Doughiska

Chipboard

What do ye think of Doughiska as a location (from a property point of view)? Plenty of new apartments going up out there.

Would it be a good purchase??

JohnCleary

I'd prefer to eat my own goolies

cL0h

Chipboard wrote: »

What do ye think of Doughiska as a location (from a property point of view)? Plenty of new apartments going up out there.

Would it be a good purchase??

The coast side of the Dublin Road is grand. I'd be wary of the Parkmore side of the road. There's a lot of duplex, cardboard walled, ribbon development with very little community facilities though there's a few decent estates. An Fiodán seemed ok last time I was there.

On the plus side I would imagine property there is EXTREMELY affordable at the mo and it's better than paying rent! The tough part at the mo is getting a bank onside.

It depends where you're commuting to every day too. It's handy for Parkmore. That's about it though.

CrowdedHouse

Was passing through there lately,struck me as bleak kind of run down even though it's fairly new.

Granted it wasn't helped by being a cold wet day and whatever rooting they're doing with the road which looks like a bomb site.So in the 10 minutes or so I was waiting for the traffic lights I didn't like the view,future ghetto.

dr.bollocko

I would steer well clear of any of them I have seen. Poorly built shoddy houses and apartments. Im living in the area at the moment and have already handed in my months notice.

ErnieBert

A friend of mine lives in Castan. It seems like a nice estate. I agree with some of the other posters; some of the other places look plasticy.

dr.bollocko

I wouldnt want to warn you off of the whole area. If you get a nice house there that is well-built you could be onto a winner. The Briarhill shopping centre is there and the business park. There are plenty of shops and the LIDL near by. Its close enough to town but can be an expensive cab ride or long wait in traffic from here. The traffic is ****e right now but they are improving the Doughiska road as we speak so it may improve.

Mrs OBumble

CrowdedHouse wrote: »

Was passing through there lately,struck me as bleak kind of run down even though it's fairly new.

Not so much run-down as never built up.

The first rule of property = location. And it is a good location, provided you work on the east side of town, or perhaps somewhere in the east of the county. It will be better once the road is fixed, the playing fields are completed and the schools are built. At the moment, if the price was right for what you're buying, it could be excellent value.

That said, I'd still prefer Roscam. (And not only because everyone knows how to pronounce the name!)

Sherifu

JohnCleary wrote: »

I'd prefer to eat my own goolies

Truth.

i like the area.. been in one really nice house on a sunny day so got the best of it.


wud buy a house there aswell id say

Sponge Bob

Deleted User wrote: »

wud buy a house there aswell id say

Great , buy away lads , rent is most certainly deader than dead money !!!

BrokenArrows

i live in an fiodan and i think its a really nice place.

the houses in doughiska as an area vary widely.

when i was looking for a house i saw alot in this area. houses range from "my god this place is a **** hole" to "man this is a very nice house" where i am living now.

id advise looking in an fiodan if your thinking about this area.

quietobserver

puzzled by irelands infatuation with wanting to buy??? rent is only dead money if thats how you percieve it. OP wouldnt be in a hurry to buy anything there is still more drop in house sales prices forecast

sgthighway

dr.bollocko wrote: »

I would steer well clear of any of them I have seen. Poorly built shoddy houses and apartments. Im living in the area at the moment and have already handed in my months notice.

Is that Fearann Ri because the houses in all the other estates are okay IMO

Bonzodog

I live in Tur Uisce, and find it a nice estate, though I will be relocating to Oranmore in the New Year. I cannot afford to buy as I have a family and am still the only earner in my house on 28k a year. Houses are still selling at above the 200k mark, so without a substantial deposit (80k+), renting is my only option. Not just that, but its still cheaper than paying a mortgage of 120k.

Zzippy

An Castan, An Fiodan and Tur Uisce are all nice estates, well built and well maintained. I'm in Tur Uisce and the management company landscapers are around every week keeping the estate tidy and grass/shrubs maintained etc. Its extremely quiet, no antisocial behaviour. When I stay in town with the gf I find it really hard to sleep cos I'm so used to the quiet.
Once you go past the park you're getting into shoddier builds and council estates, oh and a halting site
The main road looks a tip at the moment with the roadworks, but should be finished very well in a few months. Once the park is open it will be much nicer again.
I've lived there 2 years now, commute is 15/20 mins to city centre for me. Facilities are great. Bus service is excellent.

Chipboard

What do ye think of Sraith Fhada?

