BOXER's unique channels

Elmo

As I have said from the out set I don't really want Pay TV or any of the channels that they have proposed. I think it is a waste, when most of those channels can already be pick up for free on sat. If you want them get a Sat or pay.

But the BCI has issued the license to a pay service so that is what we are left with.

What are boxers unique channels???? Those "unique" channels will want to be on Sky and UPC regardless, boxer wouldn't give them enough custom, unless they where FTA DTT and even then they wouldn't want to just be on the Boxer Network. (I cann't imagine C6, City Channel, MiTV and other channels wanting to just be on Boxer, well I cann't imagine MiTV lasting being only available online and via Magnet).

Prehaps boxer wants to have unique top up services. A box-office service provided by boxer, a movie service provided by boxer etc. rather then trying to get Sky Movies. However this option makes them content provides which they said they weren't going to be!!!! (Bar all of CommuniCorps radio services that is).

I don't see Boxer going with a FTA system and I can't see them getting "unique" channels.

Perhaps they want BBC Ireland which might carry adds, rather then Dave etc.

Thanks byte for closing the last thread but I was replying when you did it !!!! BTW I will bring it back, waiting for it to get into the news, you will be glad to hear

Also I don't believe that this is even being thought about, I have heard no news about it only from boards so I will want proof.

DTTfan

Information not available at this time

Elmo

TBH Lusy Gafney hasn't impressed me at all. I really don't know how she has been so successful.

A unique offering could only come in as a FTA system providing Irish Content, but even then that Irish content would have to be carried by Sky and UPC to actually gain any kind of viewing figures.

Unique pay channel in Ireland won't work because 1. You need the subscriber base which Ireland doesn't have and 2. The channels would be left trying to get advertisers for channels no one is watching or subscribing to.

Yes Boxer Box-Office could work as could a Boxer Movie channel but they are the higher end of the subscription market not the lower end.

UPC and Sky could go down the unique root but they are already set up and would still be carrying all of their non-unique channels.

Once boxer start talking to Sky and Setanta they will change their minds.

I suppose they could get away with out having to have C6, Bubble Hits, Living TV but they will need to 4 main British DTT channels, but the above argument remains. But even if they go with unique channels they would have to be far better then the type of channels that we currently get from multichannel land (bar the 4 main British services) and even then they are going to have to eventually let those new channel go on to their competitor networks. Living TV V a Living TV like service, that really isn't unique.

They are trying to be monopolistic.

Elmo

So this has got me thinking

They could do it:-

1. They would have to do a deal for exclusive right in ROI for a group of channels such as UKTV's set. (Unlikely)
2. Provide there customers with a free box (they could charge for this later) and a FTA card for BBC1, BBC2, UTV and C4, free for life.
3. Additional channels cost X and they are the UKTV set of exclusive channels not available on UPC, magnet etc. (I can't see them getting anything exclusive from sky)

DTTfan

This topic has ended

channelsurfer

ok confused now....... was it all hearsay really??? no word on boxer signing contracts with the BCI yet though.. must be draggin on.

watty

UPC's Digital service has all the channels too, effectively. You can do about 99.7% of viewing desire with less than 50 channels. You can do 75% with 14 Channels and about 95% with about 25 channels.

a lot of channels on Satellite have 0.001% viewing figures!

I've analysed UK & Ireland BARB and Nielsen reports.
Only the RTE / PSB mux will be free on DTT unless Boxer pulls out (RTE x6 chs, TV3 TG4).

Elmo

watty wrote: »

Only the RTE / PSB mux will be free on DTT unless Boxer pulls out (RTE x6 chs, TV3 TG4).

And all the extra PBS channels will want to be on Sky, UPC etc. So they won't be unique.

In honesty if this is the case CC are talking through their arse.

TheDriver

on a side topic, has anyone noticed TV3 showing a lot of C6 ads lately (i know they own them!) but seems like they are trying to do an ITV2 on it, even down to I'm a celecbrity extras on C6. Wonder will they start to push to get C6 on PSB side of things

SPDUB

TheDriver wrote: »

on a side topic, has anyone noticed TV3 showing a lot of C6 ads lately (i know they own them!) but seems like they are trying to do an ITV2 on it, even down to I'm a celecbrity extras on C6. Wonder will they start to push to get C6 on PSB side of things

I first spotted the celebrity extras when I was looking through a TV guide and I spotted C6 showing ads for TV3 news when I was watching some programmes on C6

Elmo

TheDriver wrote: »

on a side topic, has anyone noticed TV3 showing a lot of C6 ads lately (i know they own them!) but seems like they are trying to do an ITV2 on it, even down to I'm a celecbrity extras on C6. Wonder will they start to push to get C6 on PSB side of things

As long as the BCI got the terms and conditions of the new TV3/C6 contract correct I don't see C6 becoming a PSB just because they are showing I'm A Celeb and repeats of the Apprentice.

