Question for the Gardai

Fiend-Foe

Question for the Gardai here on boards if you don’t mind,

Sorry for the longwinded-ness, just want to present the situation as best as possible and get the details correct so as you can answer me as best you can, if you don't mind taking the time.

So I was out last night with my Girlfiend, we had just arrived in the club and got our first drinks in. The place was pretty empty when we got there and filling up. We were sitting in a booth similar to this one;




There is a row of these booths and the adjacent ones were filled with groups of girls (Students probably). We were just about finished our first drinks when two guys started patrolling up and down, checking out all the girls, they were throwing shapes all over the place and generally being menacing and intimidating towards the girls next to us and to us.

My Girlfriend was wearing a skirt and because of the nature of said booths, these guys could see her legs etc. One of them made a grab or two at her ankles and they were both looking at me trying to intimidate me “Ya startin wha??” kind of stuff, you know what I mean, head gestures, trying provoke a response whatever.

Anyway so then these guys moved on to the other side of the club, the bar is in the middle, I could see them and they kept looking at me at times, when they weren’t busy hassling other patrons. The only thing I can think is that I was the only guy in the row with all those girls, or just cos I was sat there with my GF.

So at this point the our drinks were gone and I went to the bar. Who shows up beside me? But the two boyos, I was just standing there €20 in hand waiting for the barmans attention when I see the lad is staring at me, and mouthing at his friend, I know this probably isn’t the smartest thing I have ever done, but the guy was right beside me staring me down. I said something like “Whats the ****ing problem?” or “Whats your ****ing problem?” in a pretty dismissive way, not aggressive at all.

Next thing I know I’m clattered by what I thought was a Heineken bottle, cos I saw one on the bar beside me, but it was a pint glass. The guy glassed me straight over the head. When I was looking away too. Then I remember 2 or 3 seconds of black and came two with a bouncer about to drag me out of the place, I pointed at my girlfriend over in the booth and said “My GF, My jackets over there, I didn’t do anything” etc.

Then the barman (I had been chatting to earlier getting our first round) who had seen everything hopped over the bar and told the bouncer it wasn’t my fault. Security then got very nice and brought myself and the GF and the barman who saw it all our to the emergency exit. They said it was most likely on CCTV. They then got a first aid kid and offered an ambulance and started cleaning up my cuts.

( This made me think that they were a lot worse, only a few minor scrapes, but a lot of blood. The security were so attentive to it though I thought it was worse. I guess this was to avoid any liability on the clubs part, understandably. They even had me sign to say I was offered and declined an ambulance)

So then the Guards arrived at the emergency exit, they took details from myself and the barman who saw everything ,and my GF, who saw the immediate aftermath from where she was. The bouncers at the front door had the two guys held there.

Anyway the Garda informed me that if there was anything I wanted to be done about it I would have to go to the hospital and get a doctors report of my injuries ( Which were minimal, luckily).

I went to the hospital and waited for an hour and a half, then I saw how big the queues were and knew I would be waiting all night, would probably still be there now. Also saw some stretcher cases that made me think twice and feel silly for wasting the good doctors time for a few scratches, I know they are under a lot of pressure.

Anyway the question is this, even with my statement, the barmans, my GF’s and possibly CCTV in the area, also anybody else who happened to be at the bar/nearby. Is it really necessary for me to see a doctor for a few scrapes?? The only reason I would want to follow this up is because a scumbag like this could easily mess somebody up next time. I consider getting glassed and only getting a few scrapes from it similar to somebody trying to stab someone and missing, the intention to do serious harm was there.

Do really I need to see a Doc? Pay for it myself? Is that how it works, the Guard saw my injuries and the barman explained what happened. I don't know, if someone could please clarify that would be great. I just want to make sure this dangerous prick can't **** someone else up really badly.

Poloman

You were assaulted. Its on CCTV. You shouldnt need a doctors report.. it just helps in the case against the accused.

You have a brilliant case and I would prosecute.

Fiend-Foe

Poloman wrote: »

You were assaulted. Its on CCTV. You shouldnt need a doctors report.. it just helps in the case against the accused.

You have a brilliant case and I would prosecute.

The Guard told me it would not go any further without a Doctors report. They Made that clear. Also CCTV is not definite.

