Unemployed - in debt

LegacyUser

i am a single male, aged 27. by trade, i am a fully qualified electrician, been working in the business since i was 17, started off doing industrial before moving into construction. three months ago i was laid off. went from nearly 1000eur a week to 185eur dole money. i thought i could get work easy, but that is not to be the case. no one will even talk to me about work ,let alone give me a job. i am now so deep in debt, i dont know what to do. i have a 420k mortgage that hasnt been fully paid in three months. the bank tell me that if i dont settle up witin two weeks they will start legal prodceedings against me. the thing is on the market for over a month now. i dropped the price to 350k but it still wont sell. i have a car loan with 11k on the balance, a personal loan with 19k on the balance and two credit cards with 18k on the balance. the few euro savings i had are now gone. i feel trapped and i dont know what to do. i will never be able to may my debt off. i just sit on my own drinking during the night to try and make the trouble go away.

i dont know what to do. when i get the threatening letters through the door, i just want to die. all i can think of is putting a few things into the car, getting the ferry to england and leaving everything behind.

help:(

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

First thing would be to register with FAS, you may have more of a chance finding a job through them.

Have you seriously thought of moving abroad, there are some countries that are crying out for tradesmen. You could try that. You can still pay off your loans. Probably a huge leap that a lot of people wouldn't be able for, but if you are really desperate.

Ring MABS or go to their website:http://www.mabs.ie

If you are in debt with the credit union or the bank, ring your relationship manager and tell them your situation. They may freeze your loan repayments until you find reployment, or they might reduce the loan repayments to something more affordable. I cannot offer you any advice if you have a mortgage or are leasing your car, business etc etc.

The work is there, it's just extremely hard to get now... Hope things go well for you soon.

Pretttig

Sorry but I don't find it easy to feel sorry for you.

First of all why did you borrow 420k when earning only 1000 p/w? A good wage by most standards but not against an almost 1/2 million borrowing.

Why did you borrow so much when you have already have so many loans?

A lot of people are blaming the banks for reckless borrowing but YOU signed the loan agreement.

You dropped the price but obviously not enough, If I were you I would keep dropping it to its ''true'' value,ie prpbably around 200,000 e and count your blessings.
I may sound harsh but you were sucked in and consequences are a bitch.

I hope you find a job

mikemac

As said talk to MABS

11k balance on a car. Imo, any car you can't buy for cash is a waste of money. Sell your car and buy a banger. Well, I don't mean a banger but there are fine cars around for 1k-2k. They'll do for now.
Have a read of this thread: Bangeronomics
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055396686&highlight=banger

Your house ain't worth 420k and it obviously isn't worth 350k. Possibly it's worth 250k, I wouldn't go as low as Pretttig's estimate..........yet

18K on your credit cards :eek:
What were you doing? Online gambling?
You'll need to clear them asap and possibly see if the credit union will let you combine this with your existing debt. It'd be a tough sell to them though.

On the matter of gambling, a mortgage of over 8 times earnings is a gamble.
Talk to your bank, they will have plently of other customers in your situation and might propose something

dresden8

Get your ass down to the community welfare officer and see what he can do for you.

Talk to MABS

http://www.welfare.ie/EN/Topics/money/Pages/moneyindex.aspx

Sh1t happens and it will be terrible for a while. You'll just have to live with it.

sunnyside

Can I ask how you ran up such high credit card bills? Just curious because with an income of €52,000 you shouldn't need to be paying for living expenses on a credit card.

Rent out the rooms in the house or rent the whole house out and move abroad for a year or two.

I think one the biggest problems for you will be learning to live on a small income. If you have been earning good money since you were 17 and never had unpaid college years you just won't be used to living on a budget. Look at the price tags and do some of your shopping in Aldi for a bit.

Bottle_of_Smoke

I'm assuming the c/cards were business related. convert to a loan, I'm assuming you gotta pay E450 as a minimum payment, and your interest per month would be E240?

Could you rent your house out? There's a link below with a job in cavan, maybe you could rent somewhere cheap there, and get a cheaper car.

http://jobs.ie/ApplyForJob.aspx?Id=878220

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

Pretttig wrote: »

Sorry but I don't find it easy to feel sorry for you.

First of all why did you borrow 420k when earning only 1000 p/w? A good wage by most standards but not against an almost 1/2 million borrowing.

