Dissections

!!!!!conor!!!!!

Hi I heard that from next next september med students in ucc will not be doing any dissections. Does anyone know if there is any truth to this rumour?

tallaght01

Lack of dissection is becoming the norm in lots of countries. It was oly a matter of time before it happened in Ireland. I think it's a great shame, but I'm not all that surprised by it.

It's part of a general dumbing downt hat you'll see over the next few years I reckon.

DrIndy

think thats a great shame - the anatomy lab is where people finally lose the sense of EUUUGGH that goes with many parts of medicine (apart from where you find rather revolting objects stuck up orifices.

Its better to get the faints out of the way around people who donated themselves for our education than in an operating theatre.

sam34

that will be a huge loss to medical students. you learn so much in the dissecting room. and have some funny moments too when classmates are dragged out feet first! (11 years later and we still tease one of teh lads about it!)

John

I had heard they were phasing it out but I thought it was just a notion, there's no way a model (computer and/or plastic) or a book can replace that sort of experience. I only had limited experience in the anatomy dissection theatre (just a course on neuroanatomy) but it gave me an appreciation that those diagrams in the anatomy textbooks are nice but insufficient.

If they can't get donations, that's fair enough but perhaps trying to address that situation rather than abandoning it wholesale would be a wiser course of action.

Tree

they won't be able to fit more of them on the path lab/pm room rotation like.

Kwekubo

I doubt that lack of donations is the issue at all; Trinity's anatomy dept is refusing to take on any new donors until October next due to "unprecedented response" in the last few years.

A case could be made for greater use of prosection instead of dissection (ie, expert dissections carried out in advance by people who know what they're doing, so that interesting features aren't damaged), especially for the more tedious and time-consuming procedures. But there definitely is something special about full-on dissection with the real thing there in front of you, and not just in terms of learning anatomy.

Chunky Monkey

Ah who needs dissections when you have Kapit and Elson

I do find it difficult to picture though sometimes. A lot more emphasis is put on surface anatomy here, they're trying to turn us into budding GPs.

mardybumbum

sam34 wrote: »

some funny moments too when classmates are dragged out feet first! (11 years later and we still tease one of teh lads about it!)

I know im going a bit off topic here but my class (1st years in TCD) started dissections about a month ago and there was no shrills or shrieks. Maybe all those violent movies have desensitized us!

Kwekubo

I don't think anyone ever fainted in our year either (although I will admit that there have been some unnerving moments).

There's an interesting article on the topic in this month's Student BMJ.

sillymoo

We have had a few fainters esp when starting the abdomen! Personally I would not know my anatomy as well if I did not have practial classes. Going to miss not having them after christmas

Piste

Oh dear I really hope this wont happen, seems absolutely bizarre not to teach medical students anatomy from a real human body and using books or computers instead.

ZorbaTehZ

Our lecturer was telling this also, and I really don't understand the logic behind it - the massive learning aid that the gross lab it... without it, the amount of extra work that I'd have to do to get to the stage I'm at... wouldn't like to think about it tbh :rolleyes:

Stepherunie

I'm in UCD and doesn't sound like it's coming in here at all, though in saying that they're way more into prosection than dissection.

Loads of labs going on all the time, I think it'd be a great loss to no have labs any more, all the meds, rads and physios do them and it was great for getting us over everything.

I think we had one fainter and it was the formaldehyde smell coupled with no food for a few days due to a vomitting bug that got her rather than being grossed out. The old terrace was really bad for the smell.

Amnesiac_ie

I'm one of those weirdos who used feel really hungry after dissection; my friends and I tended to head up to the Old Bar in UCC after our Monday/Friday afternoon sessions for a pint and a toasted sandwich.

Shane-1

haha, ya, i often get that hungry feeling afterwards too, though I remember the most unsettling experience I have had in medical education thus far was the dissection where our instructor said that the cadavers often reminded him of tuna, we had lunch afterwards - what had I for lunch? Tuna sandwhichs, eaten with hands smelling of formaldehyde.

Also, as soon as you put on the gloves and start dissection, does anyone else automatically get an itchy nose?

Chunky Monkey

Hmmm feeling slightly jealous now...

Then again, how many first year students get to witness a Caesarean section

John

Amnesiac_ie wrote: »

I'm one of those weirdos who used feel really hungry after dissection; my friends and I tended to head up to the Old Bar in UCC after our Monday/Friday afternoon sessions for a pint and a toasted sandwich.

Always happened to me too. Still does (though I'm working exclusively with rats these days). Meat is meat at the end of the day (although I'll be sticking to the usuals for lunch).

ZorbaTehZ

Shane-1 wrote: »

Also, as soon as you put on the gloves and start dissection, does anyone else automatically get an itchy nose?

Personally I don't, but most everyone else seems to complain about that non stop... very strange if you ask me.

tech77

That's crazy if that's true.
It's more than just the
hands-on experience though- there's something unique about the whole DR experience.

Never knew anyone in my class who fainted though- always thought that was a bit over-hyped tbh.

Amnesiac_ie

John wrote: »

Always happened to me too. Still does (though I'm working exclusively with rats these days). Meat is meat at the end of the day (although I'll be sticking to the usuals for lunch).

Yeah and I was vegetarian in First Med so I guess the cadavers seemed extra tasty.

I promise I'm not Ireland's answer to Hannibal Lecter by the way. Although I do love a nice Chianti...

sam34

there were 2 fainters in my class, both were fellas.
never got the itchy nose thing.

sillymoo

We dissected the eye today. I have to admit I was quite queasy.

RobFowl

Mixed feeling on dissection. In my day it was taught fairly badly (IMO) and not sure how useful it was. The emphasis at that time (late 80's early 90's) just did not seem to be practical enough. They focused on muscles nerves etc but not in a way that was relevant to future practice.

The smell in Earlsfort terrace was quite strong, but none of my class fainted.