Trinity Urban Myths

Stabshauptmann

There are a number of urban myths surrounding TCD, I think it adds a bit of character to the place. Some of them are just daft, though some of them seem plausible. I'm wondering if anyone here can help actually prove (or more likely disprove) some of them.

My three favourite ones are:

Oath of Allegiance

There are a few variations of this one, one is that its something you sign on registration, something you sign on graduation or something you sign before being allowed to use the library.

That should be an easy one to disprove, anyone care to take a stab?


Glass of Brandy
Another one is that (provided you're wearing your sword of course) you can ask for a glass of brandy during your exam.
I think this has to do with the fuddy-duddy dress code and names surrounding some TCD positions; but if such a rule did exist, where would it be? A good starting point, where are the regulations stipulating that invigilators at exams wear a cloak?

Shoot a priest
Anyone else ever hear the one about it being lawful to shoot a priest with a bow and arrow? Made me lol. A little bit batty and obviously started as a joke taken seriously by someone with the Queen's college chip on their shoulder. Interesting other variations of this is that the RCSI or RDS was founded by a trinity student after being expelled for shooting the provost in a duel.
I dont think those few warrant any effort to disprove?

/me waves

Mark200

Yeah I heard about the Brandy one from a friend, the priest thing sounds familiar too but not sure if I read it here or if I heard it from a friend.

Crash

The shoot a priest one, afaik,is an adapted version of a glaswegian urban myth about one of the bridges, I think. Might not be glaswegian, but its definitely not one that started in trinity.

Time Magazine

There is a library oath, not observed.

It's in the Calendar, under General Regulations.

Calendar, H15 wrote:

Library
66 Readers, including all undergraduates, are admitted to the Library reading rooms on
production of a current Identity Card and are required to observe the terms of the Library
declaration and the general Library regulations.
The Library declaration is:
‘Ego,...., solemniter promitto, me, quoties in Bibliothecam hujus Collegii venire contigerit, libros ceteramque Bibliothecae supellectilem sic tractaturum, ut superesse quam diutissime possint. Promitto etiam quod neque ipse librum aliquem asportabo, sponte corrumpam, interscribam, aut alio quovis modo abutar, nec ab aliis haec fieri (quantum in me est) permittam. Quae omnia et singula, et omnia Bibliothecae

Peslo

Under front square, lies the biggest underground wine cellar in the Country!



FACT.

As opposed to those over ground cellars!

Ron DMC

I like the one about Scholars being allowed ride their horse around campus. That'd be tons handy when you're trying to get from the Arts block to the Hamilton in the 5 minutes between lectures.

Stabshauptmann

The Economist wrote: »

There is a library oath, not observed.

It's in the Calendar, under General Regulations.

That doesnt mention Crown, king or queen just in case anyone is wondering...

Crash

There is the postgrdauate library form which uses the colleges full title therefore referencing the queen, however under it you're bound to the scholars fellow and provost of the college. Closest I've ever come across anyhow.

snappieT

Kaptain Redeye wrote: »

Glass of Brandy
Another one is that (provided you're wearing your sword of course) you can ask for a glass of brandy during your exam.
I think this has to do with the fuddy-duddy dress code and names surrounding some TCD positions; but if such a rule did exist, where would it be? A good starting point, where are the regulations stipulating that invigilators at exams wear a cloak?

This, I believe is true. You have to be a scholar. I've heard rumours of people holding up hundreds of people in RDS exams while the invigilators had to run out and buy a bottle of brandy.

Stabshauptmann

Ah we've all heard the stories, even from people who know the guy who did it, but I want to see it written somewhere.

I read the calendar, but its not there. Where would it be?

edit:

Calendar wrote:

Emoluments and privileges
emoluments and privileges: they
(a) have their Commons free of charge;
(b) are entitled to rooms free of charge for up to nine months of the year;
(c) receive a salary which, together with any grant they may receive from an outside body, shall
amount to not less than €253.95 per annum (after payment of the annual fee);
(d) are entitled to remission of the annual fee appropriate to their main course of study if they are
not in receipt of outside scholarships or grants, save that undergraduate scholars from non-
E.U. countries shall have their fees reduced by an amount corresponding to the appropriate
fee level of an Irish student.
...

