Empty Commercial Property in Galway

galwaybabe

This is happening everywhere
http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=6sEzeW7TU5g&fmt=18

JohnCleary

Greedy developers who can afford to sit on it. They'd rather see the place empty than only make a small profit

Wonder why did the person shooting the video take a shot of the SAP Building? Nearly every office desk in that place is being used! The sign refers to another building - bad research cameraman, bad!

Interceptor

Hey OP I'm not sure what your point is - go start a business and fill some of this space.

Hippies always want stuff for nothing - and that Damien Dempsey sondtrack to the yoochoob vid made me ill. That video is like something an art student made to illustrate the rubbishness of property signage.

'cptr

SimpleSam06

JohnCleary wrote: »

Greedy developers who can afford to sit on it. They'd rather see the place empty than only make a small profit

I'm not seeing that, tbh. Every single commercial property has to have its rates paid whether occupied or not, so the people that own those buildings are taking a ferocious loss annually.

The problem with commercial lettings is that they usually only want to let out entire floors of buildings and partition them up into sections, its cheaper to build the places without individual offices for fire code reasons or something like that. Not many businesses can afford to lease an entire floor at a time, they just aren't big enough, so the places sit empty.

I get the message they were trying to deliver there, but it would be more apt to show empty residential properties. Commercial is a different ballgame.

galwaybabe

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

I'm not seeing that, tbh. Every single commercial property has to have its rates paid whether occupied or not, so the people that own those buildings are taking a ferocious loss annually.

The problem with commercial lettings is that they usually only want to let out entire floors of buildings and partition them up into sections, its cheaper to build the places without individual offices for fire code reasons or something like that. Not many businesses can afford to lease an entire floor at a time, they just aren't big enough, so the places sit empty.

I get the message they were trying to deliver there, but it would be more apt to show empty residential properties. Commercial is a different ballgame.

Everyone is talking about the empty residential property and ignoring this commercial property problem and problem it is, a big, fat one!

galwaybabe

Interceptor wrote: »

Hey OP I'm not sure what your point is - go start a business and fill some of this space.

Hippies always want stuff for nothing - and that Damien Dempsey sondtrack to the yoochoob vid made me ill. That video is like something an art student made to illustrate the rubbishness of property signage.

'cptr

Oooh Interceptor, have we hit a raw nerve? How much empty property do you have then?

JohnCleary

galwaybabe wrote: »

Oooh Interceptor, have we hit a raw nerve? How much empty property do you have then?

Jesus what's with the Galway forum these days? Are ye drinkin too much tap water?

Ye both have valid points, don't be gettin so fcukin sarky at 10am!

Interceptor - galwaybabe has a point, it's nuts the amount of commercial property for rent in Galway, but as someone else said, the EXACT same thing can be said for residential

I put it down to owners asking too much, but stubborness (sp?) has taken over and they won't let for a small profit margin - i'm probably wrong though.

scottledeuce

I just hate Damian Dempsey

SimpleSam06

galwaybabe wrote: »

Everyone is talking about the empty residential property and ignoring this commercial property problem and problem it is, a big, fat one!

Not so much that everyone ignores it, its more that its not seen as a problem. Residential is very serious because people were unable to buy homes as some specuvestors were trying to line their own pockets. Commercial doesn't really affect anyone. If it goes on for long enough they'll be abandoned and left derelict as the owners won't be able to continue paying the rates (and one or two of those places would be charged six figures annually I'd say). If demand is there the places will be filled. If not, so what?

Triangle

There's various reasons for it too. (i.e. empty comm. property)
I know of a few commercial premises without adequate parking and/or out of sight of potential shoppers (i.e. bad location)

One property in that clip had structural defects and was sinking (it's fixed now i believe)..... although, would you want to buy that kind of place?

Xiney

(There should be a law against people rapping with discernible Dublin accents.)

galway008

You don't pay rates on commercial property which is not used i.e. no business going on.

Xiney

galway008 wrote: »

You don't pay rates on commercial property which is not used i.e. no business going on.

I don't believe that to be the case - I'm trying to find a link (must be using the wrong google keywords) but when my previous employers received their commercial rates valuation in the post I read it and it said something like "if the property is empty and unused the owner must pay the rate" but I think it was half the rate or at least reduced by some amount.

I remember because I was working in an estate where half the buildings stood empty, so I was thinking about it for a good while afterwards.

I could be wrong but I distinctly remember reading that on the letter they got.

PopeBuckfastXVI

Saw this on the 'pin... good job gb

galway008

If its a new property they definitely don't have to pay rates, they just say its not finished.

Interceptor

galwaybabe wrote: »

Oooh Interceptor, have we hit a raw nerve? How much empty property do you have then?

I have lots of empty property - its called a 'field'...

I am trying to move office at the moment but all I can find are entire buildings to rent for €100,000 p.a and nothing around 10k sq.ft which fits my requirements - there is a no sign of a drop in asking prices for commercial lettings. Recession my hole...:D

'cptr

JohnCleary

Interceptor wrote: »

I have lots of empty property - its called a 'field'...