But the barman is absolutely sure of what happened.

donvito99

Well a guard cant really stand up in court and say you had a few cuts and bruises. A report from a doctor could mean the difference between a prosecution and those scumbags walkin' free. Its also on CCTV, as Poloman says and there was bound to be alot of people around, so all in all, youand the guards have a very strong case.

donvito99

Fiend-Foe wrote: »

The Guard told me it would not go any further without a Doctors report. They Made that clear. Also CCTV is not definite.

But the barman is absolutely sure of what happened.

What do you mean by 'not definite'. Is it in black and white, side of shot, blurry, etc?

Poloman

Do they know the people who did it? Ie names and adresses. The judge isnt going to take the case on how seriously you were hurt (doctors report) assault is assault and if its on tv and you have a bouncer willing to testify then its all in your favour. If the judge views cctv you are sorted.

The only thing is you have to be prepared that they will then know you and where you live. Will they take revenge? Hardly. I would go ahead with it mate. Good luck.

Fiend-Foe

donvito99 wrote: »

Well a guard cant really stand up in court and say you had a few cuts and bruises. A report from a doctor could mean the difference between a prosecution and those scumbags walkin' free. Its also on CCTV, as Poloman says and there was bound to be alot of people around, so all in all, youand the guards have a very strong case.

Cool, but I'm in work now, if I go to the doc later I mean its really just a few scrapes, only one thats even a little bit deep on my ear. Like its nothing. I'd feel like I was wasting time. Also I can't really afford it at the moment.

I thought the premise would be enough, like I said, if you tried to stab someone and missed. The malicious intention to do harm was there. I thought that would be enough.

Maybe pics with a digital camera> (I guess they could be taken anytime)

If going to the doc is the only option well then so be it, I just though there would be enough. Thats all I wanted to know.

I thought maybe the Guard in question had a long night or something, wasn't bothered.

( No criticism to the guards there, just how I felt. But if thats the best course of action )

Fiend-Foe

donvito99 wrote: »

What do you mean by 'not definite'. Is it in black and white, side of shot, blurry, etc?

I mean when I was there last night it was not reviewed yet, not sure if the area I was standing in was covered.

So they said

donvito99

Fiend Foe,

Are you looking for compensation at all?

Or do you just want to see the looks on their faces in court?

Fiend-Foe

donvito99 wrote: »

Fiend Foe,

Are you looking for compensation at all?

Or do you just want to see the looks on their faces in court?

I just want the ****er to pay some price

(Not to me, compensation or anything)

And hopefully not think he can get away with the same casual violence over the weekend and somebody loses an eye or a chunk of their face or something. I was just lucky the way the glass broke, could have been well worse.

eroo

'Question for the Gardai'

OP, hold out until one of the Gardai on this forum comes online. As good as the intentions lads above have, they can't give you a solid answer. I'm sure a Garda will post soon enough.

Fiend-Foe

eroo wrote: »

'Question for the Gardai'

OP, hold out until one of the Gardai on this forum comes online. As good as the intentions lads above have, they can't give you a solid answer. I'm sure a Garda will post soon enough.

Cool thanks,

Mainly what I want clarified is whether there is enough there or if a docs report from me is essential because the message the Guards gave me last night was loud and clear

This will not go any further until I go to the station with a Doc's report.

I just thought there would be plenty there already to throw this guy in court.

But I don't really know...

So I would appreciate the opinion of a Garda, where should I take it from here?

deadwood

eroo wrote: »

'Question for the Gardai'

OP, hold out until one of the Gardai on this forum comes online. As good as the intentions lads above have, they can't give you a solid answer. I'm sure a Garda will post soon enough.

O.P.
That's the best bit of advice on here so far.

Can't comment on the actions of the garda on the night, as each case is different.

Also, a solicitor will give you proper advice, but talk to the investigating Garda about your concerns.

In broad terms though:

Take lots of photos, give the disc to the garda if he requires them. He can say the photos are consistent with your injuries and print up as many copies as are required.

A visit to your g.p. will confirm that you were injured and the extent of those injuries.
The main reason for this is there are different "degrees" of assault, if you like. I think these are fairly well explained here:http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/ZZA26Y1997.html

A medical report will help the DPP decide what offence the assailant will be prosecuted for.

Good luck with it.

Fiend-Foe

deadwood wrote: »

O.P.
That's the best bit of advice on here so far.

Can't comment on the actions of the garda on the night, as each case is different.