Why did you borrow so much when you have already have so many loans?

A lot of people are blaming the banks for reckless borrowing but YOU signed the loan agreement.

You dropped the price but obviously not enough, If I were you I would keep dropping it to its ''true'' value,ie prpbably around 200,000 e and count your blessings.
I may sound harsh but you were sucked in and consequences are a bitch.

I hope you find a job

Pointless posting what you did and lecturing the OP... You could offer some advice, that's what this forum is for, right? Otherwise I have been posting crap in most peoples threads...

Mr Benevolent

Get a job doing something else, rent out the house, whatever you need to do. And call MABS before it's too late.

tritium

As others have said, talk to MABS and FAS. Consider renting rooms in your house, possibly even the entire house and rent somewhere cheap.

Really you also need to contact the banks and work out a workable repayment plan for mortgage, credit card etc. Most people are terrified by this but in reality banks are usually pretty good - its not in their interests to take a tough approach and they'll try to work something out.

You might also consider working for yourself since you're fully qualified. Unlikely to be easy starting out but FAS could again probably advise you.

Grawns

As an electrician maybe you could look for a job abroad in saudi arabia or somewhere like that, Emirates?. Pays good money and you could rent your house out. You are going to have to work your butt off to get out from under this debt. There's loads of people in the same situstion and sticking your head in the sand seems to be a normal reaction but not the right one. Aren't OZ and Canada always looking for electricians? Emigration is your best bet for now.

Mabs according to a news article a few nights ago have such a long waiting list now for face to face appointments that it could be well into january before they could see the OP.
They will talk to him over the phone though.

Now lets see-where to start.

You are where you are-theres no magic wand.I'd advise the following actions in the following order.

1. Stop worrying-whats the worst that can happen to you? Lose your house? big deal,you can live at home with your folks for a while/brother/sister or a friend.

2.You will have to give up that house.You can't afford it lad and you have no immediate prospect of affording it.Talk to your mortgage bank and see what they want to do.If they want repossession,simply give them the deeds tbh as you don't want the legal fee's.
3.Talk to the credit card companies.Tell them you have lost your job.Come to some interim agreement with them that you will pay them when you can whether that be next year or 2012.
What can they do to you? You have no assets and no ability to repay at the moment.They could go legal but like the mortgage company shur what use is that to them-they may aswell be looking for a stone to pay them.
4.Don't be thinking you want to die or leave the country.You'll get work eventually even if it's not your speciality.
Owning the house isn't the be all and end all.
Owning the car isn't either.
To be be frank and very frank Fcuk that for a lark and fcuk the stress that you are getting yourself into over this unnecessarally.
You relax and let the responsibility of something you cannot have a hope of sorting rest with the banks.
Life is about being well,being good to your friends and family and enjoying yourself.
Believe it or not no matter how much you lose asset wise ,if you follow that motto most people will always like you and believe me when I say this thats what life is about.
If you are reading this,take €20 from your budget tonight and go out with your friends,don't go into rounds,you won't get drunk and just socialise.

Make that mabs appointment too by the way but as I say don't worry about it,please don't.You are where you are and thats that

Marksie

Most posters here have given the best advice already

Fully qualified electrician? Ever thought of advertising for doing jobs large or small, going completely out on your own? as well as looking around?
I am not sure, but isnt there some grant money you can get for setting up your own business?

Victor

Talk to your local community welfare officer (usually based in the local health centre) on Monday - they may be able to help you with mortgage interest allowance.

Rent out as many rooms as you can - under the Rent-a-Room scheme you can earn €10,000 a year (under all headings, rent, bills, food, etc.) tax free.

Cut out the booze - it costs money and clouds you judgement.

Go talk to someone in real life - the phrase "a problem shared is a problem halved" is truer than you think. Friends and family are good for this.

Put your ad. here: http://www.adverts.ie/ and here: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055192947

eth0_

Sorry but I have no sympathy for you.
I think you must have been struggling to pay the bills even before you ended up on the dole. You have a serious problem with spending and budgeting and that existed before you lost your job. There's no way you could have comfortably paid those loans and credit cards along with a 420k mortgage. You say you had savings...you shouldn't have been saving a cent with that sort of debt hanging over you, remember - the interest gained on savings is ALWAYS lower than that lost on debt.

