Luas Line F - UPDATE

ro2

Just got this from the RPA:

Luas Line F - UPDATE

The Railway Procurement Agency (RPA) today announced the emerging preferred route corridor for the proposed Lucan-City Centre Luas Line (Line F). This line will connect communities in Lucan, Liffey Valley and Ballyfermot with Dublin ’s City Centre. Some 25 million extra passengers are expected to be added to the Luas network when this line comes into operation. A Luas line serving Lucan has been included in development plans for Dublin City Council and South Dublin County Council for many years and RPA was mandated to begin planning and design for this important project as part of the Government’s Transport 21 investment programme. The public response to RPA’s consultation has been very strong and detailed discussions have taken place with public representatives, local authorities, businesses and other key stakeholders in the communities to be served by the line.

The selected route is based on route options that were originally presented to the public in September 2007. The new line will be approximately 15 km in length and will provide interchange with the Luas Red Line, the proposed Metro West and Metro North lines, Iarnród Éireann services and a wide range of bus services.

Having selected the route corridor, RPA will begin the next phase of consultation focused on design. This consultation will confirm the specific location of the alignment, Luas stops, Park and Ride and a depot.

A detailed description of the route is available at http://www.rpa.ie/luas/about_luas/line_f

Further information is available from;

Railway Procurement Agency, Parkgate St, Dublin 8

Freephone: 1800 67 64 64

E-mail: info@rpa.ie

We would like to keep as many people as possible informed so please pass this e-mail and update on to anyone you think might be interested, they can sign-up for updates at www.rpa.ie under Contact Us.

Please note when you submit your contact details you agree to be added to the RPA Public Consultation Database. To remove your details from the Database simply send us an email to info@rpa.ie


All contact information provided to RPA will be treated a confidential; see www.rpa.ie for details of RPA Privacy Policy.


Regards,

Railway Procurement Agency

http://www.rpa.ie/upload/documents/Luas%20Line%20F%20Map%201008.jpg

loyatemu

it looks like a river its so meandering - how long is it going to take to get into town on that?!

also shares space with the red-line which is already going to be jammed once the Citywest extension is built.

all moot really though - I doubt line F will be built.

ciscokidder

Same here - more quarryvale customers ! Of course it will be built.

dowlingm

the line east of James' Hospital seems to be a duplicator for interconnector, just like BX is for metro. TCD is going to be the best served transit node in the world... meanwhile a broken down tram or emergency maintenance between James' and Blackhorse is going to be calamitous.

In terms of construction, I hope priority is given to the outer parts of the line rather than that east of James' until interconnector is operational for two reasons - the western link is less likely to have archeological delays and if demand on Red Line continues to increase it might allow sober second thought about the access route to the CBD/An Lar.

Interesting also that BX and Metro West/North are shown, but not line D - would that have encouraged people to think about running F east rather than south from Ballyfermot Village rather than doglegging to Inchicore/Heuston?

admiralofthefleet

what is the red outline on the road from christchurch through harolds cross into terenure, is it the rathfarnham luas?

Aard

No, it's just the N81.

lord lucan

goes past the top of my estate:D

i'd be surprised if i see it built in my lifetime though:rolleyes:

L1011

loyatemu wrote: »

also shares space with the red-line which is already going to be jammed once the Citywest extension is built.

Through an off-line section mostly, thankfully. Just two road junctions (Blackhorse and Suir Road) rather than on-road running.

murphaph

The bus along the N4 QBC will beat this thing into town every time. Waste of time and money. Invest it in better north-south roads in Lucan on which to run VERY frequent shuttle buses to and from the housing estates and the railways!

BluntGuy

Line F bobbles up and down all over the place. I can't see it being faster than a bus trip unless it's mostly segregated...


Also, looking at the map, I just wish that all of those proposed transport links existed NOW!

Metro North, all the Luas lines... even... eugh... Metro West (whatever it's meant to be)...

It'll be great to have all of that up and running...

But sadly, I have to pack the jovial optomist inside of me back into its little box, as I know there isn't a hope in hell of most of that stuff being built within its proposed Transport 21 window.

They should at the very least get cracking on either MN or Interconnector. Even ONE of them would go a long way to sorting out Dublin's transport mess.

dazberry

Glad they didn't run it down the middle of Inchicore and out Emmet Rd, but I can't see James St and Thomas St working out too well at all

D.

DWCommuter

murphaph wrote: »

The bus along the N4 QBC will beat this thing into town every time. Waste of time and money. Invest it in better north-south roads in Lucan on which to run VERY frequent shuttle buses to and from the housing estates and the railways!

Apart from the fact that I don't think it will ever be built, this quote is right on the money.

gjim

I realise that the RPA obviously have to respond to their political masters and a Luas for the western suburbs probably seemed like a great idea to shore up FF support in places like Lucan but given a remit like this, surely they could have tried to suggest something even defensible?