Also, a solicitor will give you proper advice, but talk to the investigating Garda about your concerns.

In broad terms though:

Take lots of photos, give the disc to the garda if he requires them. He can say the photos are consistent with your injuries and print up as many copies as are required.

A visit to your g.p. will confirm that you were injured and the extent of those injuries.
The main reason for this is there are different "degrees" of assault, if you like. I think these are fairly well explained here:http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/ZZA26Y1997.html

A medical report will help the DPP decide what offence the assailant will be prosecuted for.

Good luck with it.

Thanks Deadwood,

Its just that the injuries are pretty non-existent, I could do worse with a razor except for one cut. But they aren't much to write home about, I know I should have them documented, if thats the case, but I really can't shell out €50 for a GP visit, never mind a solicitor. I will have to borrow off family or friends.

Forgive my ignorance, but shouldn't the Guards be able to provide a doc to document the injuries of an assault victim? or do it themselves? Surely a Garda's statement of a cut up face is as good in court as a Doc's.

I'm not too sure how it works, but degrees of assault shouldn't have much to do with it. I just thought it might be more clean cut (No Pun!) like if you take a pint glass over someone's head its only a matter of luck as to how much you **** that person up. I feel this guy should be punished as he could have easily taken an eye or worse, ruined my good looks forever!

I guess its just my luck (and his) that that isn't what happened, otherwise it would be taken a lot more seriously and be a different 'degree' of assault.

I just hope this chap doesn't randomly attack somebody else and do worse.

deadwood

The injuries you suffered could have been a lot more serious and this will also be considered in deciding what offence the assailant is prosecuted for.

Again, every case is considered on its own merits.

I would really suggest talking to the Garda in question. He knows the ins and ous of your case. Advice on this forum can only be broad in nature.

The type of advice you are looking for might be more suited to the legal discussions forum.

dredre

If you're serious about getting these guys prosecuted(and/or suing them) you need a medical report. Simple fact is that in court, there will come a time when you have to say what injuries you sustained and this is far better coming from a doctor (who saw you at the time of the injury).

Often the gardai are able to photograph injuries themselves which is better than your (potentially photoshopped) home snaps.

Fiend-Foe

deadwood wrote: »

The injuries you suffered could have been a lot more serious and this will also be considered in deciding what offence the assailant is prosecuted for.

Again, every case is considered on its own merits.

I would really suggest talking to the Garda in question. He knows the ins and ous of your case. Advice on this forum can only be broad in nature.

The type of advice you are looking for might be more suited to the legal discussions forum.

Cool man,

Once again, I really appreciate the input.

Stay safe out there!

dredre wrote: »

If you're serious about getting these guys prosecuted(and/or suing them) you need a medical report. Simple fact is that in court, there will come a time when you have to say what injuries you sustained and this is far better coming from a doctor (who saw you at the time of the injury).



Often the gardai are able to photograph injuries themselves which is better than your (potentially photoshopped) home snaps.

That make a lot of sense too, of course. Thanks

TheNog

OP

I'm a bit late in arriving and you have already gotten the right advice. Th reason why we advise peolpe to go to the doctor is firstly to have the wounds medically examined and secondly for a medical opinion contained within the Medical report. We can describe the appearance of wounds themselves in our statement but at the end of the day we are not medically qualified. The medical report goes along way towards the prosecution.

I respect your decision to make the complaint and you are doing it for the right reason too.

Kudos

TheNog

Eru

Poloman wrote: »

You were assaulted. Its on CCTV. You shouldnt need a doctors report.. it just helps in the case against the accused.

You have a brilliant case and I would prosecute.

And your qualifications in this area are?

OP, ignoring the bad advise you got earlier I can only agree with Nog and Deadwood.

At the end of the day only a medical expert can say you were physically injured and if its consistant with being bottled much in the same way that only a doctor can pronounce someone dead and a pathologist how said person was killed, even if the police that found the body are currently searching for a head.

I would however be open to the distinct possibility that no member of staff from the bar will make a statement much less go to court. If the CCTV is good, doctors report good and the guys made some form of admission to the investigating Gardai I would say a pretty clear cut case.

deadwood

Karlitosway1978 wrote: »

..only a doctor can pronounce someone dead and a pathologist how said person was killed, even if the police that found the body are currently searching for a head.

Damnit. Better find that file again...or empty my locker.