I am trying to move office at the moment but all I can find are entire buildings to rent for €100,000 p.a and nothing around 10k sq.ft which fits my requirements - there is a no sign of a drop in asking prices for commercial lettings. Recession my hole...:D

'cptr

There's a recession alright. Remember, just because someone is asking/demanding a certain price, it does NOT mean they're getting that. A perfect example is all the empty commercial outlets! They may want €100k PA, but at the moment they're getting €0 PA

Mike...

scottledeuce wrote: »

I just hate Damian Dempsey

Mono Syll-ab-ic Da-mi-en Dem-p-sey

galwaybabe

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

Not so much that everyone ignores it, its more that its not seen as a problem. Residential is very serious because people were unable to buy homes as some specuvestors were trying to line their own pockets. Commercial doesn't really affect anyone. If it goes on for long enough they'll be abandoned and left derelict as the owners won't be able to continue paying the rates (and one or two of those places would be charged six figures annually I'd say). If demand is there the places will be filled. If not, so what?

The thing is that people have invested in these properties. Some of these people are already in business elsewhere. If the bank puts the pressure on these people are going to crack and hence their businesses too. That scenario is a very real possibility. Remember the discussion about that game place on Henry St? How many jobs were lost there? Imagine that on a large scale.

Another thing is that the banks invest our money in all these properties. Its our money that is being put at risk here. It is our pension fund that is being used to bail out the troubled misguided banks.

witnessmenow

Em, what?

Op maybe you could clearly describe the point you are trying to get across?

SimpleSam06

galwaybabe wrote: »

The thing is that people have invested in these properties. Some of these people are already in business elsewhere.

Most of the people that invested in those properties are property developers, the likes of the Melvilles of Oran precast fame. Its not like publicly floated companies where stocks are bought and sold, Galway isn't on that level. Its also not like businesspeople who own shops around the city have invested in these places.

galwaybabe wrote: »

Remember the discussion about that game place on Henry St? How many jobs were lost there? Imagine that on a large scale.

Honestly, I have no idea. What discussion?

galwaybabe wrote: »

Another thing is that the banks invest our money in all these properties. Its our money that is being put at risk here. It is our pension fund that is being used to bail out the troubled misguided banks.

Thats a very very complex nest of cause and effect you are talking about there, most of it not applicable to commercial property in Galway. If you want to know how that video clip sans soundtrack affects me, I find it tremendously saddening that these places were built for businesses to inhabit, and now so many of them stand empty. If you want to see the face of the recession, look no further. As far as an expression of the greed of the celtic tiger goes, the clip is 100-proof fail.

Wompa1

Who really gives a damn! Live and let live, do what you need to do to survive. Look out for the number 1 and f**k the rest.

galwaybabe

Wompa1 wrote: »

Who really gives a damn! Live and let live, do what you need to do to survive. Look out for the number 1 and f**k the rest.

I presume your tongue is in your cheek there.

galwaybabe

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

Most of the people that invested in those properties are property developers, the likes of the Melvilles of Oran precast fame. Its not like publicly floated companies where stocks are bought and sold, Galway isn't on that level. Its also not like businesspeople who own shops around the city have invested in these places.


Honestly, I have no idea. What discussion?


Thats a very very complex nest of cause and effect you are talking about there, most of it not applicable to commercial property in Galway. If you want to know how that video clip sans soundtrack affects me, I find it tremendously saddening that these places were built for businesses to inhabit, and now so many of them stand empty. If you want to see the face of the recession, look no further. As far as an expression of the greed of the celtic tiger goes, the clip is 100-proof fail.

Have a look at what happens if a businessman overstretches himself -
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055424601

SimpleSam06

galwaybabe wrote: »

Have a look at what happens if a businessman overstretches himself -
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055424601

Oh yeah, that. A business doesn't need to overstretch itself to go bust. Sometimes they are unlucky, sometimes the market shifts too quickly, sometimes they didn't think it through fully. Anyway I still don't see how that pertains to the video.

JohnCleary

galwaybabe wrote: »

Have a look at what happens if a businessman overstretches himself -
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055424601

Um, wasn't that thread just full of rumours? Don't think we got a clear answer from the owner(s) why the place closed down?

galvianlord

This is an odd thread; not sure whether people are outraged by the fact that these spaces are empty or whether they are empathising with the people who put themselves on the line to develop them?

Galway's commercial redevelopment began in the early 90s when the government instituted tax incentives in order to make Ireland's city centres attractive enough places in which people could both live and work. Those of you from Galway will remember that the town in the eighties was half-ruined, derelict houses and buildings lined Middle Street, Quay Street was a no-go area after dark and all life gravitated toward Eyre Square. When the Cornstore was built in the early 90s it was the first commercial development in the City Centre for many years. It started a trend and soon other areas , the main being the Eyre Square Centre and others such as the old Garda Barracks on Eglinton Street and Kirwans Lane followed. Modern planning was in its infancy and so the aesthetics of some of those developments left alot to be desired. Yet as the economy was on the way up, tenants were found and gravitated to each of these and other developments. Yet the Galway we enjoy today was funded and built by the banks and developers which seem to be of such an irritant today.

