The Marmottee

07Lapierre

Has anyone taken part in the Marmottee sportive? I'm thinking of doing it, but at the moment I do about 80klm every saturday around north county dublin. Has anyone any training tips/routines they can suggest? Am I biting off more than i can chew? I mean, how do you train for something like this? Ireland has no "real" mountains. I'm 40 years old and I've been cycling for over 20 years, but I've only cycled in Ireland. I cycled up to Glencree last summer via Kilakee road, and i found it tough. Am i Mad?

TinyExplosions

07Lapierre wrote: »

Has anyone taken part in the Marmottee sportive? I'm thinking of doing it, but at the moment I do about 80klm every saturday around north county dublin. Has anyone any training tips/routines they can suggest? Am I biting off more than i can chew? I mean, how do you train for something like this? Ireland has no "real" mountains. I'm 40 years old and I've been cycling for over 20 years, but I've only cycled in Ireland. I cycled up to Glencree last summer via Kilakee road, and i found it tough. Am i Mad?

There's a couple of people here who have done it, and more (including me!) who are doing it next year. We cycled a lot of he climbs in October (though didn't string them together), and they are tough, but do-able. You've plenty of time to get prepared for it, and simply put, you need to put the miles in and do the climbs you can find. Get out there and do Sally Gap, Wicklow Gap, Slieve Mann etc etc etc. The gradients over there aren't any more than you'll see here, the biggest difference is the distance (imagine Sally Gap sitting on top of itself and you're more along the right lines). For example, the Glandon is about 30km or so of fairly constant climbing.

Good luck!

blorg

Just start getting in the mountain miles here. As Tiny says the Alps are just longer. The road surfaces are better over there which makes it easier. Need to learn to pace yourself.

Diarmuid

You're not mad but it will be challenging. However as a first sportive I'd recommend something easier. The Marmotte is probably the toughest one out there. You'll be climbing over 5000m in one day which is nothing to be sneezed at. Don't want to put you off but just be aware there are loads of sportives on the continent so look around before you decide to go with La Marmotte. Here's a list of a few more in France.

I guess when you don't have mountains like that you'll have to simulate them, which means cycling hard into the wind or cycling hard on the flat for extended periods of time.

I did a few other sportives this year and there is a definite learning curve involved. You'll make mistakes in the first few and improve as time goes on so if you can get yourself into an Irish sportive or race beforehand it would definitely stand to you in La Marmotte.

blorg

What Diarmuid says is very to the point, I had done a fair few Irish sportives and a lot of cycling in Wicklow before trying the Pyrenees and Alps this autumn, and now have the Marmotte lined up for next year. The main jist of my post is that I think it is possible to train for these climbs in Wicklow, the hills are shorter but you can just do more of them.

Raam

OP, I say go for it if you really want to. It will be a fantastic experience. All the guys advice is sound. There's plenty of time to train, if you start now.

paddy's hill

Agree with what has been said, you have lots of time to train, the more the better. I don't think it matters if you ride mountains in Ireland or not as long as you ride and get fit, flat roads are just as good. The climbs are so different to any in Ireland and as has been said it is not the steepness but the length and altitude that is the killer. Train hard and go for it. The Marmot is great fun and the personal satisfaction when you finish is great.

TinyExplosions

I'm not sure if I'm taking paddy's hill up wrong (oo-er!), but I didn't find the altitude to be a factor when we were over there, just the length of the climbs.

It would also be a good idea to enter a few of the Irish events as part of your training, there are plenty to try from the Wicklow 200, to the Mount Leinster Challenge, the Mick Byrne 200 etc etc -get in a few of those and you'll be ok.

When actually doing the Marmotte, don't forget to leave something in the tank for the Alpe D'Huez -it's gonna be tough after 170k, even with the considerable recovery time on the descent from the Galibier (about 30-40k of downhill!)

blorg

I would disagree with Paddy on the not necessary to ride mountains, I think riding up gradients and lots of them is going to be pretty essential before attempting the Marmotte. I didn't find the altitude to be a major factor but different people have different sensitivities to this. I did find breathing maybe got a bit dry and my nose ran a bit.

niceonetom

blorg wrote: »

I did find breathing maybe got a bit dry and my nose ran a bit.

me too. i got a sore dry throat after the first major exertion (l'alpe itself (thud)) and it never went away the rest of the stay - i put it down to the altitude. that said i didn't find the altitude had a huge effect on effort, except on galibier (thud) where it seemed to take a bit longer than usual for the heart-rate to normalise at the top.

OP - of all the sportives to pick... the marmotte. really?

ok, well i'm mad too then. getting fit enough is doable, but in the same way that eating an elephant is doable. i don't know what your current level of fitness is, but in order to survive up these VERY long climbs you need to be able to stay aerobic, so heavy cardio training has to be done. i suppose you could do this on the flat if you can push yourself hard enough but ideally you should be heading down to wicklow and beating yourself up the sally gap etc. as often as possible. are you familiar with the saturday spin? do a quick search here.