Waiterships
20 Ten scholars, or other students, are appointed annually to say grace before and after meat
in the Dining Hall. They are called waiters. They receive a salary, paid quarterly, provided that
their duty has been satisfactorily discharged.
The waiters are selected by the Provost, in consultation with the Junior Dean, to whom
applicants must send their names before the last day of June. Regard is had in the selection to
the general character of the applicants.
21 The grace is repeated in Latin, and normally memoriter, in a form prescribed by the Statutes
of the College.

St Patrick’s Benevolent Society of Toronto prize
22 This prize, established in 1987, is funded by St Patrick’s Benevolent Society of Toronto.
The prize is awarded for the best performance in the annual scholarship examination to recognise
excellence in scholarship. Value, approximately €1,143.

...

2nd Edit:
Its not in the Calendar but its in the current college statutes, not only do Schols get free rent, but they shall "be entitled to accommodation in the College free of rent and servants’ wages." Oh Jeeves:pac:

goingnowhere

Kaptain Redeye wrote: »

Glass of Brandy
Another one is that (provided you're wearing your sword of course) you can ask for a glass of brandy during your exam.
I think this has to do with the fuddy-duddy dress code and names surrounding some TCD positions; but if such a rule did exist, where would it be?

Rules of conduct at examinations forbid you to bring anything to your seat other than pen, ruler etc, anything more must be listed at the top of the exam paper. So its impossible to invoke this rule.

Last guy to try got dragged in to meet the Junior Dean the day afterwards and was fined for no gown and no sword. Thats what I'm told

There was a project to review all these strange rules, most disappeared back in the mid 1960's when the College got a even bigger restructuring than the recent one.

A good starting point, where are the regulations stipulating that invigilators at exams wear a cloak?

Thats really easy. To be an invigilator you must be a postgrad, therefore it follows you have a undergraduate degree and therefore are permitted gowns in line with your standing. Its in the university calendar. There is no requirement to wear the gown anyway.

Stabshauptmann

I was just coming back here to post an update. That getting dragged into the dean story just sounds like more urban myth.


Yep all these odd rules were abolished in the 60's, the current college statutes came into force in April, 1966

If there is anything about the brandy it would be in either the Charters of 1592 or the updated 1637 or the Letters Patent of 1637 of 1857, or 1911.

edit: Tried to do some searches on bailii but it keeps crashing.

The full title of the original charter was
"Charter or Letters Patent bearing date the 3rd day of March 1592 granted by her late Majesty Queen Elizabeth, the Provost, Fellows and Scholars of the College of the Holy and Undivided Trinity of Queen Elizabeth near Dublin"

mathew

Numerous underground tunnels...

Kwekubo

Kaptain Redeye wrote: »

Interesting other variations of this is that the RCSI or RDS was founded by a trinity student after being expelled for shooting the provost in a duel.

That one sounds to me like it's inspired by the (true) story of Cambridge being founded by a group of students who were chased out of Oxford.

Ron DMC

mathew wrote: »

Numerous underground tunnels...

Thanks completely true that one. Although other than the Front Square wine cellar, most of the other tunnels are maintenance tunnels for gas and hot water pipes.

Myth wrote: »

/me waves

I only just got that now.

Crash

Redeye: there are a number of lecturers and fellows who have reputedly over the course of their time in Trinity endevoured to find loopholes and things like this in the statutes. I remember hearing that Brendan Tangney, who was junior dean, and is now warden of halls tested one or two, and at a guess i'd lay money on Míchál Mac an Airchinnigh, a lecturer in the CS department who previously ran for provost, would have an idea of a few of them that do still exist.

Oh, actually, xEducat would be the best one to ask if he still posted here regularly, seeing as he was/is the research assistant to the statutes review working group.

ronny mitchell wrote:

Thanks completely true that one. Although other than the Front Square wine cellar, most of the other tunnels are maintenance tunnels for gas and hot water pipes.

and incredibly dirty and dusty and hot.