Zzippy

Is that the new development across from the Racing Lodge? No idea what the houses/apartments are like, but its a quiet area and very convenient for shops, pub, bus stop

Mrs OBumble

quietobserver wrote: »

puzzled by irelands infatuation with wanting to buy??? rent is only dead money if thats how you percieve it.

Settled Irish people do have a connection to place that is expressed by wanting to own a home. IMHO this isn't a bad thing. In a society without very strong rental protections (which allow people who are renting to stay basically as long as they want), home-ownership is a big aspect in achieving social stability. If you look at the areas where most anti-social behaviour occurs, you'll find high proportions of renters vs owners.

Rent is dead money. So is mortgage interest, property maintenance costs, insurance and property taxes, and interest/earnings foregone on your deposit. So is the cost of moving house (connection fees for utilities, shifters, hassle of packing/unpacking everything, changing schools for the kids etc)

If all those things, less any capital gain, is more than you'd pay in rent then financially, yes, you're worse off.

But there are some social factors that are very hard to factor in. And some things to do with long-term benefits: if you own a house, it can give an income source that let's you go off and do other things when you're older too.

PopeBuckfastXVI

JustMary wrote: »

Rent is dead money. So is mortgage interest

Actually neither are, both are payment for a service, rent is payment for the use of a house/apartment, interest is payment for the use of the banks money.

Right now Rent on an apartment/house costs less per month than interest on the mortgage to buy it (in most cases), therefore it makes more financial sense to rent.

So I do.

Also beware negative equity.

OP have a read of www.irishhometruths.com and also www.thepropertypin.com

SimpleSam06

cL0h wrote: »

On the plus side I would imagine property there is EXTREMELY affordable at the mo and it's better than paying rent!

Things were affordable at the peak of the boom, as is evidenced by the way that people were still buying then. Of course they were terrible value, and they still are. A generally accepted rule of thumb is that good value for property should be 12 to 14x annual rent for an area, and given the atrocious rental returns in this country at the moment, its still got a long way to go. Its a puzzle to me why anyone would buy right now, it took 8 to 10 years to reach the top, what makes you think it will take any less to reach the bottom?

So the short of it is, if you feel like being done for six figure sums, buy now.

dr.bollocko

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

it took 8 to 10 years to reach the top, what makes you think it will take any less to reach the bottom?

So the short of it is, if you feel like being done for six figure sums, buy now.

I can see your point that right now its a tough choice to buy in the current economic environment but there is no indication in any of the studies of the property market I have read that would indicate anything even close to that argument. Property prices are not based on any kind of magic cycle where the time it takes for prices to soar equals the time it takes for prices to bottom out. If you are honestly predicting that it will take ten years for prices to bottom out then you are predicting some sort of ten year long financial crisis attached to it.

SimpleSam06

dr.bollocko wrote: »

Property prices are not based on any kind of magic cycle where the time it takes for prices to soar equals the time it takes for prices to bottom out.

Oh I agree, however you have to admit it is a strong possibility. My best guess estimate personally would have been 2012 or so a couple of years ago (and I have the posts to prove it :P) but now its anyone's guess. And even then when the bottom is reached, I doubt we'll see anything even close to a property boom in our lifetimes again.

At a minimum you are looking at 2012, given the massive overhang in supply with building still ongoing and the knock on effects of the tightening of lending criteria that the banks are putting in place (the primary reason for the price drops, as easy credit creates huge artificial demand from investors) which won't be going away.

dr.bollocko wrote: »

If you are honestly predicting that it will take ten years for prices to bottom out then you are predicting some sort of ten year long financial crisis attached to it.

I'm not sure if you've been reading the papers lately, but when the IMF is saying things like "unprecented global crisis", you know its not going to be fast or easy. And when you have analysts talking about ugly data coming down the wires, you not only should start running, you should have been packed up and gone a few weeks ago. The aftershocks will extend for a lot longer than ten years.

Mrs OBumble

PopeBuckfastXVI wrote: »

Actually neither are, both are payment for a service, rent is payment for the use of a house/apartment, interest is payment for the use of the banks money.

Does the term "dead money" have some special technical meaning? To me, rent is "dead" because once I've consumed the service (ie lived in the house for the month), I'm no better off: I still don't own even a fragment of a house, and I still need to find the money to pay for somewhere to live.

Interest is slightly better: because of the service I've received from the bank (ie money they've loaned me), I've had an opportunity to use my "living space" money to get ownership of a tiny bit more of a property. But only slightly.

