Good Test Match Refs...

ThomasH

Who do you think is/was a good ref ?

I was looking back at referee performances over past few years and especially WC07 and boy it was a bit dissapointing. Maybe it's to do with rule changes, attitudes, I really don't know.....

BUT I think one referee who has always been consistently good and who I have huge respect for was Derek Bevan from Wales.

He was fair too both sides, gave equal penalties, never biased, never made stupid/obvious mistakes and was never aggressive to the players.

I think he has the record for most test matches

Marshy

Well I think Alain Rolland is up there with the best, as seen by the fact he was given the WC final last year.

I think Nigel Owens is quite good too, certainly good from a Munster perspective! But no, there's not too many that stand out, particularly from the southern hemisphere.

Stev_o

Marshy wrote: »

Well I think Alain Rolland is up there with the best, as seen by the fact he was given the WC final last year.

I think Nigel Owens is quite good too, certainly good from a Munster perspective! But no, there's not too many that stand out, particularly from the southern hemisphere.

Rolland is fairly poor at international level tbh, Nigel Owens at present hasnt got to terms with the ELV's and allows players to go off their feet for the whole match.

I like Alan Lewis though.

Anyway one apart from Christoph Berdos will do though he's a shocking ref and even the BBC website said so openly!

bleg

lewis rolland and chris white are the 3 best in my opinion. they're usually fair, don't miss much and very rarely get in the way of play

Stev_o

bleg wrote: »

lewis rolland and chris white are the 3 best in my opinion. they're usually fair, don't miss much and very rarely get in the way of play

Rolland can tend to get one sided alot especially against England thought he handled the game unfairly at the breakdown where McCaw was given a free day to roam and give away as much penaltys as needed and didnt need to fear getting carded.

Lewis and White are probably the best but it doesnt say much as both of their flaws.

Snickers Man

Stev_o wrote: »

Rolland is fairly poor at international level tbh, Nigel Owens at present hasnt got to terms with the ELV's and allows players to go off their feet for the whole match.

I like Alan Lewis though.

Heh heh. You're obviously not Australian. They're blaming him for their defeat against Wales. Have a look at their discussion boards. He's public enemy no 1 down there right now.

Stev_o

Snickers Man wrote: »

Heh heh. You're obviously not Australian. They're blaming him for their defeat against Wales. Have a look at their discussion boards. He's public enemy no 1 down there right now.

Id say he's not popular with SF as well but meh, find me one referee that isnt slated by countries for their looses.

sm.org

Without doubt my least favorite would be Steve Walsh utter egomaniac and a cock to boot.

RuggieBear

lewis, rolland, white and Owens are the best imo but they are all prone to having shockers.

themont85

I always thought most of the Irish ones were okay-Alan Rolland, Alan Lewis and Donal Courtney(before the shocking decision in 07). Not a big Chris White fan at the start but at this stage he's probably the best out there.

corny

Don't like Kaplin or Steve Walsh. I think Wayne Barnes isn't bad despite being hated by NZ'ers.

g5fd6ow0hseima

Joel Jutge (or whoever his surname is spelled) was always a favourite of mine, although I dont know if he is still reffing this season.

Jonaton Kaplan is another good'n in my opinion.

toomevara

The best test match referee I've ever seen was Wales' Clive Norling. Absolutely brilliant, fantastic feel for a game and a brilliant relationship with players on the field. Never reffed to the letter of the law, always read the ebb and flow of a game. An absolute reffing genius, no one's ever come close, professional or not.

Tim Robbins

Marshy wrote: »

Well I think Alain Rolland is up there with the best, as seen by the fact he was given the WC final last year.

I think Nigel Owens is quite good too, certainly good from a Munster perspective! But no, there's not too many that stand out, particularly from the southern hemisphere.

Agree. Rolland, Owens are both very good. The Aussie refs are also usually very good.

I think that fans can be a bit unfair in their judegment of refs. The "off the feet" thing is better understood by refs than fans.

Refs won't blow for every offense it depends on materiality (did that offside make any difference?), intentionality (did he intend to go off his feet or did he just fall?) and other patterns in the game (I warned the SH about throwing it in correctly). There is a little bit of subjectivity in it, but there's not as much as people think. The biggest difference between refs is actually communication (how they communicate at the breakdown and to captains during downtime) and positioning.

