Suggestions needed!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Genevieve

Hi all,

I listed a thread before about accreditation of the BA (hons) Psychology degree running in Waterford....

Our course was hoping to apply for accreditation of the degree before we finish which is in two years. The degree is condensed into 3 years. We have the right subjects on the course (check it out on WIT page). However, the major problem is that this year new psych. students started and the college itself let in too many students onto the degree, so now the ratio of staff to students is too high which affects, of course, our course being accredited by the PSI.

I'm very worried about this !!! and the problem can only be resolved if the college registrar lets in far less people next year (actually exactly half the amount of people next year). I don't see this happening at all and I've spoken to our head of the psych. degree about it. She said that they may be able to change this for next year but its not guaranteed. However, she thought that there was a very good chance that our year would get partial accreditation from the PSI until the degree in Waterford got themselves sorted out!!!!!!!!! Something just doesn't quite add up though.

Without our degree being accredited, we can't go on to do any post grads in psychology or can we?????????? and are there are loop-holes ir ways of getting out of this?

Could I do three years in Waterford and transfer to a university and do 1 year there or should I try and finish this year and then apply for a transfer???

If I did finish my degree in Waterford, what can I do? I have an a goal that I'm aiming for when this degree is finished and I want to doors to be open for me to study a masters and so on.... in a psychology area. If we are not going to be accredited, it looks pretty bleak!

What would you do if you were in my position and you were very serious in wanting a career in psychology?

kitkat.3b4t

Hi
The situation sounds complicated. Have you sought advice from the PSI? I think in your situation I would try to transfer to an accredited programme.

Genevieve

Hey,

Thanks for advice. I've found a solution. Happy now

Xander82

I personally don't agree with psychology being taught outside of Universities. I don't think that there should be Psychology taught in any form at WIT or any other IT.
What does anyone else think?

Genevieve

Hi,

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and that's ok. However firstly, ITs now have Honours degrees throughout the country and therefore they are not taught from cert upwards.

Secondly, on the WIT hons psych degree there are all bar one lecturer who has their doctorate. Three of whom recieved their education at Trinity and a further two have their undergraduate from UCD and doctorates from Trinity.

Finally, if you take a look at the course syllabus, you will find similarites with other universities around Ireland teaching Hons Psychology degrees.

I think you may be coming from the old stock of thinking. You should look into it further and prove me wrong though!

What are your taughts on the Psychology degree from the Open University?:)

Xander82

Well the Open University is indeed a University.

I may be old-fashioned, but I am myself under 30 years of age. I am growing ever more concerned that the hard-earned degrees, especially in psychology, we have are becoming devalued by these easy-entry courses.

I can see that psychology at UCD is lower than it was, at 500 points, whereas this course at WIT is 340. Thats a massive discrepancy in the quality of student being admitted, and the future potential quality of psychologists in Ireland in years to come.

The quality of lecturer is not something I find relevant to this argument. Im sure they are fine psyshologists and fine lecturers. I just believe that if someone wants to become a Psychologist, they can avail of the options which are already there in our Universities.

Genevieve

Point taken.

I understand where you are coming from and it is my concern also. I'm a mature student myself under 30 and my concern this year was the low points entry.

My concern about the points, is not about someones academic ability. A fantastic leaving certificate does not make you a more intelligent idividual academically. I'm sure you know that already as you have studied psychology yourself and must have a good grounding on "intelligence". My concern is the fact that the points are so low means that too manys students have gained entry into the course and therefore this creates massive problems.

Well, to put it to you, I have applied for a transfer to a university as I have a goal in mind and I will get there.

Also, an undergraduate degree does not make you a psychologist. Those that are appropriate and suitable for further study and careers in a psychology area are chosen from the best. So, as for your concern about the quality of psychologists in Ireland within the future..... I don't find it relevant.

I think you are probably highly snobbish. Believe me, I was like you before also... but I got my head out of the clouds.:D

Xander82

I probably am a bit snobby, but I worked hard to get my Leaving Cert, my degree and my Masters. I have respect for what I have done and want the best for this discipline which is my career.

I know the Leaving Cert is not the full-stop on Intelligence. But I must say, in my oopinion, it is as reliable a predictor of someones ability and work ethic as most other measures, and it is all we have for now. Most people with the relevant ability to do Psychology as a career should be able to hit the 400 point mark without exactly killing themselves.

As it is in Ireland there are too many Pschology graduates for the number of jobs which are there. AP positions are rare and virtually impossible to get. I dont think we need more graduates until the profession grows within this country. Especially not IT students!!! ( )

Genevieve

AAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!

