Discipline Question

rebelcork

We have a 19 month old girl who up to now has been very well behaved.However she has recently started to strike out at us when asked for a kiss for example or we are kicked at when changing her nappy.

As you can appreciate we do not want to slap her as we feel that this would not only compound the problem but is against our way of rearing her.Verbal admonishment however is ignored or laughed at and it is an issue that is starting to irritate us.
.
She has never seen any violence at home, quite the opposite in fact ,and she also kicks up when she sees me and her mother kissing or hugging during the course of the day.
Any suggestions?Thanks

MoominPapa

All I can say is that our 14 month old started slapping and biting at around eleven months when he was being held. He would have never been exposed to anything like it. Anytime he did it we put him down and told him it wasn't nice. It died out pretty quick but would resurface every now and then. He bit for the first time in ages last week and got the same response and hasn't done it since. So I would recommend not to make a huge deal of it but be consistent in showing disapproval. Its just pushing boundaries I reckon and probably a healthy thing once handled calmly. Anytime he sees us kissing or cuddling he just joins in:)

noby

Welcome to the world of the terrible twos, rebelcork.

A lot of toddlers slap as they are unsure of how to show affection. Work with her and tell her you would prefer a hug or a kiss. Also don't 'exclude' her when you and your partner embrace. It's not the kind of action that punishing will resolve, but you do need a lot of patience.

lostinnappies

Time outs work for children over the age of 1. Most people will think thats too young. Simply put when she starts biting and hitting, put on your best "cross face" really make an effort with that and firmly say "no" (remember dont shout, just loud enough so she looks at you). Place her sitting against the wall close to you and sit near her (in the same room but not beside her). Ignore it all, the shouting,kicking screaming etc. If you pay attention to it she thinks "oh I have to scream that loud to get attention" Only go to her if she gets up and walks away, simply pick her up and put her back with no talking. Dont give eye contact either. Leave her there for 1 min (or until she calms down). Then pick her up (once calm) and say "no hitting" and "big hug".

Keep your language simple and short. Ranting on at her she will lose interest and probably misbehave again.

She will learn that mommy does NOT respond to hitting/biting. It will take some time to get her used to it but the difference is amazing.

Just comparing my son with another friends son who were both the same age and both learning to slap and bite. I did the time out technique and my friend decided she wasnt going to bother. My son now behaves himself beautifully and when i say "no" he knows i mean business. Her son is hitting and biting children in his class now (aged 4) and even his teachers too.

Its well worth doing it properly, give your dd the tools to control her temper and let the world see the beautiful girl she really is.:)

metrovelvet

I have a question, I hope you dont mind me butting in here. I have been using timeouts for my son since he was about 1.

Now the clever little guy [16 mos] has figured out how to use them to his advantage. He doesnt like sitting still in his highchair and at dinner likes to throw his bowl, plate, fork whatever across the room and it took silly me a little while to figure out he knew he would taken out of the chair for a timeout for doing this, but that is exactly what he wanted - to get out of the chair!!!

deisemum

Remember to get down to his level when speaking to him. I have found time out to be effective, 1 minute per age is the usual advice.

Nevyn

Then don't take him out of the chair, put him in a time out while still in the high chair.

metrovelvet

Just move him and the highchair into a different place?

Nevyn

Yup why not ?

metrovelvet

ok thanks.

Nevyn

I would say becareful about turning meal times esp dinner times into a battle ground,
if you can head up and nip things in the bud rather then let them esclate to where you are in a conflict situation.

After a certain amount of time they do get bored, esp after the inital hunger is gone and they have something in thier tummys. So watch for how long before he get bored and take a break and remove things from his reach. If needs be let him eat a bit more later on.

Also all little boys throw things, all of them it's some deep seated Y chromosome hunter trait, best thing I found was to channel it and gave mine 'safe' thing to throw and a traget to throw them at. I used covered sponge balls and hackysacks and he was allowed to aim them back at or into the plastic container in which they lived.

deisemum

The one thing I'd recommend especially as they get older is to be consistent and follow through. Mine know that if I mention a consequence that I'll follow through so I don't have to discipline them that often, older boy is 13 so I reckon it's only a matter of time

CSU

Children do the strangest things because they get a reaction, from my experience kicking while changing his/her nappy is always going to happen as it ruddy freezen and uncomfortable.