Such as an increase in Prime Time programming outside of the Sound and Vision fund programmes and an increase in new talent, new ideas with a range of genre including drama.

It would also cost C6 more to be on the PBS mux, I wouldn't say the spend anything on Sky or UPC.

John Dough

Sky or UPC do nothing for nothing ,what we all want is RTE /TV3/C6 FTA on Satellite and they can stick Boxer!!!!

Elmo

John Dough wrote: »

Sky or UPC do nothing for nothing ,what we all want is RTE /TV3/C6 FTA on Satellite and they can stick Boxer!!!!

Whatever about getting RTE or TG4 FTA on Satellite it is unlike that TV3 or Channel 6 will be ever be FTA on Satellite.

But if that was to happen you are right to suggest that it wouldn't look good for Boxer.

Anyway the more I hear the less faith I have in an actual Pay alternative to UPC or Sky.

zilog_jones

Does anyone know how popular Top Up TV is in the UK? I know it's not a proper subscription TV service but it's the closest they've got to what Boxer will offer here, and cable isn't as widespread over there (MMDS is non-existant) so it might seem as a more viable alternative to some there.

bk

zilog_jones wrote: »

Does anyone know how popular Top Up TV is in the UK? I know it's not a proper subscription TV service but it's the closest they've got to what Boxer will offer here, and cable isn't as widespread over there (MMDS is non-existant) so it might seem as a more viable alternative to some there.

It is almost a complete failure. Of the 10 million + homes with Freeview*, only 300,000 subscribe to Top Up TV, this is down a 100,000 from 400,000 they had at the start of 2008. They have lost 25% of their customers in about 6 months!!!

Or to put it another way they have about 3% of the Freeview market and about 1% of all homes in the UK.

If that figure was to hold for boxer, it would translate into 15,000 subscribers (at 1%) or 45,000 subs at 3% and frankly I don't expect them to do much better then that.

* Freeview is now the number one TV platform in the UK, with over double the market Sky has.

This shows just how successful, Freeview has been in the UK, in bringing affordable competition to the market, of course we will see nothing like that here.

Elmo

bk wrote: »

If that figure was to hold for boxer, it would translate into 15,000 subscribers (at 1%) or 45,000 subs at 3% and frankly I don't expect them to do much better then that.

And to be even less positive, that 15,000 - 45,000 subs that they could get will only be gained by going into areas where satellite and cable subscription is at its lowest i.e. the areas of the country that won't be covered in the initinal role out.

channelsurfer

I can just imagine the boxer sales reps going house to house.... oh yes you will loose your signal if you dont sign up with us.. we will give you a free box and provide you with bbc utv etc for 9.99.... not a word about rte being fta or the option of buying a box yourself...
where on earth are boxer going to get 150,000 subscribers from by 2014 or so as their application stated???

STB

channelsurfer wrote: »

I can just imagine the boxer sales reps going house to house.... oh yes you will loose your signal if you dont sign up with us.. we will give you a free box and provide you with bbc utv etc for 9.99.... not a word about rte being fta or the option of buying a box yourself...

You mean a bit like the tactics apparently being used at present by certain "approved" satellite installers on behalf of a certain company. Scare the bejaysus out of the vulnerable to sell your product.

I love Elmo's posts, so imaginative.

Elmo

STB wrote: »

I love Elmo's posts, so imaginative.

I don't know if I should take that as a compliment, Since the begin of this post is me arguing for and againist a stupid Idea. I blame Lusy Gaffney.

recursieve

could their plan possibly be to sell a dtt box with freesat integrated?

Fat_Fingers

I cant see them doing that. Why promote someone's else product for free that is also much better then your own offering.

STB

Well that has to be post of the year. :pac:

First post too.

TheDriver

+1!! Freesat cannot be promoted in ROI due to contractual issues and also why promote free channels that you want to sell!!

Elmo

TheDriver wrote: »

+1!! Freesat cannot be promoted in ROI due to contractual issues and also why promote free channels that you want to sell!!