Stabshauptmann

mathew wrote: »

Numerous underground tunnels...

Thats not a myth, I've seen them, in fact there are a lot of tunnles around dublin. they have practical applications

Crash

The one I always wanted to go into, but never got round to, is the one that leads from Foster place under Dame St. Think it was Myth that told me about that one

DublinWriter

Kwekubo wrote: »

That one sounds to me like it's inspired by the (true) story of Cambridge being founded by a group of students who were chased out of Oxford.

In Cambridge, they say that Oxford was founded by a group of students who found that the large amount of boosing and debauchery in Cambridge was interfering with their studies.

There's also the old story about the Campanile Bell going off if a virgin walks under it.

Crash

that can't be true, i've walked under it and......oops.

tricky D

Ronny Mitchell wrote: »

Although other than the Front Square wine cellar, most of the other tunnels are maintenance tunnels for gas and hot water pipes.

Whenever the snow falls, you can see the route of one tunnel running north/south across Parliament/Front Square from the east side of the Chapel to the side of of the Exam Hall/Public Theatre. It might be accessible from the grill covered steps behind the 1937.

Ron DMC

tricky D wrote: »

Whenever the snow falls, you can see the route of one tunnel running north/south across Parliament/Front Square from the east side of the Chapel to the side of of the Exam Hall/Public Theatre. It might be accessible from the grill covered steps behind the 1937.

I've noticed the snow melty thing as well, presumably the tunnel is heated or contains hot water pipes too.

I doubt it's all that easy to enter through the 1937, but there's definitely access from downstairs in the Buttery/Dining Hall building, ever wonder where that door beside the disabled jacks leads to?

Crash

What about the door in the mini-graveyard (no idea if there are actually bodies there or if they're purely commemorative) that leads under the chapel?

Ron DMC

Going Forward wrote: »

What about the door in the mini-graveyard (no idea if there are actually bodies there or if they're purely commemorative) that leads under the chapel?

There are bodies there, and as far as I know the door just leads to a crypt, we should ask Mark_Vader as he and someone else explored it about this time last year.

tricky D

Ronny Mitchell wrote: »

I've noticed the snow melty thing as well, presumably the tunnel is heated or contains hot water pipes too.

Something like that.

Ronny Mitchell wrote: »

I doubt it's all that easy to enter through the 1937, but there's definitely access from downstairs in the Buttery/Dining Hall building, ever wonder where that door beside the disabled jacks leads to?

The entrance isn't inside the 1937, walk around it and there's a flat metal grill in the ground with steps descending.

Going Forward

Going Forward wrote: »

The one I always wanted to go into, but never got round to, is the one that leads from Foster place under Dame St. Think it was Myth that told me about that one

Yeah myself and the soon-to-be Dr. Charles Larkin were given a tour of 3&4 Foster Place (not to mention 5 which was then sold) and the guy showed us the way down to the old bank vaults. Basically this tunnel just continued under Dame Street. Not sure where it ends up.

Enter at your own risk! I'm accepting no responsibility should anyone decide to go exploring it, btw. The value of tunnels may rise as well as fall.

Time Magazine

The RDS was founded when the Phil were expelled from the College. They were expelled for fatally shooting a Junior Dean.

Tricity Bendix

Surely only one of them did the shooting?

EGaffney

One would expect so, yes. In canon, however, it was the Dublin Philosophical Society which shot a Junior Dean of some sort, and then went and founded a Royal Society fashioned after the Royal Academy, I think.

And it's certainly true that you have to bind yourself to the Provost, Fellows and Scholars in order to take out books as a postgrad. I bound myself just yesterday.

antiselfdual

Kaptain Redeye wrote: »

Oath of Allegiance

There are a few variations of this one, one is that its something you sign on registration, something you sign on graduation or something you sign before being allowed to use the library.

That should be an easy one to disprove, anyone care to take a stab?

New Scholars and Fellows do swear an oath (in Latin) to the Provost...