PopeBuckfastXVI wrote: »

Right now Rent on an apartment/house costs less per month than interest on the mortgage to buy it (in most cases), therefore it makes more financial sense to rent.

So I do.

So do I. But if I could put together enough cash to make a reasonable deposit (say 30%), I would buy, and view it as a 20 year investment - and I'd regard the social benefits as a very important part of the return on that investment.

SimpleSam06

JustMary wrote: »

So do I. But if I could put together enough cash to make a reasonable deposit (say 30%), I would buy, and view it as a 20 year investment - and I'd regard the social benefits as a very important part of the return on that investment.

On the other hand if you need to move, renting is a better option. Likewise if you at any stage can't repay your mortgage, and I think a lot of people are going to find themselves in this situation, you lose the entire amount you have put into it, and have a permanent black mark on your credit record, making it very hard to ever get a loan again. If your house sale doesn't cover the amount outstanding on your mortgage, you are royally humped, as your income will be garnished all the way to your pension to repay that. Additionally being an FTB offers significant financial advantages, so the first house should be very carefully chosen.

Another poster made a very good and well thought out post about renting vs buying today, whuch I will quote here.

johnnyskeleton wrote:

I wanted you to nominate a property or area so that I could do a breakdown analysis. If I chose the property myself I would accused of selecting an area where rents are low and prices are high.

2 bed house/apt Co. Dublin less than 300k. Daft returns 784 matches. I sorted them by price (lowest first) and selected the first one I could see in an area that would have a lot of properties for sale or to rent. I found Belfry Hall, Citywest Road, Citywest. Sure enough, I found a similar property to let.

To let: €1,100

To buy €265,000 or €1,340 per month based on an 80% mortgage (53k deposit) over 20 years @ 4.58% from AIB, who I believe have the best interest rate at the moment. I trust you have no difficulty with the 20 year annuity term, as the 30/35/40 year interest only etc loans have played a significant role in inflating the bubble. For the purposes of this example we will say that there was no stamp duty and they have a solicitor friend who will do the conveyance for free. We will also say that they get TRS of €266 per month for the first 6 years and that their managment company fees are €2400, so that's a net €66 deduction from their monthly installment. So they actually pay €1,274 each month.

On these basic figures, buying is €174 extra per month, but that's not the end of the matter. Let's say that instead of putting down the 53k on the deposit they put it into Northern Rock at 5%, less dirt is 4%, or €2,120 pa or €176 pm. So they are actually €350 better off if they rent (another way of looking at this is that if they got a 100% mortgage, they would pay an extra €202 per month). Let's also look at the hidden costs i.e. repairs furniture which could add €100 extra per month which the renter's landlord would pay, but the purchasors will have to pay themselves. So they are €450 worse off per month or €5,400 per year.

Now, I know you don't want to discuss the ifs and whatnots, but it is generally accepted that rents and house prices will fall over the next two years. Let's say the rent drops in 2009 by €100 to €1,000 p.m. and the house price drops by 5% or €13,250 pa (€1,104 pm). That puts them a massive €1,204 better off if they rent per month, or €1,654 in total. While with these figures for rental and house price drops we can argue the toss, I think the above figures are more than reasonable as I would estimate a ~ 10% drop in both rents and house prices in 2009 alone, nevermind 2010.

Finally, let's look at the human side. With employment rising an unprecedented 57% over the last year with more job losses predicted for 2009, there is a good chance that one or both of this couple could lose their jobs. The stress of being unable to pay the rent is nowhere near the stress of getting into arrears in your mortgage. Selling is very difficult at the moment and will likely remain so for the next few years. Even if they sell for €250k a year later, that's a €15k loss of their own money. But lets not presume the worst, lets say that they are both civil servants and after 5 years they wish to buy a bigger home because prices have come down and they are expecting their first child. They will be lucky to get their deposit back from the sale of this property and they will also now have to pay stamp duty on their new house. Let's say the stamp duty is €10,000, and they have nothing left from the sale of the apartment after the mortgage, estate agents and solicitors are paid off. The couple who rented will be [53k (deposit) + 21k (350 per month for 5 years, note that this could be earning interest which I haven't included) + 4.8k (rental drop from 2009 onwards) + 10k stamp duty =] €88.8k better off than they would be if they buy now in a falling market. If they get some money back from the sale of the property then subtract it from this figure, but even if they get their deposit back they are still €35.8k worse off, or 1 years average industrial wage.