Key thing is try to completely ignore when the child slaps, it will soon stop and he/she'll turn to other weird things to do for laughs...tis a looooong crazy road:)

metrovelvet

Thaedydal wrote: »

I would say becareful about turning meal times esp dinner times into a battle ground,
if you can head up and nip things in the bud rather then let them esclate to where you are in a conflict situation.

After a certain amount of time they do get bored, esp after the inital hunger is gone and they have something in thier tummys. So watch for how long before he get bored and take a break and remove things from his reach. If needs be let him eat a bit more later on.

Also all little boys throw things, all of them it's some deep seated Y chromosome hunter trait, best thing I found was to channel it and gave mine 'safe' thing to throw and a traget to throw them at. I used covered sponge balls and hackysacks and he was allowed to aim them back at or into the plastic container in which they lived.

Yeah very accurate description. After everything is thrown on the floor and he starts trying to climb out to reach for the knives, dinner turns into a messy arts and music class, materials being his dinner for painting and sculpture and his plastic utensil for percussion. I think I should buy a hasmet (sp?) suit.

Nevyn

It's learning and important for eye hand co ordination and depth perception which effects lots of things down to their handwriting skills as they develop.

We still have things up high on shelves and Waaaaaaaaaay out of reach in this household out of habit from when they were at that age even 6 years on.

Nevyn

As for the bitey, slappy near two year old, well part of that is the built in " Don't want lil sister/brother " contraceptive that they seem to have when they see thier parents getting affectionate.

I would not put up with being slapped, kicked, bitten or having my hair pulled.
At that age they know when you are not happy and disaprove of thier behaviour and it's
time to start laying down the law and them getting used to hearing the stern parental voice firmly saying "No!" and when they are a little bigger " No, not allowed!"

Yes they will be startled and get upset and a little cry won't do them any harm but you have to assert youself at this stage and have know you won't tolerate such things or you make life a lot harder on them and you when they are older.

metrovelvet

thaed-

I found a possible solution. Skip Hop make plates that stick to the high chair table.

Now just the food will end up on the floor. I guess thats why god made dogs.

OP-

I also remembered that my son would slap when he got excited and take his hands and whack them on me or grab the hair on a dog or cat and used to love to pull my hair and use it as a lever- wasnt malevolence or temper, just excitement and I took his hand and showed him how to stroke and said "nice... nice..." and it only took a couple of times before he learned how to touch gently.

Maybe try something like that before punitive measures?

noby

metrovelvet wrote: »

thaed-

I found a possible solution. Skip Hop make plates that stick to the high chair table.

Now just the food will end up on the floor. I guess thats why god made dogs.

I'm not sure I would see that as a solution. You're trying to cure the symptom, not the problem there. As Thaedydal mentioned the child gets bored, and that's what you need to tackle. We went through a phase of having books and colours handy. As soon as the kids started to get bored take their plate away and give them an activity. We were also using this to get them to stay sitting at the table until everyone is finished their meal.

lostinnappies

metrovelvet wrote: »

I have a question, I hope you dont mind me butting in here. I have been using timeouts for my son since he was about 1.

Now the clever little guy [16 mos] has figured out how to use them to his advantage. He doesnt like sitting still in his highchair and at dinner likes to throw his bowl, plate, fork whatever across the room and it took silly me a little while to figure out he knew he would taken out of the chair for a timeout for doing this, but that is exactly what he wanted - to get out of the chair!!!

