that somebody needs to be charged with dangerous driving well then fair enough ,let the judge decide. To be honest I cant imagine the guards would want this extra work themselves but I'll let one of them answer that. Thats just my opinion.

JackFrosty

Its a tough call, someone always gets the blame and its not always the one who was at fault,

Flyer1

It's called an Accident for a reason !

Sure, you may not be over the speed limit on purpose, but there's a big gauge with a needle on it smack in front of your face to look at to see if you are over the limit, thats warning enough.

There are generally no warning signs for an accident, unless of course you're stonking over the back roads over 100mph, but there's no feasible way of governing this. If you happen to be driving along tomorrow, hit some black ice, and end up rear ending the guy in front, thats not really something you should be punished for.

tin79

But what about situations where someone will be liable for insurance reasons but not really at fault for causing an accident.

Say someone is driving along a road and they hit a rock that has dropped off a truck that passed by an hour ago. The car hits the rock, the tyre blows and they swerve and clip a car coming the other way.

shoud they get a big fine and penalty points automatically? because they are insurance liable? What have they done wrong?


What about black ice? Oil on the road?

i disagree with your premise. my motivation for trying to drive safely is so that i can come home alive to my family and not wreck my car/life or anyone elses. Fear of losing a few quid and having points by default wouldnt make me want to drive any more carefully.

ART6

I go with others here and wouldn't want to see any more penalty point offences since I am not at all sure that they really get through to people until each of them is within a few points of goodbye licence. I would, however, like to see much more action on dangerous or reckless driving and more people getting pulled for it. The one that really irritates the hell out of me is the widespread habit of tailgating at all sorts of speeds, since someone nearly killed me a few years ago doing that. I would like to see such people stopped by AGS and booked, and I'd like to see an advertising campaign saying that the Gardai are going to crack down on people doing it, instead of their threatening to crack down on everything else.

Eoin

OldmanMondeo wrote: »

The benefits I think would be people paying more care and attention therefore less accidents, less claims (lower insurance) and less delays on our roads.

If the thought of a crash doesn't make people pay due care and attention, then I don't think penalty points will either.