So take your pick. If you assume rents and prices will stay the same for the next 5 years, they will be €21k worse off if they buy over rent. If rents and prices keep dropping, they will be much worse off.

You see, in the boom times it made sense to pay whatever was being asked for a property, because with capital appreciation of 10%, you could live there for free and make a profit from buying a property. Now that it's gone the other way, it is a guaranteed loss.

Mrs OBumble

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

On the other hand if you need to move, renting is a better option. Likewise if you at any stage can't repay your mortgage ...

I don't think we're fundamentally disagreeing here: buying property is a transaction that needs to be thought about very carefully, the price, location and deposit amount need be be right. Notice that I said I'd want to have at least 30% deposit, while the well thought out* post that you quoted used 20%. A few years ago, I'd have said 20% too, but I've got more conservative since. I also think that the house itself has to be right: I've purchased before, and having flatmates for the first couple of years made an enormous difference.

NB the post you quoted missed out something important: the cost of insurance. Both for the house itself, and also mortgage protection, to stop you getting to the stage of not being able to repay. IMHO it's pretty ridiculous to get to that stage without having taken steps to sort the problem out youself before it gets to the point of repossession.

SimpleSam06

JustMary wrote: »

IMHO it's pretty ridiculous to get to that stage without having taken steps to sort the problem out youself before it gets to the point of repossession.

What can you do to sort out a property thats deep in negative equity, hard to rent in a market that's flooded with rental properties, and you can't keep up the payments?

Bluntly, it would be a really stupid move to buy anything for the next few years no matter how good it makes you feel. Once again, just because something can be afforded doesn't make it a smart purchase - I could afford a box of matches for €50, but I'd be an idiot to pay it.

Mrs OBumble

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

What can you do to sort out a property thats deep in negative equity, hard to rent in a market that's flooded with rental properties, and you can't keep up the payments?

If you had any brains, you thought about that long, long ago when you first purchased the property. Mortgage protection insurance exists for a reason.

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

Bluntly, it would be a really stupid move to buy anything for the next few years no matter how good it makes you feel. Once again, just because something can be afforded doesn't make it a smart purchase - I could afford a box of matches for €50, but I'd be an idiot to pay it.

Sweeping statements like that aren't helpful. There are some cases where (eg someone with close to 100% of the purchase price buying a quality property as a long-term investment), where a purchase would be very sensible. However I agree, it would be stupid to take on a big mortgage, or to purchase as a short-term (ie less than 10-year) investment.

If everyone started thinking the way you've suggested, then no property would be sold at all. I can't think of a better way to absolutely ensure total economic and social breakdown.

SimpleSam06

JustMary wrote: »

If you had any brains, you thought about that long, long ago when you first purchased the property. Mortgage protection insurance exists for a reason.

Sorry now, but if it was half as useful as you are making out then people would just take out a mortgage and go on the dole for the rest of their lives.

JustMary wrote: »

Sweeping statements like that aren't helpful. There are some cases where (eg someone with close to 100% of the purchase price buying a quality property as a long-term investment),

As far as I can see, prices are going to bottom out in this country, then rise at roughly inflation rates, give or take. Unfortunately for you you've already lost enormous amounts of money because inflation has reduced the value of your "investment", in ten years time when prices again equal 2008 rates, you'll have lost 40% of your cash plus interest. Even as a BTL you have spent decades paying off enormous amounts of interest as well as the capital sum.

One would have thought your money would be better spent almost anywhere else.

JustMary wrote: »

If everyone started thinking the way you've suggested, then no property would be sold at all. I can't think of a better way to absolutely ensure total economic and social breakdown.

See this is funny here. Its a typical Irish way of seeing things that an economy starts and ends with property. The reality is that residential construction adds nothing to an economy, since all the tax take and benefits are just borrowed from future earnings. In fact in certain respects it could be said to be detrimental to an economy, its the broken window fallacy gone horribly wrong. There is a lot more to a sane economy than construction.

As to who would buy house - well, people looking for a place to live, although I know that concept is anathema to the cracked financial mindset that has prevailed these last eight years, and has left us in the mess we are in today. When people start looking at a house as a home and not as some sort of passport to fiscal gain, then we'll be on the right track. Unfortunately that probably means knocking all the apartments in Barna and unsaleable "starter homes", but you have to break some eggs...

JohnCleary

Lads, don't get too deep, this is only Galway City forum, the small sister of AH muwah!