Ignore the behaviour you dont want and praise the behaviour you do. When he starts throwing his dinner, dont look at him, dont talk to him simply wipe the spudz from your eye and continue eating your dinner.... he will be very upset he doesnt get a reaction and will kick and scream. If he doesnt eat that particular meal then thats ok ... he is not going to starve to death. Give him nothing in between meals except water and have a slightly earlier meal next time. He will soon learn that throwing his dinner only means he will be hungry. As soon as he picks up some food and pops it into his mouth give him praise (but not over the top, he will only expect it every time he does it. You just want to praise him a little for doing what you expect him to do) give him eye contact then and talk to him then.

metrovelvet

noby wrote: »

I'm not sure I would see that as a solution. You're trying to cure the symptom, not the problem there. As Thaedydal mentioned the child gets bored, and that's what you need to tackle. We went through a phase of having books and colours handy. As soon as the kids started to get bored take their plate away and give them an activity. We were also using this to get them to stay sitting at the table until everyone is finished their meal.

Thanks. Tried that already. They get thrown on the floor also. He doesnt want to be in the high chair. If its boredom, then its boredom the minute he sits down in it before he eats. There is no "as soon as he gets bored" applicable here, unless its from the second he's in the high chair.

lostinnappies

metrovelvet wrote: »

Thanks. Tried that already. They get thrown on the floor also. He doesnt want to be in the high chair. If its boredom, then its boredom the minute he sits down in it before he eats. There is no "as soon as he gets bored" applicable here, unless its from the second he's in the high chair.

Can you try getting a booster seat for a normal chair, perhaps he is feeling left out being higher up then everyone else.?

metrovelvet

lostinnappies wrote: »

Can you try getting a booster seat for a normal chair, perhaps he is feeling left out being higher up then everyone else.?

I suspect this may be part of it, after all he thinks he's a grown up but this has been tried in restaurants. I think its more of a case of "mama, how can you reasonably expect me to sit here for 20 minutes, when the world is such an interesting place, full of things to investigate and take apart, spaces to explore, sounds to make, people to talk to. Seriously, mama, you are most unreasonable to ask me to sit here and eat when there are so many more important and interesting things to do."

Nevyn

Have you tried music ?

My two brats have hungery brains they always have two or 3 things on the go, it is always been the way for them and I can be like that myself. I don't agree with tv at dinner time or homework time but with out anything else going on they both can get restless and bored.

From when they were past 5 months gestating I would play certain types of music and kept this going when they were infants. Usually classical pieces, upbeat tempo for playtimes and tidying up, usually concerto or string quintet peices for home work and dinner time and then I have a play list which is just for window heading to bed/sleep time.

With out the music in the background dinner times can be come far to hyper or else far to quiet, or has them bolting their food to get back to what they want to do.

With out the music homework takes sooooo much longer and there are squabbles
and things having to be redone again.

So try some music or even the radio on a chat station in the back ground and see if it makes a difference.

metrovelvet

Good idea. He loves music.

tallaght01

Great advice from lostinnappies!

If all parents were like you, my kidy behavioural clinic would have about 90% less attendees!!!!!

rocco

My little boy is just 13 months old, in the last week or so he has started slapping .Not all the time but it has become a bit more frequent over the last 10 days. I noticed it happening when I would pick him or asked for a kiss he would lash out with his hand , I have seen him do it to his mammy, nanny and grand dad as well.I would let him know he wasnt allowed (the look on his face you think he knows its wrong), it doesnet happen all the time but has been getting a bit more frequent. The child minder in the chreche told me he had done it to a couple of the kids as well yesterday afternoon. He is just about to enter the toddler room, he had been in the baby room since he started in September. Just trying the best way to nip it in the bud other than that no issues at all with him , he is very affectionate and co operative at meal times and bed time . From reading this tread im guessing its all par for the course. Just dont want it to get out of had especially with him attending creche .In fairness the girlsin the creche are very good an seem to know how to handle it ,they where just making me aware it had occured.

MrsA

I find that ignoring the behaviour works best, and also that distraction is a great tool.

I personally disagree with Time-out as a method of discipline, but, everyone is different. I don't feel that making my child sit in one place for a set period of time will make any difference and feel that it is quite a negative thing to do.

My guy is 22 months and yes we have our battles, but, I have learned to go with the flow and to pick which ones I really want to win with him. He is very strong willed and so am I so I can see us having great fun in the future. For now I am able to distract him and also explain why I do not like certain things and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't.

I hope you find a way that works for you.

M