Honestly? Take responsiblity for your bad judgements and file for bankruptcy. You should be able to keep your house and you can rent out rooms under the 'rent a room' scheme which will help pay your mortgage.

With such a large amount of debt I can't see any other option that bankruptcy. Maybe if you didn't have a mortgage it would be a different story.

cooperguy

First thing first. TELL THE BANK, they have all been saying that it is important to tell them as soon as you get into trouble and they will work with you to come to some arrangement i.e. spreading loans over a longer period or freezing repayments or whatever. The last thing the banks want is to have to wright off bad debt. They will help you. DO THAT FIRST THING MONDAY!!! Sooner you do that the better.

Second although the banks will probably tell you do this anyway. Get a loan and pay off any C cards or overdrafts you have. Interest is huge on them and you are completely screwing yourself if you keep that debt in that format.

Darragh29

Pretttig wrote: »

Sorry but I don't find it easy to feel sorry for you.

First of all why did you borrow 420k when earning only 1000 p/w? A good wage by most standards but not against an almost 1/2 million borrowing.

Why did you borrow so much when you have already have so many loans?

A lot of people are blaming the banks for reckless borrowing but YOU signed the loan agreement.

You dropped the price but obviously not enough, If I were you I would keep dropping it to its ''true'' value,ie prpbably around 200,000 e and count your blessings.
I may sound harsh but you were sucked in and consequences are a bitch.

I hope you find a job

Don't think your helping, I suppose it isn't within the world of possibilities that unemployment can come visiting your door??? OP, it's not that bad at all. At the end of the day, it's only money. If the banks take legal proceedings against you, you'll have time to sort out your affairs. Try to get on top of the mortgage arrears anyway, you're only 3 months behind which isn't the end of the world and easily resolvable if you have an income.

mikemac

Darragh29 wrote: »

you're only 3 months behind which isn't the end of the world and easily resolvable if you have an income.

I don't know about this "only 3 months behind". Miss three months in a row and the loan is automatically in default.
It doesn't mean you can't work out a solution with the bank, you can.

But you have defaulted the loan so it is a big deal

eth0_

Darragh29 wrote: »

Don't think your helping, I suppose it isn't within the world of possibilities that unemployment can come visiting your door???

This isn't just about unemployment. The OP has clearly had his head in the sand for a long time, borrowing irresponsibly left right and centre, getting a mortgage on his own worth ten times his salary.

Also, you clearly don't know much about finance - a lot of banks will move to repossession proceedings after 3 missed payments. In the UK they've started doing it after one or two missed payments.

dny123456

Actually have a lot of sympathy for the OP. I'm not quite sure why, but I do. I hope it works out for you. Probably easier said than done, but try not to worry. It is only a house. You are probably going to lose it and may have declare bankruptcy. But bad as all that sounds, its not the end of the world. You are healthy and aren't facing anything like a jail term. The worst that can happen is they take the house off you, and you go either back into rented accom, or go back home. Also of course you could emigrate. Think of it as a new beginning. Hope it works out for you.

davyjose

STOP DRINKING. It's like the cancer patient who won't seek treatment because they're frightened. You NEED to face this head on. You can get through this, but it'll be hard. Have you parents you can move back in with? If so, rent out the house and do that. Your house has value to you which you are not using.
Until things pick up, find work, be it labouring or whatever, find work. If you can't, consider what someone else has said and go abroad. None of this is easy, but it's easier in the long run than daclaring bankrupcy, or worse -- as you suggested.
Things will eventually improve. There's a lot of unspent money out there, and a lot of people are too frightened to spend right now. But that will change.

Finally, can you not ask the bank for a year's grace on your mortgage? My cousin has told me he can do this with his mortgage. Perhaps you can go down this route. Find out.
You can get through this, but drinking every night won't help.

First step, as I said, use your house as an asset (rent) and move in with the folks - the cookings good, and the washing gets done

kippy

Deleted User wrote: »

Mabs according to a news article a few nights ago have such a long waiting list now for face to face appointments that it could be well into january before they could see the OP.
They will talk to him over the phone though.

Now lets see-where to start.

You are where you are-theres no magic wand.I'd advise the following actions in the following order.

1. Stop worrying-whats the worst that can happen to you? Lose your house? big deal,you can live at home with your folks for a while/brother/sister or a friend.