Peslo

EGaffney wrote: »

I bound myself just yesterday.

Dirty.

I thought the one about the Provost not actually living at Number 1 Trinity College, but rather living at number 1 Grafton street via a tunnel from Number 1 Trinity was pretty cool.

But it's not actually a myth. It would be, em, "cooler", if it was I think.

Podge_irl

EGaffney wrote: »

And it's certainly true that you have to bind yourself to the Provost, Fellows and Scholars in order to take out books as a postgrad. I bound myself just yesterday.

So what fun things can we make you do?...

duffman90210

AFAIK scholars are allowed to stand on the grass where it says you can't, as too can all undergraduates on graduation day, I think.

mathew

The grazing of Sheep on the lawns is allowed by Schollars....

EGaffney

Podge_irl wrote: »

So what fun things can we make you do?...

Bring back library books. I'm afraid the terms are quite narrow.

Crash

Peslo wrote: »

Dirty.

I thought the one about the Provost not actually living at Number 1 Trinity College, but rather living at number 1 Grafton street via a tunnel from Number 1 Trinity was pretty cool.

But it's not actually a myth. It would be, em, "cooler", if it was I think.

That tunnel is the coldest thing i've ever come across in my life.

oh, by the way, a meeting in the boardroom of the provosts house was also one of those things I greatly enjoyed, simply for what it was.

Stabshauptmann

duffman90210 wrote: »

AFAIK scholars are allowed to stand on the grass where it says you can't, as too can all undergraduates on graduation day, I think.

Nope (at least not under the current rules). the only people allowed on the grass are those participating in authorised sporting events

Ron DMC

Kaptain Redeye wrote: »

Nope (at least not under the current rules). the only people allowed on the grass are those participating in authorised sporting events

Actually, the grass in Fellow's Square is only to be walked on by Fellows of the college and members of the croquet club.

Peslo

Ronny Mitchell wrote: »

Actually, the grass in Fellow's Square is only to be walked on by Fellows of the college and members of the croquet club.

So does that mean that the guys who cut the grass are fellows??

but surely if your a felllow, you can find a better job than that right??

Stabshauptmann

Ronny Mitchell wrote: »

Actually, the grass in Fellow's Square is only to be walked on by Fellows of the college and members of the croquet club.

Which one is fellows square?

In general, according to the calendar "No persons are permitted to walk on the lawns, or to cross the playing fields unless they are participating in games or in training authorised by D.U.C.A.C."

Ive heard it said many times only scholars and athletes allowed on the lawn, which isnt true. Just being an athlete doesnt entitle you to walk on the lawns as you see fit, nor does it say anywhere that scholars have special lawn privileges.

This all seems very funny, arguing over who can walk on the grass

I think the point about scholars being allowed walk on the grass is due to the foundation scholars 'owning' part of Trinity. So basically you can't tell your landlord what to do.

Stabshauptmann

Unless one particular individual owns a majority of the college, that logic fails. Can one minority shareholder tell a company what to do? Can any one individual citizen tell the government what to do?

Ron DMC

Kaptain Redeye wrote: »

Which one is fellows square?

My mistake, I meant New Square (in front of the Museum Building where croquet is played).

Fellow's square is that bit outside the Arts Block with the sculpture in the middle.

Kaptain Redeye

Kaptain Redeye wrote: »

Unless one particular individual owns a majority of the college, that logic fails. Can one minority shareholder tell a company what to do? Can any one individual citizen tell the government what to do?

You're comparing modern day logic to Trinity's ye olde logic. Nowadays it doesn't make sense, but I suspect that's where it came from.

Stabshauptmann

But are you sure such a rule exists?

Kaptain Redeye

Kaptain Redeye wrote: »

But are you sure such a rule exists?

Sure? Of course not. I've never seen it written down. But I suspect there's truth in that myth.

postcard

Has anyone heard that story that parts of the sculpture of sphere with in a sphere outside the Berkley will be filled in when certain diseases are cured? I asked a guide in the Vatican museums where they have a larger version if it was true and he hadn't heard of that story.