Why isn't this forum in Politics?

Húrin

Why is boards out to de-politicise environmentalism, just like the mainstream media is?

aidan_walsh

Because its a social issue, not a political one.

Húrin

aidan_walsh wrote: »

Because its a social issue, not a political one.

You think that water, transport and climate change, etc, are not political issues? What is government for if not to sort these out?

mumhaabu

Húrin wrote: »

You think that water, transport and climate change, etc, are not political issues? What is government for if not to sort these out?

umm...

Water, We have plenty the fact we have too much may become a political issue with flooding and it only ever becomes one if water charges or their mention rears its ugly head.

Transport, is more of infrastructural issue and we are progressing well with new motorways and need more.

Climate Change... lol! I for one certainly believe John Gormley will change the weather and next summer we need only ask John for what sort of day we want.

The real political issues currently are:

1) Economy and Jobs
2) Competitiveness
3) Taxation

I'd say environmental concerns will soon be the last thing on peoples mind and they enjoyed fame as a sort of Fashion accessory similar to Scientology if you will. If you tell someone the same lie long enough they may eventually believe it.

Macha

mumhaabu wrote: »

umm...

Water, We have plenty the fact we have too much may become a political issue with flooding and it only ever becomes one if water charges or their mention rears its ugly head.

Transport, is more of infrastructural issue and we are progressing well with new motorways and need more.

Climate Change... lol! I for one certainly believe John Gormley will change the weather and next summer we need only ask John for what sort of day we want.

The real political issues currently are:

1) Economy and Jobs
2) Competitiveness
3) Taxation

I'd say environmental concerns will soon be the last thing on peoples mind and they enjoyed fame as a sort of Fashion accessory similar to Scientology if you will. If you tell someone the same lie long enough they may eventually believe it.

I'm not sure what the last part of your post is about but the rest is a joke.

Húrin

mumhaabu wrote: »

umm...

Water, We have plenty the fact we have too much may become a political issue with flooding and it only ever becomes one if water charges or their mention rears its ugly head.

Transport, is more of infrastructural issue and we are progressing well with new motorways and need more.

Climate Change... lol! I for one certainly believe John Gormley will change the weather and next summer we need only ask John for what sort of day we want.

The real political issues currently are:

1) Economy and Jobs
2) Competitiveness
3) Taxation

I'd say environmental concerns will soon be the last thing on peoples mind and they enjoyed fame as a sort of Fashion accessory similar to Scientology if you will. If you tell someone the same lie long enough they may eventually believe it.

Boy you are in for a serious rude awakening soon. Environmental issues and economic issues affect each other so much that they're inseperable.

There is little sign that motorway use will continue to increase. There is no point in building more.

blackbox

Húrin wrote: »

There is little sign that motorway use will continue to increase. There is no point in building more.

As well as enhancing freedom of movement, motorways greatly enhance safety.

We definitely need more. We need a network to connect all cities and the secondary (outer) ring for Dublin.

Having traffic stuck in jams does nothing for the environment, the economy, limited oil resources or the quality of our lives.

Having said that, I would also like to see a proper network of cycle lanes. (I am not a fan of public transport, but accept that it is necessary for most people in some circumstances such as air and sea travel.)

I have some sympathy for your proposal to include "green issues" under politics, where the full complexities might be explored.

Húrin

blackbox wrote: »

Having traffic stuck in jams does nothing for the environment, the economy, limited oil resources or the quality of our lives.

Building more motorways will not help reduce traffic much. They are also mind-blowingly expensive. If we successfully discouraged car use and moved a lot of freight transport from trucks to rail/canals, then there would not be traffic jams. That said, I generally support the construction of town bypasses.

If we did the above, the roads would be safe enough for cyclists without needing to build a dedicated cycle network.

derry

Húrin wrote: »

Why is boards out to de-politicise environmentalism, just like the mainstream media is?

Duh most people spend 10% of their income on energy

Goverments topple or are made to topple from energy issues like lack of energy or high priced energy

Geen issues is often a preference for cleaner types of fuels and so impacts on this equasion from every angle social and economic and political

Its nearly impossible to descuss any method of energy without to involve the political forces and economic forces wanting their type of energy to reign supreme and corner the market

For some green issues is a trendy fashion accesory at piss ups and for others green issues is a religion

So I think having gren issues in green issues makes sensce instead to be in politics, economics ,religion, drinking or pop music forums

Green issues can explore things like how good for wildlife is pine forests made for fuel etc

My preference is opt for greener renewables and ban non renewables as quickly as possible as a lot of the non renewables have severe pollution potensial risks and proven risks like oil slicks or similar without even looking at issues like CO2

Examples of green policies working are in the 1950s london the place was always fulll for smog or pea soup fogs and the river Thames was a sewer pit

Buy 1990 the smog was mostly gone and Salmon had returned to pwan the Thames river

Everybody had to breath London's air so green issues of those times were higher priority than politics or economics or religion


Now for Irish different equasions exist like spending 4 hours a day commuting even if the roads are clear fast moving highways
Is that what we want to do turn the island into a vast L.A. city of coast to coast highways and suburban housing sprawl which is a totally high energy demanding system that enslaves us to oil and gas companies or similar masters

Or do we want to activily decide to make the government work for a change and introduce leglisatltion that makes appartment living a remote possibility instead of a way to get your face ripped with mangement charges or similar scams
These scams from coming from apartment builders who pull them on hapless appartment owners every day and now nobody wants to know apartments

The banks barely wont even loan money for appartments as to many owners had to abandon them forced out from appartment builders scams

So for the lack of a good legal framework for house and appartments ownership we are all forced to buy houses in stickville and commute for 4 hours so as to be more secure in our our place of residence

But while brown mana envelopes fall from the builders onto the hands of the planners you wont get this government regime to touch the golden cow that pays so well in brown mana an so urban sprawl will be the future of this island
then we can go to grey or black issues like do we pave all garden in concrete paving slabs or do we just tarmac it all to match the surronding road


Green issues hits every subject choose one any one from chewing gum litter on the streets to smoking outside the pub under gas heaters

Derry

SeanW

Conspiracy theories is this way.

blackbox

derry wrote: »

Examples of green policies working are in the 1950s london the place was always fulll for smog or pea soup fogs and the river Thames was a sewer pit

Buy 1990 the smog was mostly gone and Salmon had returned to pwan the Thames river

Everybody had to breath London's air so green issues of those times were higher priority than politics or economics or religion

In fairness we had severe smog in Dublin in the 80's. This was resolved by minister Mary Harney banning smokey fuels in urban areas.

An environmental win for politics!

Unfortunately not many politicians are effective.

Kama

SeanW wrote:

Conspiracy theories is this way.[/url]

Seriously, did you mean that to link to E-voting? Extra humour points eitherway. Though agree, e-voting would be better off in CT, Diebold ftw!


Green is better off in its own forum imo. Green encompasses political, economic, infrastructure, social issues, planning, brass tack DIY, and so on, so trying to subsume it in a different forum would be fail = my 2c