I'd love a face-to-face arguement with you. No-one ever undermined me before:eek::) You just can't be a woman!

Most teenagers don't give a damn about the future nor their leaving certs and really want to be superstars or travel the world and what not. So, they should. The more parents put pressure on kids, more so they are likely to rebel. I have one friend who actually never did his leaving cert. at all, he was expelled and is now years later a very highly succesful lawyer:P and that is no word of a lie.... and it is very difficult to be a succesful lawyer. So the big LC is not everything!

You must have been the nerd who got the 600+ points. I know afew of those aswell....... Oh my God you are so annoying

Not The Real Scarecrow

Totally agree with Genevieve.
I think Xander that your elitist attitude towards psychology highlights a big problem that every field faces.In my experience such individuals have struggled to get into their field and once there , are scared that they might some how loose their footing because of increased competition(competition being a good thing,that helps every thing evolve and grow).It's generally insecurity.The fact that people might be bothered about I.T.'s teaching psychology is ridiculous as ,as every one knows the degree is only an entry point into the field, any degree no matter if its from a uni or an I.T. is useless unless an individual is going to pursue it further.A degree thought 40 hours a week with proper contact hours is obviously more valuable than a home course with limited contact hours from open uni.
Such ridiculous Elitist attitudes generally end up stunting any fields natural growth as it inevitably locks out people that may eventually contribute significantly ,or may go on and be very successful in their own right and have a positive effect on peoples lives.
I also find it very funny that some one that's doing sports psychology (may as wellbe life coaching for jocks)can be snobby and try and come and put down some one who is obviously enthusiastic about psychology, if you were as great as you make yourself out to be then you should have nothing to fear about people competing against you for work.However,I'm sure when you grow up a bit more and actually associate more with proper psychologists you might actually have a less snobby view.

electrofilth

Xander82 wrote: »

I probably am a bit snobby, but I worked hard to get my Leaving Cert, my degree and my Masters. I have respect for what I have done and want the best for this discipline which is my career.

I know the Leaving Cert is not the full-stop on Intelligence. But I must say, in my oopinion, it is as reliable a predictor of someones ability and work ethic as most other measures, and it is all we have for now. Most people with the relevant ability to do Psychology as a career should be able to hit the 400 point mark without exactly killing themselves.

As it is in Ireland there are too many Pschology graduates for the number of jobs which are there. AP positions are rare and virtually impossible to get. I dont think we need more graduates until the profession grows within this country. Especially not IT students!!! ( )

the higher points a university course has is because of the demand of people who want to get into it, not a reflection of how smart you need to be to do it, or the intelligence required to work in that area.

I failed the leaving cert, on purpose,I didnt care for it, cause I was a confused angry teenager, now I am 28 and want to study psychology as a mature studant and your snobbish attitude offends me.

So you worked hard, big deal , you should be proud of yourself and not be wasting your time begrudging anyone who ends up in your profession that didnt break their balls studying for the LC. to get an amount of points that you deem appropriate.

There are plenty of really intelligent people I know who would make ****e psychologists , and many of average intelligence who would be fit for the job.The leaving cert fails this reality of personality vs. graded intelligence.

You say you " I have respect for what I have done " what the hell does that mean?

And because there are now too many psychology graduates in Ireland, and that more graduates are not needed, well what if someone was to say this to you while you filled out your CAO form and said "no, sorry now no more room for graduates.." Its all grand for you to say once you have graduated that there is not enough work, but you are assuming all graduates want to go straight into employment in Ireland, not further education or perhaps working abroad.

I think its time for you to get off your high horse!

Doghouse

Xander82 wrote: »

I personally don't agree with psychology being taught outside of Universities. I don't think that there should be Psychology taught in any form at WIT or any other IT.
What does anyone else think?

I think that's absolute rubbish. You've obviously never been a student in an IT. I have a fair bit of third level experience having done two degrees and currently doing a masters and I can honestly say that my first degree (done in an IT - and I hate to shatter your elitist bubble but we mostly had well over 500 points) was easily the most difficult, content-wise. My second degree was in psychology and was done in a Dublin university. Everyone there had gotten whatever points were necessary (think it was around 530) and I couldn't believe the number of people who had absolutely no clue about life and had obviously just gotten through the LC by memorising Leeson St notes. Some of them hadn't a clue how to analyse or question the articles that they were presented with. If we'd been like that in my first degree class we'd have failed. Not saying the psychology course wasn't good - it really was and it was challenging - but the idea that university courses are always somehow superior to IT ones is completely ignorant and blinkered. Also, academia isn't everything; life experience, empathy and common sense are also hugely important and you don't necessarily learn those in university.