A type of Freesat is already being promoted across shops and business around Dublin.

If boxer can provided Intergrated Freesat channels plus 20more pay TV including Sky and Setanta plus the Irish Channel their Unique offerings could become a reality. Perhaps, but thats my imagination get out of hand. :cool:

recursieve

could the reason behind wanting unique subscription channels be to compliment, rather than duplicate the digital free to view satellite and terrestrial channel mix they will be providing?

Elmo

recursieve wrote: »

could the reason behind wanting unique subscription channels be to compliment, rather than duplicate the digital free to view satellite and terrestrial channel mix they will be providing?

We can only wish! I don't think Lucy Gaffney even knows what FreeSat is

watty

What Unique offering?

Every Tesco has Freesat and all Maplin and B&Q has FTA sat boxes nationwide. Boxer is not going to do any joint offering with any kind of sat box as it would kill them. Simpler to get Sat + DTT free, or Sat only from Sky. If Boxer does anything much at all Sky can do an €8.50 pack that has more pay channels and the 4 Irish TV channels. As well as all the free ones.

Elmo

watty wrote: »

What Unique offering?

Every Tesco has Freesat and all Maplin and B&Q has FTA sat boxes nationwide. Boxer is not going to do any joint offering with any kind of sat box as it would kill them. Simpler to get Sat + DTT free, or Sat only from Sky. If Boxer does anything much at all Sky can do an €8.50 pack that has more pay channels and the 4 Irish TV channels. As well as all the free ones.

Boxer 1, Boxer 2, Boxer Sports 1, Boxer Sports 2, Boxer Live, Eboxer, Living Boxer, Dave the Boxer, Bravo Boxer, Boxer 1 +1, Boxer Office, Boxer On Demand, Boxer Now, Business Boxer, Boxer News, Boxer International, Boxer Tonight, Children Boxer, Natural Boxer, The Boxer Movie Channel, Boxer Classics.

Charles Slane

Elmo wrote: »

Dave the Boxer

Excellent!

PauloMN

Elmo wrote: »

Boxer 1, Boxer 2, Boxer Sports 1, Boxer Sports 2, Boxer Live, Eboxer, Living Boxer, Dave the Boxer, Bravo Boxer, Boxer 1 +1, Boxer Office, Boxer On Demand, Boxer Now, Business Boxer, Boxer News, Boxer International, Boxer Tonight, Children Boxer, Natural Boxer, The Boxer Movie Channel, Boxer Classics.

Can I add More Boxer, Boxers and Motors, Bóxer Na Gaeilge and Boxer Toons to that package please?

Elmo

They each come with Boxer Arts and EuroBoxer, for our more cultured audiences.

watty

recursieve wrote: »

could their plan possibly be to sell a dtt box with freesat integrated?

Only if they want to had all their customers to Sky and lose a lot of money. The most expensive part of Satellite is the Dish Install. The main reason to have terrestrial is to avoid a Dish. Some people don't want them. Those people often don't want Pay TV either, which doesn't help Boxer.

channelsurfer

Elmo wrote: »

Boxer 1, Boxer 2, Boxer Sports 1, Boxer Sports 2, Boxer Live, Eboxer, Living Boxer, Dave the Boxer, Bravo Boxer, Boxer 1 +1, Boxer Office, Boxer On Demand, Boxer Now, Business Boxer, Boxer News, Boxer International, Boxer Tonight, Children Boxer, Natural Boxer, The Boxer Movie Channel, Boxer Classics.

very good. and maybe it wont be quite far off the mark. boxer sports where we are the only channel you can watch live premier league matches!!! all we need is 80million sterling(the rumored price sky and setanta paid for irish rights only) to the premier league.

Fat_Fingers

Elmo wrote: »

Boxer 1, Boxer 2, Boxer Sports 1, Boxer Sports 2, Boxer Live, Eboxer, Living Boxer, Dave the Boxer, Bravo Boxer, Boxer 1 +1, Boxer Office, Boxer On Demand, Boxer Now, Business Boxer, Boxer News, Boxer International, Boxer Tonight, Children Boxer, Natural Boxer, The Boxer Movie Channel, Boxer Classics.

Thehehehe, classic ! You forgot to mention BoxerQVC, Boxer BidTV, Boxer Babestation, Boxer Northern Birds...

recursieve

watty wrote: »

Only if they want to had all their customers to Sky and lose a lot of money. The most expensive part of Satellite is the Dish Install. The main reason to have terrestrial is to avoid a Dish. Some people don't want them. Those people often don't want Pay TV either, which doesn't help Boxer.

