SAS trainers "denounce gung ho" armed Police

exbootie

SAS trainers denounce ‘gung ho’ armed police



http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article567961.ece




Robert Winnett


TWO senior SAS soldiers who trained many of the firearms teams now serving in Britain’s police forces have warned of their concerns about the officers’ skills and psychological suitability for the job. The two SAS officers, who have left active service, claim the police they trained had not been subjected to adequate psychological and physical tests to establish whether or not they were suitable to use firearms. The police officers were often “gung ho” and unfit.

The soldiers believe members of the Metropolitan police team that shot dead Jean Charles de Menezes, the innocent Brazilian, on the London Underground in July would have been among those they trained, although they are not certain.
The two men have detailed their concerns in a written statement to The Sunday Times. The Independent Police Complaints Commission (IPCC) is expected to study their claims as part of its investigation into how de Menezes, wrongly suspected of being a would-be suicide bomber, came to be shot by a team from the Met’s CO19 firearms unit.

Leaked documents from the IPCC showed that de Menezes was not behaving suspiciously, as had been claimed, but was restrained by an officer before 11 bullets were fired at him at close range. Three missed.
A spokesman for the IPCC said: “If there are concerns being expressed about the wider issues of selection and training, I’m sure our investigation team would look at the evidence and make recommendations.”

The two soldiers describe a number of alarming incidents during police training at the regiment’s base in Hereford. The trainers have no authority to fail police officers they believe are unsuited to the job.
One of the soldiers said: “When the tension starts to rise and the adrenaline is flowing, the ‘red mist’ seems to descend on armed police officers who become very trigger-happy. This has been shown time and again in training exercises.”

The second soldier said: “We thought that police firearms officers were far more concerned with their personal image, dressing in body armour and looking ‘gung ho’, rather than their professional capabilities. I’m not surprised at the number of mistakes over the years.
“There is no assessment of physical fitness, no psychological profiling, nothing. It’s a major problem.”

metman

This Times' article is 3 years old. What point are you trying to make, as its lost on me?

exbootie

metman wrote: »

This Times' article is 3 years old. What point are you trying to make, as its lost on me?

The points raised are still relevant, inc in the Republic.

Especially in regards to firearms officers not being psychologically profiled.


Do you get it now ?

metman

What I get from your posts is that Seals are better than Rangers and the SAS are better than armed police. You learn something every day.

Speaking of psychological profiling.....



:rolleyes:

CLADA

"SAS denounce gung ho armed police"

Just had a quick check of the calendar to confirm it's not April 1st.

m4j

Speaking of psychological profiling.....



Metman, I was going to make a very simular point, but you said it so well. Classic.

exbootie

metman wrote: »

What I get from your posts is that Seals are better than Rangers and the SAS are better than armed police. You learn something every day.

Speaking of psychological profiling.....



:rolleyes:

God help us if they ever give you a gun, if a thread causes you that much angst.


Go and post more of your pretty ERU pics.

JonAnderton

my LCD tv is much better than a plasma tv..and it works well at high altitude also.

Sorry,we are making irrelevant statements arent we.
Can i ask the op what physcoligical profiling is given to police..and military while were on the subject..you an ex marine?

metman

God help us indeed. Pray they never give me a badge either. Can you imagine?

JonAnderton

i mean,god forbid any of us actually DID what we all say we do..

metman

Jon I took it exbootie was a reference to bootneck too, but my best mate in the job is an ex-bootneck, and he's no walter.... :rolleyes:

m4j

Hi Exbootie,

Reading your post I personally found it hard to know what your point was, the fact that the article was three years old and since this time I understand major reviews were put in place in the UK, metman I am sure will correct me on that if I am wrong.

I note that your concern is in relation to Psychological Profiling for Fireaqrms Officers here, I however could not see what you were basing your concerns on i.e. the facts or reason for your concern.

Knowing the service as I do from outside and therefore slightly different to those within the service I think it may be a little unfair to attach a three year old newspaper report to the workings and professionalism of those serving in such demanding units.

The Walter Mitty come back was for me a light hearted comeback, and I think should be seen that way.

If it helps the posters here are without doubt the most insightful and professional contributors and moderators on any forum, and therefore there is much to learn from such a site.

Wishing you well

JonAnderton

here here m4j

I know a few exbootnecks in the job as well..hmmmm

metman

You're not rubber-dagger by any chance are you exbootie?

lmtduffy

I thought this was about shoes, as in trainers,,,

the_syco

exbootie wrote: »

The points raised are still relevant, inc in the Republic.

Especially in regards to firearms officers not being psychologically profiled.

Do you have proof of this? No? Then why accuse them?

Eru

I bought a pair of runners a year ago called 'RBX' which I thought was some brand I didnt know until my younger and cooler brother pointed out thats 'RBK' which is what Reebok out on their skating runners.

So at some point in life I didnt know everything. Thankfully thats been corrected and Im now all knowing

Incidently, werent there stories about US soldiers being traumatised, trained to kill and commiting crimes during the Vietnam war? Hey, 3 years, 30 years and a different country. Whats the difference? Now soldiers are tucked into bed during training and shown how to defeat the enemy with hugs and kisses :P

deadwood

lmtduffy wrote: »

I thought this was about shoes, as in trainers,,,

Beaten to the post (crap pun intended).
I thought karlitosway had too with his rbk bit.

civdef

I think a moratorium on posts mentioning super sneaky sneaky military SF units is called for.

Phototoxin

lets just cut the the chase - any time we hear about gardai and guns its always bad. Even the incidents we dont hear about (but ones knows locally or from first hand experience) are bad

Gardi Shickiloni + Guns = BAAAAAD

civdef

Not a particularly helpful post there...

deadwood

Is it me, or are some of the threads starting to look the same?