Genevieve

Thank you. I thought I was fighting this gobsh**e alone

p.pete

Play nicely

eth0_

Meatwad wrote: »

A degree thought 40 hours a week with proper contact hours is obviously more valuable than a home course with limited contact hours from open uni.

Absolute bullsh*t. The OU course is as difficult as the TCD and DBS psych degrees (having seen their coursework and some exams). You clearly have no idea how an OU degree works. Their psych degree is rated extremely highly amongst all the 'traditional' uni's in the UK. And I might add that it's much harder to get a first with the OU - on my psych degree, a 2:2 is equivalent to a 2:1 in a traditional Irish uni.

Also, it's "taught", not "thought".

Electrofilth - I do think it should be made explicitly clear to leaving cert or mature students that psychology is an extremely difficult area to get into, and that there are a pathetic amount of postgraduate places in the subject in Ireland, meaning they will most likely have to go to the UK or further afield to train..

hotspur

Despite the rather adolescent way Xander was putting across his argument there is a valid point to be made about protecting the integrity of a degree subject. That protection comes in the form of its recognition by an accrediting agency. Any 2 bit private college might offer a degree in medicine but it would be worthless if it weren't accredited and so wouldn't affect the integrity of medical degrees from elsewhere.

The Psychological Society of Ireland obviously doesn't consider the WIT psychology degree to be worthy of accreditation at this time so the existence of it does not harm the integrity of other accredited psychology degrees. This is the agency and the BPS in Britain who are the arbiters of the worth of psychology degrees not the CAO.

Also as Doghouse alluded to there is much more to a career in psychology than intelligence. Sure people who do psychology in WIT because they couldn't get in elsewhere are probably less likely to become academics but that doesn't mean they wouldn't make good counselors for example.

And judging by the language and tone of both Xander and Genevieve I doubt either of them have much to worry about a career in academia anyway.

Not The Real Scarecrow

eth0_ wrote: »

Absolute bullsh*t. The OU course is as difficult as the TCD and DBS psych degrees (having seen their coursework and some exams). You clearly have no idea how an OU degree works. Their psych degree is rated extremely highly amongst all the 'traditional' uni's in the UK. And I might add that it's much harder to get a first with the OU - on my psych degree, a 2:2 is equivalent to a 2:1 in a traditional Irish uni.

Also, it's "taught", not "thought".

Electrofilth - I do think it should be made explicitly clear to leaving cert or mature students that psychology is an extremely difficult area to get into, and that there are a pathetic amount of postgraduate places in the subject in Ireland, meaning they will most likely have to go to the UK or further afield to train..

Calm down there, if you could read properly you'd realise that I wasn't saying that the open uni is easy or any less of a course.I was mearly saying that the more contact hours you have the less amount of work you have to do on your own.I have a friend doing an open uni psychology degree and I see how difficult it is for him with time management etc.
Sorry if you took it up wrong, maybe I didn't explain myself properly and that is my fault, but seriously dude calm down.
Oh and thanks for pointing out my spelling mistake, I'm sure that having such a critical eye must make you the life of the party and a real popular fella.

eth0_

A> I'm not a 'fella'

B> You should maybe read over your posts before you submit them because it absolutely looked like you were saying the OU isn't as good as a 'normal' degree, hence the angry reaction from me, someone who is in the final year of their OU psych degree that has taken 4 years so far.

riff-raff

I see a lot of anger out there wonder what Frued would say:P.. And here's some love form a mature 4th year psych. stundent in TCD the most difficult uni. to be a free thinker in ...they tell you in your 1st year to think out side the box and for the next 4 years your suppose to do what your told ..:rolleyes: at least I would say with open uni. your free to make rational judgements without tradiontional confines of the the politics of college life...:cool:

Genevieve

And judging by the language and tone of both Xander and Genevieve I doubt either of them have much to worry about a career in academia anyway.

There is no harm in an arguement online. To be honest, I haven't exactly lost sleep over it. If this was offline, my thoughts on the matter would be very different. Hence, my pretence name and so forth!

Thank you, you've just furthered my persistence in getting a career in academia. I have every intention of doing so and I will definately get there.

To me this is a bit of online fun and I really don't think there is any need for you to insult me as I haven't done so to you. I find your comment highly insulting.

My last comment to Xander was meant lightheartedly.

I'd just ask you kindly, not to speak about my academic ability as I find it disgusting of you.

I think its time to call this arguement to a halt!

riff-raff

Genevieve wrote: »

And judging by the language and tone of both Xander and Genevieve I doubt either of them have much to worry about a career in academia anyway.