Good point. If you were in Boxer's position what would you do?

Fat_Fingers

Whoa , dont ask him that! :eek::D If you search for watty's proposal for new satellite receiver you'll see where that venture would go! :D

On the serious note i cant see them providing anything "unique" but they can hoover up customers if they provide mixture of entertainment, sport and lifestyle that is better priced then NTL\Chorus and if they offer more flexible contract then NTL\Chorus.
I think their main market will be apartment dwellers who dont want to pay NTL for "extra" channels
and can not get their own dish (not allowed to erect the dish in the apartment blocks)

bk

recursieve wrote: »

Good point. If you were in Boxer's position what would you do?

Fold up and go home, give the spectrum back to RTE, Boxer service won't be successful.

Fat_Fingers wrote:

On the serious note i cant see them providing anything "unique" but they can hoover up customers if they provide mixture of entertainment, sport and lifestyle that is better priced then NTL\Chorus and if they offer more flexible contract then NTL\Chorus.
I think their main market will be apartment dwellers who dont want to pay NTL for "extra" channels
and can not get their own dish (not allowed to erect the dish in the apartment blocks)

The problem Boxer face is that both UPC and Sky will likely undercut any package Boxer introduce and offer more channels.

Right off the bat, UPC already undercut Boxers full package. Boxer had proposed as part of their bid, 20 channels for €23, UPC already offer 40 channels (including all of Boxers channels) for €20.

Who would pay €3 more for half the channels? Definitely not apartment dwellers. Also another benefit of UPC for apartment dwellers is you get free analogue multi room and potentially very competitive BB.

BTW Sky seem to be busy installing their Sky in your apartment, communal dish service in many apartments. 3 Sky vans have been parked outside my apartment building for the last four weeks as they wired up every apartment, even if they signed up for Sky or not

Fat_Fingers

thats why i was saying IF they have competitive price structure

TheDriver

after seeing rte last night and complaints about upc, think some apartment dwellers won't want to touch upc no matter how cheap they will be hence could be a good time to be with boxer even if its not as cheap

Elmo

TheDriver wrote: »

after seeing rte last night and complaints about upc, think some apartment dwellers won't want to touch upc no matter how cheap they will be hence could be a good time to be with boxer even if its not as cheap

Won't boxer have to install Aerials on the tops of roofs around the country? I know some Houses in build up areas won't require an outdoor aerial but the majority of people in Apartments and the Countryside may all have to install outdoor aerials for good reception. Apartments will also have to be fitted with cable to reach to the roof.

bk

TheDriver wrote: »

after seeing rte last night and complaints about upc, think some apartment dwellers won't want to touch upc no matter how cheap they will be hence could be a good time to be with boxer even if its not as cheap

In my experience with UPC, when it works, it just works fine. You only run into problems when you have to call support.

From what I've seen, most of the problems are with the analogue service and to a lesser extent the BB service, the digital service works fine.

I've seen the same complaints about Sky support and support from just about every other ISP, I've little doubt boxer will have the same or worse support issues (specially due to reception problems).

Elmo wrote:

Won't boxer have to install Aerials on the tops of roofs around the country?

In rural areas yes, in urban areas including apartments, you should be able to get away with rabbit ears. However even that can be a problem, I don't see many folks with nice fancy apartments and fancy big screen TV's being happy with ugly rabbit ears hanging off it.

Elmo

bk wrote: »

In my experience with UPC, when it works, it just works fine. You only run into problems when you have to call support.

From what I've seen, most of the problems are with the analogue service and to a lesser extent the BB service, the digital service works fine.

I've seen the same complaints about Sky support and support from just about every other ISP, I've little doubt boxer will have the same or worse support issues (specially due to reception problems).

Have to agree with you on UPC, I haven't had any issues with them over the years, never had cause to ring them about their service.

Never had a prob with their Broadband. Analogue C4, Discovery and E4 <<< the usual 3 cause problems.

They should start switching off most of their analogue services IMO.

channelsurfer

http://www.boxer.se/?page=1365

i see boxers website still says they will launch in january. yipee only another couple of days till january.........i wont hold my breath. I dont think they have even signed the agreement with the BCI yet.

Elmo

channelsurfer wrote: »

http://www.boxer.se/?page=1365

i see boxers website still says they will launch in january. yipee only another couple of days till january.........i wont hold my breath. I dont think they have even signed the agreement with the BCI yet.