Tim Robbins

Charleigh Long Ledge wrote: »

Joel Jutge (or whoever his surname is spelled) was always a favourite of mine, although I dont know if he is still reffing this season.

IMO he interpretated a ruck beginning very quickly and used to ping a lot for hands in the ruck, whereas other refs wouldn't have.

Hammered Leinster a few times for this.

Webbs

toomevara wrote: »

The best test match referee I've ever seen was Wales' Clive Norling. Absolutely brilliant, fantastic feel for a game and a brilliant relationship with players on the field. Never reffed to the letter of the law, always read the ebb and flow of a game. An absolute reffing genius, no one's ever come close, professional or not.

Couldnt agree more Norling was the most impartial ref with a real players view of the game I have ever seen, Its been said on more than one occasion that players would have been happy if he had reffed a Wales game as they knew he would be impartial.
He was that great type of ref that you didnt notice until the game had finished and he invariably was in the middle for a great game of rugby.

He also came out with the great quote on seeing the headstone of Thomas Williams Griffiths that read ''Here lies and honest man and a referee'' Norling says 'so that proves we can bury two men in the same grave in Wales'

twinytwo

Stev_o wrote: »

Rolland can tend to get one sided alot especially against England thought he handled the game unfairly at the breakdown where McCaw was given a free day to roam and give away as much penaltys as needed and didnt need to fear getting carded.

Lewis and White are probably the best but it doesnt say much as both of their flaws.

he seems to gewt away with that no matter who the ref is... they must be afraid of him or something

Serenity Now!

Webbs wrote: »

Couldnt agree more Norling was the most impartial ref with a real players view of the game I have ever seen

Webbs wrote: »

He was that great type of ref that you didnt notice until the game had finished and he invariably was in the middle for a great game of rugby

I nearly had coffee coming out of my nose there from laughing so hard! This greatness of Norling is a myth, in my opinion. The guy was nowhere near fit enough to cover the ground required and missed craploads.
I don't even mind his egotism (unnoticed on the field, he most certainly was not!).

Best ref I've ever seen in games was the late great, Kerry Fitzgerald from Australia. He died in the early 90s. A professional ref in an amateur era. David Bishop from NZ wasn't far behind.

For what they do, I think today's referees are doing a great job.
What the IRB need to encourage, in my view, is more fulltime referees. As far as I can think of, Steve Walsh is the only fulltime referee on the circuit. All the others are part-timers. Rolland and Kaplan (who is the first Jewish referee at Croke Park ever - here endeth useless fact #21355) are quite similar disciplinarians and in this day and age, they're needed.
All refs make bloopers. You can't be everywhere at once.
Ireland is doing very well with refs at the mo. Rolland and Lewie leading. George Clancy stepping up. Peter Fitzgibbon making his intl debut in november. John Lacey and Michael Black now getting Magners League level postings. Dave Keane on the intl 7s. Aoife McCarthy in the 7s Womens.

To those who call refs cheats/sh*te/whatever, its all very easy to sit up in the stands or on the sofa yelling at the ref when you see something awry on-field but until you've tried it yourself, I say shut the heckety-yack up!

Webbs

Serenity Now! wrote: »

I nearly had coffee coming out of my nose there from laughing so hard! This greatness of Norling is a myth, in my opinion. The guy was nowhere near fit enough to cover the ground required and missed craploads.
I don't even mind his egotism (unnoticed on the field, he most certainly was not!).

I'll admit that what I meant when he was unnoticed was that his decision making wasnt questioned as far as bias went. He had a splendidly big ego to go with the 'tache but seemed to have the knack of getting the players on his side and yes at the end of his career I can remember thinking that a few too many pies had been consumed to keep up with play. But watching games with him in charge were fair rarely dull encounters and thats what we want from a ref isnt it?

Pinetree Boy

Webbs wrote: »

Couldnt agree more Norling was the most impartial ref with a real players view of the game I have ever seen, Its been said on more than one occasion that players would have been happy if he had reffed a Wales game as they knew he would be impartial.
He was that great type of ref that you didnt notice until the game had finished and he invariably was in the middle for a great game of rugby.

He also came out with the great quote on seeing the headstone of Thomas Williams Griffiths that read ''Here lies and honest man and a referee'' Norling says 'so that proves we can bury two men in the same grave in Wales'

plus one. Norling seemed to understand the ebb and flow of the game, particularly upfront. Unlike todays crop he knew the crowd wasn't there to watch him.