2.You will have to give up that house.You can't afford it lad and you have no immediate prospect of affording it.Talk to your mortgage bank and see what they want to do.If they want repossession,simply give them the deeds tbh as you don't want the legal fee's.
3.Talk to the credit card companies.Tell them you have lost your job.Come to some interim agreement with them that you will pay them when you can whether that be next year or 2012.
What can they do to you? You have no assets and no ability to repay at the moment.They could go legal but like the mortgage company shur what use is that to them-they may aswell be looking for a stone to pay them.
4.Don't be thinking you want to die or leave the country.You'll get work eventually even if it's not your speciality.
Owning the house isn't the be all and end all.
Owning the car isn't either.
To be be frank and very frank Fcuk that for a lark and fcuk the stress that you are getting yourself into over this unnecessarally.
You relax and let the responsibility of something you cannot have a hope of sorting rest with the banks.
Life is about being well,being good to your friends and family and enjoying yourself.
Believe it or not no matter how much you lose asset wise ,if you follow that motto most people will always like you and believe me when I say this thats what life is about.
If you are reading this,take €20 from your budget tonight and go out with your friends,don't go into rounds,you won't get drunk and just socialise.

Make that mabs appointment too by the way but as I say don't worry about it,please don't.You are where you are and thats that

Great advice and something I would completely condone.
As bad as things MAY seem, dont get into a situation where you "want to die". You are in a bad situation financially but its not all about finance.....you'll get back on your feet again....bury some of that pride in order to lower the stress levels.
Make sure you do as others say here in this post but try not to let it get all on top of you. We've become such a capatilist and consumer society in the past few years that we fail to realise/remember that generations before us lived on far less, had far more real hardships and still managed.
Kippy

jhegarty

eth0_ wrote: »

Honestly? Take responsiblity for your bad judgements and file for bankruptcy. .

You can't file for bankruptcy in Ireland... your creditors can, but you can't

davyjose

jhegarty wrote: »

You can't file for bankruptcy in Ireland... your creditors can, but you can't

Why can they, and not he?

jhegarty

davyjose wrote: »

Why can they, and not he?

sorry, wasn't clear there ... you can't declare bankruptcy and keep your house, like you can in the states...

davyjose

jhegarty wrote: »

sorry, wasn't clear there ... you can't declare bankruptcy and keep your house, like you can in the states...

Sorry, I wasn't clear myself. What are the terms for being able to declare bankrupcy, or not, in this country?
Something I've always wanted to know actually.

iguana

jhegarty wrote: »

You can't file for bankruptcy in Ireland... your creditors can, but you can't

Either you or your creditors can petition for bankruptcy. However it's a really bad idea in Ireland as bankruptcy lasts 12 years. Your creditors can garnish your salary and take your pension. It's nothing like it is in the UK or the US.

jhegarty

davyjose wrote: »

Sorry, I wasn't clear myself. What are the terms for being able to declare bankrupcy, or not, in this country?
Something I've always wanted to know actually.

from : http://www.courts.ie/offices.nsf/0/FC10F194CDA88A4A802573CB0066977C?opendocument

Petition by a debtor:

A debtor may bring a petition for his/her own bankruptcy where he/she is unable to pay debts to creditors and where his/her available estate (for example assets and property) is sufficient to produce at least €1,900.00.
Petition by a creditor:

A creditor may petition for bankruptcy against a debtor where the debtor has committed an act of bankruptcy within the previous three months. The most common acts of bankruptcy relied upon by a creditor are:

(a) failure by the debtor to comply with a bankruptcy summons requesting payment of a specific sum due, within fourteen days from service of the summons on the debtor, and

(b) the making of a return of no goods in respect of the debtor, by the sheriff or county registrar.

For a creditor to be entitled to petition the court to make a debtor bankrupt, a number of conditions must be met. These include :

* the petition must be presented within three months of the act of bankruptcy,
* the amount of debt owed must be set out in an affidavit,
* the debt owed must be at least €1,900.00,
* the debtor must be either resident in the State or within a year prior to presentation of the petition, have ordinarily resided, had a dwelling house or place of business, or carried on business within the State.