Then came the Tiger economy - we all know what happened there!

Many of the developments on the outskirts of the city and pictured in the film (what an annoying soundtrack) were completed in the last two or three years. Tenants by then had become harder to find and many of these spaces were to lie empty. Location may not have suited or not enough forward-planning had been done by those involved, either way they were built and no one came.

To the thread starter, why is this such an affront to you? Are you involved in property? Are you feeling the squeeze? If you're not I dont really see what the point of the exercise was! These are properties developed by individuals and consortiums. They obviously havent made the returns they were seeking and it is doubtful if they ever will now. I suppose we could nationalise private property portfolios, but I think the Constitution might have something to say about that! So what would you do about it all? What's your ideal scenario? Bail out developers? Is it not an issue for them and the market at this point...?

galwaybabe

galvianlord wrote: »

This is an odd thread; not sure whether people are outraged by the fact that these spaces are empty or whether they are empathising with the people who put themselves on the line to develop them?

Galway's commercial redevelopment began in the early 90s when the government instituted tax incentives in order to make Ireland's city centres attractive enough places in which people could both live and work. Those of you from Galway will remember that the town in the eighties was half-ruined, derelict houses and buildings lined Middle Street, Quay Street was a no-go area after dark and all life gravitated toward Eyre Square. When the Cornstore was built in the early 90s it was the first commercial development in the City Centre for many years. It started a trend and soon other areas , the main being the Eyre Square Centre and others such as the old Garda Barracks on Eglinton Street and Kirwans Lane followed. Modern planning was in its infancy and so the aesthetics of some of those developments left alot to be desired. Yet as the economy was on the way up, tenants were found and gravitated to each of these and other developments. Yet the Galway we enjoy today was funded and built by the banks and developers which seem to be of such an irritant today.

Then came the Tiger economy - we all know what happened there!

Many of the developments on the outskirts of the city and pictured in the film (what an annoying soundtrack) were completed in the last two or three years. Tenants by then had become harder to find and many of these spaces were to lie empty. Location may not have suited or not enough forward-planning had been done by those involved, either way they were built and no one came.

To the thread starter, why is this such an affront to you? Are you involved in property? Are you feeling the squeeze? If you're not I dont really see what the point of the exercise was! These are properties developed by individuals and consortiums. They obviously havent made the returns they were seeking and it is doubtful if they ever will now. I suppose we could nationalise private property portfolios, but I think the Constitution might have something to say about that! So what would you do about it all? What's your ideal scenario? Bail out developers? Is it not an issue for them and the market at this point...?

I'm not involved in property. The point of the exercise was to document the amount of empty commercial property in the city. The individuals and consortiums who built these empty eyesores were driven by greed, fuelled by the banks and really didn't give two hoots about anyone else why they were at it. The bigger picture is that if these guys default on their massive bank loans because their eyes were bigger than their bank balances we all pay in the end. Think pension funds, think recapitalisation.
I agree with you that it is now an issue for the market but it should never have been allowed to reach the point it is at now. The only advantage I can think of at the moment is that this glut will bring commercial rents down and we may see more small businesses being able to afford them. Oh wait, that won't happen will it. I forgot the developers borrowed all the money!

witnessmenow

The idea of these building were probably conceived 3 years ago or more when Ireland economy was going extremely well and there would have been a need for them. Unforunately no one brought there crystal balls with them when planning this and could not for see a major world wide economic downturn happening a few years down the road.

For years on upon years these developers are making large developments and are being successful with them, so banks probably viewed them as pretty safe bets (because for years they were)

Did you get turned down a bank loan or something?

Head The Wall

How long is that building across from the cemetery sitting idle? behind the topaz station near bohermore

galwaybabe

Head The Wall wrote: »

How long is that building across from the cemetery sitting idle? behind the topaz station near bohermore

About 3 years

Sponge Bob

It was finished in 2000 or 2001 , the reddish brick one behind the Topaz, and was never fully occupied if indeed any of it was ever occupied .

That Connaught House building above Laura Ashley , also empty for 5 years and clad in tin or aluminium has just under 20 parking spaces per floor .

Another place I remember looking at had no protected stairwell any more because the landlord had allowed the one tenant to punch through it . When I mentioned a fire cert to the auctioneer I never heard back from them , ever .

It has been largely empty for 5 or 6 years despite being well fitted out for a modern office .

Most of them are shell and core , never used .

There must be a million square feet in Galway City . Empty . I know of offices finished in 2000 and never let and of offices lying empty since 2000 .

galwaybabe

Anecdotal I know but I've just heard about one of the developers down here in Galway being in 50 million Euro's worth of debt. Multiply that by a 100 and we're talking a lot of money and I'm sure there are more than a 100 such developers in Ireland at the moment. The mind boggles.

SimpleSam06

galwaybabe wrote: »

Anecdotal I know but I've just heard about one of the developers down here in Galway being in 50 million Euro's worth of debt. Multiply that by a 100 and we're talking a lot of money and I'm sure there are more than a 100 such developers in Ireland at the moment. The mind boggles.

Developers owe a significant portion of the GDP to the banks. I forget how much exactly, I think it was half the GDP.