Jan 31st they have a month. I am guessing they plan to launch in Dublin First!!!

The Cush

Jan launch is a not going to happen and its website hasn't been updated since the contract award was announced in Jul, also the ownership information of Boxer TV Access AB in Sweden is not yet updated - Teracom sole owner since Nov.
And of course no word of a signature on the multiplex contracts.

http://www.independent.ie/business/media/obrien-group-told-january-dtt-launch-is-a-fantasy-1444310.html

O'Brien group told January DTT launch is a 'fantasy'
By Laura Noonan
Friday August 01 2008

DENIS O'Brien's €165m play for Ireland's paid-TV market is facing delays of up to nine months, the Irish Independent has learned.

Mr O'Brien's Communicorp group recently got the green light to offer paid-for TV services on the Digital Terrestrial Television (DTT) platform that will soon replace traditional "rabbit ears" analogue services.

Celebrating the win two weeks ago, Mr O'Brien's Boxer DTT consortium promised to roll out commercial DTT in early 2009, mooting a January launch.

But yesterday it emerged that the network for DTT won't be "reliable" until "June at the earliest", making a January launch a "fantasy".

Blow

And in a further blow to Boxer DTT's timeline, Communications Minister Eamon Ryan yesterday said he expected commercial DTT to launch "in tandem" with public service DTT, which is due to be launched by RTE in October 2009.

Communicorp yesterday declined to comment on the potential timeline delays, and it is understood the Boxer DTT group has yet to begin formal discussions with either the minister or RTE's network division, which controls the DTT infrastructure. Sources close to Communicorp, however, said the company would take a "commercial sensible approach" to the project.

"We're not going to be clashing with the minister or RTE on it, we have to work together," said one source.

"We'd like to launch early in the year, RTE would like to launch late, hopefully we can meet somewhere in the middle."

Network

Sources at RTE, however, said the network simply wouldn't be ready in time for an earlier launch.

"Doing something in January is a fantasy because the network just won't be there," one source said.

"You could launch some services in February or March, but they'd be very unreliable. It won't be reliable until July at the earliest.

"We've gone for an October launch because we know it will be reliable by then; to launch any earlier you'd risk giving the whole system a bad name."

Communicorp sources said while they wanted to launch the project "as soon as possible", they wouldn't jeopardise quality for speed.

"We're investing a lot of money in this and once we start the clock starts ticking on that, so we won't start until we're ready," a source said.

A joint venture between Communicorp and Boxer, a Swedish TV group, Boxer DTT has the contract to offer commercial DTT for 12 years from the system's launch.

The group scooped the contract after fighting off competition from two other consortia -- one backed by RTE and cable operator UPC, and another backed by TV3, Setanta, Eircom and UK company Arqiva.

Boxer is planning a €165m investment in the TV platform, and is hoping to secure a peak of 225,000 subscribers and be "cash flow positive" by its third year.

- Laura Noonan

http://archives.tcm.ie/businesspost/2008/08/03/story34827.asp

RTE and Boxer to synchronise
Sunday, August 03, 2008

Communications minister Eamon Ryan wants RTE and commercial digital terrestrial television (DTT) to launch their products at the same time.

He said he wanted the Boxer group’s commercial DTT service and RTE’s free-to-air service to operate off the same set-top box.

This would mean both services would launch in the third quarter of 2009, rather than several months earlier as Boxer had envisaged. Ryan said this made sense, given Boxer’s dependence on the transmission network being developed by RTE NL.

According to the minister, the aim is to have 80 per cent DTT coverage across the country – covering main population areas – by the end of next year. This is designed to coincide with the analogue switch-off in Wales, which will mean that people living on the east coast will no longer be able to access BBC and other British channels on analogue services.

Ryan would not be drawn on his department’s budget for the DTT marketing campaign but said the information campaign would begin in March.

Elmo

channelsurfer wrote: »

very good. and maybe it wont be quite far off the mark. boxer sports where we are the only channel you can watch live premier league matches!!! all we need is 80million sterling(the rumored price sky and setanta paid for irish rights only) to the premier league.

80million ?????? I don't think so some how. I am guessing that the Irish Rights are sold with the British rights.

Ah! over 3 years, 83million.


http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/broadcasting/a33639/setanta-sky-win-irish-premiership-rights.html

Interesting. 200,000 per game!!! Sorry OTT.