The creditor's petition must state whether any security (for example, a mortgage or a charge) is held by them in respect of the debt. If so, the creditor must indicate whether he/she intends to give up the security for the benefit of other creditors orput a value on their security.

mikemac

In the USA, it's pretty common to file for bankruptcy.
In the UK you can file for an IVA (Individual Voluntary Agreement). This were originally setup for small business owners so they could keep trading even if their business failed.
What happened 5 years ago is financial companies mass marketed them to everyone! So if you're fecked financially you agree to pay so many pence in the pound back and you can be sure the finanical company is getting their cut.
I know students in the UK who graduated with over 20k of debt and declared themselves bankrupt so they can restart in a few years.

It's being abused:
http://www.accountancyireland.ie/dsp_articles.cfm/goto/1338/page/Personal_Bankruptcy_–_Is_it_time_to_change_the_law?.htm

There is strong evidence to suggest that IVAs are being abused in the United Kingdom, with people building up significant “lifestyle” debt on credit cards, and then effectively writing off their debt through an IVA

This doesn't exist in Ireland, some say we have Victorian laws.
OP, you have chosen (you didn't chose) one of the worst countries around to get into financial difficulty.

Good info here:
http://www.debtadvice.ie/pages/Bankruptcy-in-Ireland.html

Home Debt Solutions Bankruptcy in Ireland
Bankruptcy in Ireland
Is Bankruptcy in Ireland An Option?

Unlike in many other countries such as the UK and USA where bankruptcy legislation has been modernised to enable people with overwhelming debts to obtain access to the protection of the courts relatively easily, Ireland's bankruptcy legislation is arguably out of date and in much need of modernisation.

A debtor does have the right to instigate a petition for bankruptcy at the court and likewise creditors can also start bankruptcy proceedings. If a debtor is unable to meet their repayment obligations to their creditors then the debtor may ask the court for a bankrupcty judgment provided that the individual has a realisable estate worth at least €1900.00.

Getting Discharged From Bankruptcy in Ireland

Because of the complexities of the current bankruptcy legislation in Ireland many people feel that obtaining a discharge from bankruptcy may realisticaly be complicated and as such prefer to deal with their debt problems without entering into the Irish bankruptcy process. Discharge form bankruptcy in Ireland can be achieved in a number of ways and these are set out below. It is worth noting however that enough funds must have been realised in the via the bankruptcy in order to cover the costs, fees, expenses and preferential debts arising in the bankruptcy.

Discharge After Twelve Years

Where the bankruptcy has lasted for twelve years, the debtor's property has been fully realised, and the court is satisfied that the debtor has disclosed any property acquired since bankruptcy and that it would be reasonable and proper to discharge the debtor from bankruptcy.

Discharge From Bankruptcy After Payment Of Debts In Full

Where the debtor's creditors have been paid in full, together with such interest as the court allows. Where the bankrupt's property is sufficient to permit payment of interest at the rate payable on judgements, that rate will apply .

Discharge From Bankruptcy With Full Creditor Consent

A bankrupt can be discharged from their bankruptcy statues where all of the debtor's unsecured creditors have consented to the discharge.

Discharge After Making Composition With Creditors

Where the debtor has provided the Official Assignee with the funds needed to meet a settlement (referred to as a Composition After Bankruptcy ) with their unsecured creditors - for a settlement to be effective, it must receive the support of at least sixty per cent in number and value of the unsecured creditors voting on it.

Discharge After Paying Fifty 'Pence In The Pound'

Where the debtor's property has been fully realised and his/her creditors have received fifty pence in the pound on their debts.

DirkVoodoo

i have a lot of sympathy for the OP after stumbling across this thread. Yes, irresponsible borrowing has got him into a lot of trouble and he is in a pickle, but he comes here looking for help and advice and not to be chastised!

God, I would have hoped there was at least a bit of charity left in post-tiger Ireland!

After all, we all make mistakes and he is paying for them now, literally. As someone mentioned earlier, God forbid any of ye who have knocked him should end up making a few mistakes and finding you got carried away during the inflated credit bubble!

Anyway, I'm a postgrad, was being paid up until recently and I am finishing up now while still living at home. So obviously I am as far removed from the OP as you can get and hardly one to be offering any financial advice.

All I would say is talk to your family and friends, talk to the bank, get help but don't feel that your life is over! Lots of people find themselves hitting a brick wall with their finances at some point in their lives but it isnt the end of the world, it cant be! There is more to life than bills and mortgages .

As I have said, this advice may seem ridiculous from me, but it is sincere. Consider what others have said about emmigration. You have a skill that is useful anywhere in the world.