There is no harm in an arguement online. To be honest, I haven't exactly lost sleep over it. If this was offline, my thoughts on the matter would be very different. Hence, my pretence name and so forth!

Thank you, you've just furthered my persistence in getting a career in academia. I have every intention of doing so and I will definately get there.

To me this is a bit of online fun and I really don't think there is any need for you to insult me as I haven't done so to you. I find your comment highly insulting.

My last comment to Xander was meant lightheartedly.

I'd just ask you kindly, not to speak about my academic ability as I find it disgusting of you.

I think its time to call this arguement to a halt!

Have to agree ....there be a lot of peeps on boards that me thinks takes things to seriously ...life is just to short .. and good look with your chosen choice of course:) It can be hard in academia land but enjoy the challenge

ilovechocolate

ok i'm new to this boards thing so bear with me if i'm not doing this right i don't really want to get my head ripped off!

i'm a 6th year student thinking of doing psychology so i'm just wondering do any of you psychology people out there have any advice for me? is it really that difficult to get into further study?

riff-raff

ilovechocolate wrote: »

ok i'm new to this boards thing so bear with me if i'm not doing this right i don't really want to get my head ripped off!

i'm a 6th year student thinking of doing psychology so i'm just wondering do any of you psychology people out there have any advice for me? is it really that difficult to get into further study?

First of all I love the name cooool!!!
If its what you want to do go for it
Only took me 20 years to get back in to learning so I wont knock anybody for trying....
Get your points ..think of what college you like to go to and aim for that goal ..dont be afraid to take your second choice if you dont qualify for the first round ..
and most off all enjoy the social side of college life ..
just wish I did the whole scene years ago:o

eth0_

riff-raff wrote: »

at least I would say with open uni. your free to make rational judgements without tradiontional confines of the the politics of college life...:cool:

Nah, it's much the same on any undergrad course. It's not just psych courses that suffer from this.

electrofilth

eth0_ wrote: »

Absolute bullsh*t. The OU course is as difficult as the TCD and DBS psych degrees (having seen their coursework and some exams). You clearly have no idea how an OU degree works. Their psych degree is rated extremely highly amongst all the 'traditional' uni's in the UK. And I might add that it's much harder to get a first with the OU - on my psych degree, a 2:2 is equivalent to a 2:1 in a traditional Irish uni.

Also, it's "taught", not "thought".

Electrofilth - I do think it should be made explicitly clear to leaving cert or mature students that psychology is an extremely difficult area to get into, and that there are a pathetic amount of postgraduate places in the subject in Ireland, meaning they will most likely have to go to the UK or further afield to train..

i didnt say that i was quoting yer man on his high horse

Genevieve

hotspur wrote: »

Despite the rather adolescent way Xander was putting across his argument there is a valid point to be made about protecting the integrity of a degree subject. That protection comes in the form of its recognition by an accrediting agency. Any 2 bit private college might offer a degree in medicine but it would be worthless if it weren't accredited and so wouldn't affect the integrity of medical degrees from elsewhere.

The Psychological Society of Ireland obviously doesn't consider the WIT psychology degree to be worthy of accreditation at this time so the existence of it does not harm the integrity of other accredited psychology degrees. This is the agency and the BPS in Britain who are the arbiters of the worth of psychology degrees not the CAO.

Also as Doghouse alluded to there is much more to a career in psychology than intelligence. Sure people who do psychology in WIT because they couldn't get in elsewhere are probably less likely to become academics but that doesn't mean they wouldn't make good counselors for example.

And judging by the language and tone of both Xander and Genevieve I doubt either of them have much to worry about a career in academia anyway.

The last point to be made before, I leave this topic as it was a bit of laugh and has now gone mad...

WIT have not applied for accreditation yet as usually a course has to be running 3 years before it will be accredited and also alot of criteria have been met but certain criteria has not been met. Therefore, they will not be applying for accreditation until the time is right. So, being worthy of acceptance doesn't come into it:)

Not The Real Scarecrow

The funny thing aout it all is that all the crap on here is from people who really should know better(me included).I bought my Phd. off a fella on the interweb thing and that was really difficult because of my adult illiteracy ( pointed out by Etho) and the fact that I have no hands.So don't any one here tell me about hardships....

riff-raff

eth0_ wrote: »

Nah, it's much the same on any undergrad course. It's not just psych courses that suffer from this.

I stand corrected .. thought as much!! no matter what course you do its always some idot in Admin,(but not all of Admin are idots) that seems to me to go out of their way to make life as difficult as possible for students...:p