I cycled up to Glencree last summer via Kilakee road, and i found it tough.

it should be tough if you're trying to get fitter. just keep doing it. climbing is mental as well as physical and you can only really practice climbing by climbing. the same is even more true about descending which is a big part of it too.

the second element of it is endurance - as spring comes mileage comes too. even without the MASSIVE mountains, the marmotte is a long way to pedal, and to prepare for it you'll have to get comfortable with regular long spins of maybe 150k. best done with a group unless you love tedium.

if you're overweight start dieting, luggage is a killer on the way up. i intend to be a stone lighter by next summer - and i don't have a whole lot to begin with.

make sure your bike has enough low gearing - a triple or a compact with a big cassette.

sorry, if i'm telling you stuff you already know OP, i'm partially remeasuring myself too. :P

lastly i'll say this - the alpes are almost certainly the most beautiful place i have ever been. riding those passes, over the paint of last year's tour, and getting to the top feels magnificent. if you are prepared to put some work in the returns are more than worth it. good luck.

DirkVoodoo

Guys, did you find there were any altitude effects, lack of oxygen mainly, when doing the Alpes? I mean, doing lots of climbs here is one thing, but do I need to start sleeping in a hypobaric chamber?

TinyExplosions

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

Guys, did you find there were any altitude effects, lack of oxygen mainly, when doing the Alpes? I mean, doing lots of climbs here is one thing, but do I need to start sleeping in a hypobaric chamber?

I didn't notice any, other than the cold

Maybe *slightly* short of breath, but that could be the climbing more than the altitude

blorg

Nothing serious. I don't know if it varies by the season mind, might be a different story trying to pant up in 30+ degrees.

Diarmuid

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

Guys, did you find there were any altitude effects, lack of oxygen mainly, when doing the Alpes? I mean, doing lots of climbs here is one thing, but do I need to start sleeping in a hypobaric chamber?

When you just cycling up around 2000 and then heading straight down you are going to be suffering enough already that you'll barely notice being short of breath Real altitude sickness would require you to be spending over 15hrs at 2000+. The real problems will more likely be the cold and wind.

EDIT: The biggest impact on your climbing (after training) will be losing weight. However if you are training right the latter will come naturally. The last few kgs are really tough though. That's where you have to start watching what you eat.

TinyExplosions

Diarmuid wrote: »

EDIT: The biggest impact on your climbing (after training) will be losing weight. However if you are training right the latter will come naturally. The last few kgs are really tough though. That's where you have to start watching what you eat.

Yup, that's what I'm working on now.... I want to be a svelte (for me) 80kg by the time the Marmotte comes round -only 12.5kg to go!

sy

blorg wrote: »

.... might be a different story trying to pant up in 30+ degrees.

This will be a major factor if you are unlucky enough to have a scorcher. Alpe d'Huez and Co. are a different kettle of fish in July, especially the first few km when that scorching heat just bounces off the rock face. Will never forget my first ascent about 18 years ago! 37 C. Couldn't wait to gain altitude just to cool my core temperature. Has to be experienced to be believed. ( I was pretty fit too at the time )Search for the thread sumbitted by Quigs Snr re his Etape exploits a few years back(I think) Great read and insightful. Would love to head over there to do the Marmotte with you lot next year but not sure if I can get enough kms in the legs. Will be in France for most of the summer so will make contact or hopefully see you before then. A lesser challenge would be the Etape as I would love to ride the Ventoux again. Scary mountain.
@ 07Lapierre All the advice given on this thread is excellent ( except mine! it wont be too hot on the day:P) Good luck with the formidable challenge, and go for it.

stopped_clock

How does one go about entering the Marmotte?

Or French sportives in general?

** Edited after a bit of Googling **

Looks like entries open today. The website appears to be here but I'm getting an error message so I'm open to correction.

paddy's hill

I was not saying don't ride mountains in Ireland as training, you should because much of climbing and descending is technique and this must be practiced.

I don't know of any climbs in Ireland over 10km. If you ride at 20kph that’s half an hour of climbing followed by the decent. I think for general fitness that riding at a hard steady pace on flat roads for 1 to 2 hours would be better training for stamina which is essential in the Alps. If riding at the same 20kph the Col de la Croix de Fer is 1 and a half hours of hard effort.

As for altitude, Diarmuid is right you would have to spend a long time at altitude before it would make you really sick. However there are 2 different issues with altitude, first the effects of altitude sickness as Blorg described are mild discomfort compared to the cycling itself. But the second one is much more serious for a cyclist and that is the levels of oxygen in the air.
Everyone agrees that the length of the climbs in the Alps is the big issue. I would contend that this is absolutely true from a psychological point of view. The climb is very long therefore it is very tiring. But the longer the climb the higher the altitude by the finish, the higher the altitude the less oxygen, therefore along with the psychological effect there is a very real physiological effect.

1300m is where the effect will start and it is accelerated above 2100m. The percentage saturation of haemoglobin with oxygen determines the content of oxygen in our blood. After the body reaches around 2100m above sea level, the saturation of oxyhemoglobin begins to plummet. The lower amounts of oxygen mean an increase of breathing and heart rate and consequently more dehydration and fatigue. On average your VO2max will decrease by 1% for every 100m of altitude gain, so your cardiovascular system will be 15 to 20% less efficient on the last few kilometres of Galibier than on the Sally Gap.

http://www.cptips.com/altitud.htm

http://www.altitude.org/calculators/altitudefacts/altitudefacts.htm

07Lapierre

Thanke everyone for all your advise and recommendations. You've motivated me to go for it! cheers