-EDIT- Ah, I crossed the line, Drink-of-Water is a lovely place i'm sure

Webbs

Simple Sam hasn't your quoting of Johnny Skelton one flaw in it? If for example we say that a mortgage is payed over 20 years at E1500 then you pay E1500 now and will be paying E1500 on your last payment in 20years time. Do you think that rents will still be E1000 in 20years time?

I'm not coming down on either side of the argument - buying a home (as opposed to a house) is as much a personal/social decision made with the heart as it is one made with the head.
Those renting will be happy as they are thinking with their head and be glad they havent bought in a falling market. Those who are comfortable with their mortgage and love their home will be glad they bought irrespective of economic conditions

SimpleSam06

Webbs wrote: »

Simple Sam hasn't your quoting of Johnny Skelton one flaw in it? If for example we say that a mortgage is payed over 20 years at E1500 then you pay E1500 now and will be paying E1500 on your last payment in 20years time. Do you think that rents will still be E1000 in 20years time?

The discussion on his comment is still ongoing in accom/prop if you want to dip your toes in the water over there, I don't want to rehash everything thats already being said.

Webbs wrote: »

I'm not coming down on either side of the argument - buying a home (as opposed to a house) is as much a personal/social decision made with the heart as it is one made with the head.

To be honest anyone thats making a financial decision in the hundreds of thousands of euros, the biggest purchase of their lives, that could potentially ruin them, with anything but their head, needs that head examined. Especially in the current climate, where we have 300 people a day going on welfare, or around 100,000 in the last year.

Webbs wrote: »

Those renting will be happy as they are thinking with their head and be glad they havent bought in a falling market. Those who are comfortable with their mortgage and love their home will be glad they bought irrespective of economic conditions

I'm not saying that buying is a bad idea period. I'm saying that buying now is a really really bad idea. Give it three or four years and I'll probably change my tune. Although even then I'd say that buying a property for financial gain or buying a "starter home" to "get on the ladder" is a really stupid idea.

Mrs OBumble

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

As far as I can see, prices are going to bottom out in this country, then rise at roughly inflation rates, give or take. Unfortunately for you you've already lost enormous amounts of money because inflation has reduced the value of your "investment", in ten years time when prices again equal 2008 rates, you'll have lost 40% of your cash plus interest. Even as a BTL you have spent decades paying off enormous amounts of interest as well as the capital sum.
....

See this is funny here. Its a typical Irish way of seeing things that an economy starts and ends with property.

Sorry, but no. I purchased less than ten years ago but and thanks to the wonders of shrewd purchasing, revolving credit, simple lifestyle and some very aggressive cash management on my part, and a nice deposit (sadly gained, but used in a way that deceased relatives would be proud of), I've had some great experiences and am paying almost no interest now. Well, actually, it's my tenants who are paying the interest. And they're paying for a good few other useful things too. Even with the property slump, my asset value is about three times the cash I put in. It will be far more than that when I eventually sell, too (no way I'd sell in the current market).

As I said, it's horses for courses. Each investment needs to be weighted up in its own terms, taking into account a wide variety of financial and personal circumstances, and personal risk-taking preferences.

BTW, I'm not Irish.

dr.bollocko

JustMary wrote: »

Sorry, but no. I purchased less than ten years ago but and thanks to the wonders of shrewd purchasing, revolving credit, simple lifestyle and some very aggressive cash management on my part, and a nice deposit (sadly gained, but used in a way that deceased relatives would be proud of), I've had some great experiences and am paying almost no interest now. Well, actually, it's my tenants who are paying the interest. And they're paying for a good few other useful things too. Even with the property slump, my asset value is about three times the cash I put in. It will be far more than that when I eventually sell, too (no way I'd sell in the current market).

As I said, it's horses for courses. Each investment needs to be weighted up in its own terms, taking into account a wide variety of financial and personal circumstances, and personal risk-taking preferences.

BTW, I'm not Irish.

I just got a little bit sick in my mouth.

But on the upside I am just about out of Doughiska in two weeks.

SimpleSam06

JustMary wrote: »

Sorry, but no. I purchased less than ten years ago but and thanks to the wonders of shrewd purchasing, revolving credit, simple lifestyle and some very aggressive cash management on my part, and a nice deposit (sadly gained, but used in a way that deceased relatives would be proud of), I've had some great experiences and am paying almost no interest now.

Lets just translate that as "you got lucky". Property prices have climbed 300% in the last ten years or so, dropping only in the last year and a half. Ten years ago it was a good idea to buy. Now, not so much. As with all investments, past performance is no indication of future blah blah blah...