Anyway, sorry for rambling on but I hope you find your feet.

EDIT: Also, some people are talking balls, banks dont want to be reposessing houses left right and centre because they cant sell them and they dont want massive amounts of useless assets on their books when an alternative exists that benefits both parties!

CK.1

Wow, what a bunch of idiots on this thread lecturing the OP. He made mistakes yes, but what good is giving him the "I told you so" lecture??? Get off your high horse for **** sake. How would you feel if the doctor says "tough ****, your fault, go home" when you turn up at the hospital with a relative with lung cancer due to smoking, or a knackered liver cos you had a drink problem, or a broken neck cos you crashed while texting when you were driving?

OP, as the other decent posters said, get youself down to MABS, talk to the bank, they work out an agreement with you until you get back on your feet, maybe you can just pay the interest for a while. You may have to sell the house and move back in with the folks or family. Start sticking up ads in the local shops, local papers, this site, adverts.ie and anywhere else you can think of. There are plenty of people who need odd jobs done. And if you do a good job for these people word will spread and hopefully the work will come piling in. Don't declare the earnings, keep claiming your dole, until you are in a better position and earning enough to stay aloat without it. Don't listen to any assholes who tell you this is wrong, look after number one. Nobody says anything about the self-employed, all of whom put everything they can think of through as expenses, even though most of it is illegitimate, to avoid paying tax.

Keep the chin up.

LegacyUser

hey OP. I'm in the building sector too, as an engineer.So far,so good for me but that's not your problem.
Listen, you are one of a huge list of people who are in this position, I know a lot of them through work. You've got to go to MABS first. Register with them.They may not speak to you straight away, but they'll get to you.Then turn to FAS, see what they can do for you. As regards selling the property, take a look at what other places are selling for in your area, and pitch it around that, if not lower. You need to get rid of that property.If you sell in negative equity, that still reduces what you owe to the bank.
As for the credit cards, and mortgage repayments, you HAVE to go the bank, explain your situation and try and work out a way with them for you to pay back what you can. I THINK (don't quote me on this, but maybe you can enquire), that sometimes you can consolidate your loans into one loan, often through a credit union,so you owe just the credit union one amount. Make them fully aware of your situation though.
Obviously keep looking for a job. I wouldn't set up a business right now, because that usually requires more loans. You've need to accept that you've got take any job at all for the moment. It coming up to Christmas, a lot of places take on temporary staff right now. Check up what you can claim back on tax relief for anything, bins etc etc, for the last year, just to get some cash right now.
To be honest, I think this is a far greater problem than people realise. I'm seeing it every day, I know people with huge mortgages in the constuction sector whose companies have gone bust, and they've no work. Qualified people, it's not just as simple as foreign people who wil go home.There's no point accusing you of stupidity, you literally did what every other lad your age getting that money straight out of school has done for the last 10 years. Plus to all the accusers out there, let's face it, the banks gave him the money,the mortgage, the loans....this bubble could not last forever, but the financial institutions, the government, and the people of this country were totally blinded by greed. What's done is done, now you've to work out a way to get out of it.If it comes to it, you can emigrate, but you need to what you can to sort it here first.

CavanGal

OP I think you need to talk to the Bank or some sort of fianancial advisor. While its good to talk to boardies for moral and emotional support, you have no idea what basis respondants are basing their practical advice on. I mean it could be someone (eg me!) with no experience of "real" debt or mortgages who doesnt understand what declaring oneself bankrupt would mean.

I mean no offence to anyone who offered advice!

All my advice is this is not the end of the world and I think its a common problem at the moment. Keep your head up and Id say doing a runner probably would only make things worse!

Best of luck.

NewFrockTuesday

Sorry but I don't find it easy to feel sorry for you.

First of all why did you borrow 420k when earning only 1000 p/w? A good wage by most standards but not against an almost 1/2 million borrowing.

Why did you borrow so much when you have already have so many loans?

A lot of people are blaming the banks for reckless borrowing but YOU signed the loan agreement.

You dropped the price but obviously not enough, If I were you I would keep dropping it to its ''true'' value,ie prpbably around 200,000 e and count your blessings.
I may sound harsh but you were sucked in and consequences are a bitch.

I hope you find a job

God you loved typing that didnt you.

Bitter ol' bitch much?

OP, I wish you the very best of luck. Chin up.


(((((((((hug)))))))))))