For some reason I feel reluctant to bash the RPA - probably because I want to see more trams/light rail lines built all over Dublin - but really this is absolutely awful. It has no redeeming features at all; in fact, if you were asked to given an example of how NOT TO spend money on light rail/trams, this would be perfect. Massive capital cost and disruption, slower than existing buses for 90% of trips and almost exact duplication of a faster higher capacity heavy rail commuter corridor. I'd almost rather the money be spent on connecting Tuam to Sligo! :eek:

Slice

What will happen to trams in the city centre? Will trams on line F use the loop while trams on the green line proceed to Liffey Junction?

Ckal

Slice wrote: »

What will happen to trams in the city centre? Will trams on line F use the loop while trams on the green line proceed to Liffey Junction?

I dunno. I'd like to be able to go from lets say Dawson Street to Christchurch and Meath Street to Connolly. In Bremen, you can go almost anywhere on the tram. Every tram is labelled with the end destination. So it would be so useful if you could be able to do the above.

But that route through Lucan is a bit bendy. I'd be a bit fed up if I lived at Newcastle Rd and had to bend through a town like that. But I guess the section from Cherry Orchard to Ballyfermot is straight so maybe that will be fast. And then the section of the red line that the trams will run on is also fast, so hopefully that will speed it up.

noelfirl

Kylemore road has fairly wide grass verges separating the houses from the road proper, so I would guess that one track might run down either side, thus a fairly quick section. Ditto for the wasteland space alongside the canal. Running through Liffey Valley could be fairly fast too due to the open tracts of land that can be acquired for full segregation, but the real problem is from Ballyfermot village all the way up to Coldcut. That road is only 2-and-a-half-arsed-bus-lane wide and unless the intention is to take the space in front of the shops in Ballyfermot and adjacent to the industrial estate opposite Cherry Orchard, that will be a really badly congested section. Not great folks

crocro

If this luas runs at the same speed as the red line, it will take about an hour to cover 15km lucan-dublin.

murphaph

It won't possibly be able to run as fast as the Red Line as the Red Line really only has a short 'slow bit' from James's to Connolly. Line F would have much much more interaction with traffic IMO. The fact that the short slow bit on the red line adds so much to journey times should be reason enough never to build more of its ilk.

Victor

Luas F could be operated such that it operates express from James to Blackhorse, knocking off a few minutes.

It is also designed with fewer stops from James to Trinity, again saving a few minutes.

Aard

Or maybe for the multiplex part the two lines could alternate which stops they stop at.
So:
Red Line: Blackhorse, Goldenbridge, Rialto, James'
Lucan Line: Drimnagh, Suir Road, Fatima, James'


And I wonder what colour they'll use for the line? My guess would be orange, as it seems that MN will have blue, while MW will have purple.

dowlingm

Victor wrote: »

Luas F could be operated such that it operates express from James to Blackhorse, knocking off a few minutes.

It is also designed with fewer stops from James to Trinity, again saving a few minutes.

Do stops that stretch of the Red Line have a bypass track? If not, won't it just get stuck behind Red Line stoppers?

L1011

dowlingm wrote: »

Do stops that stretch of the Red Line have a bypass track? If not, won't it just get stuck behind Red Line stoppers?

We're only talking a saving of a few minutes max here - the section of track there only takes about 5 mins to cover anyway. So while there is a risk of a hypothetical non-stop Line F tram getting caught behind a red line one, the risk is relatively low, seeing as there'll only be about 12 red line trams an hour at peak even by then.

Victor

Aard wrote: »

Or maybe for the multiplex part the two lines could alternate which stops they stop at.
So:
Red Line: Blackhorse, Goldenbridge, Rialto, James'
Lucan Line: Drimnagh, Suir Road, Fatima, James'


And I wonder what colour they'll use for the line? My guess would be orange, as it seems that MN will have blue, while MW will have purple.

Then how does one get from Blackhorse to Fatima?

spacetweek

murphaph wrote: »

The bus along the N4 QBC will beat this thing into town every time. Waste of time and money. Invest it in better north-south roads in Lucan on which to run VERY frequent shuttle buses to and from the housing estates and the railways!

Thirded. Grew up in Lucan and reckon the future DART, served by shuttle buses, is ftw. The new N4 QBC opening next year won't hit a traffic light until Palmerstown and Inchicore after that; doesn't return to city streets until Heuston.

Everyone near the old village will walk/cycle to the QBC; everyone south of the N4 in the Ballyowen area will head either north to the QBC or south to the DART as appropriate. No need for a crap Luas anymore that will be slower than the bus except maybe at rush hour.

Luas BX and D are far more important.

Aard

Victor wrote: »

Then how does one get from Blackhorse to Fatima?

One gets off at Rialto. It would add 5 mins tops to the journey time.

Anyway, I can't image the demand for such a journey would be that big.