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Capital H

  • 04-09-2008 4:54pm
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,023 ✭✭✭


    Hi,
    Christians refers to God, Jesus with as He, His and not he and his.
    When did the capital H, first come into popular usage?
    In a literacy sense, was this technique used anywhere else before Christians adopted it.
    Regards


Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,196 ✭✭✭BrianCalgary


    I have no idea when. I had always seen it written that way and without being able to check would hazard a guess that it was written as such in teh KJV.:confused:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,534 ✭✭✭Soul Winner


    When translating the OT into English they had to translate 3 different words for God. El (God almighty) was translated 'God', Adoni which means 'lord' (general) was translated 'Lord' upper case L and then Jehovah or Yahweh was translated LORD. They use the "ALL CAPS" 'LORD' for Yahweh to distinguish it from Adoni which as already stated was translated 'Lord'. Maybe that's where the habit came from. I have the same habit myself. I'll always use He, Him, Himself etc, its just out of respect for the Person in question, to distinguish Him from other hes, hims and himselfs.

    The name Jehovah (LORD) was specifically given to us by God to be used to describe God in many different ways. Why the Jews threw it back into mysticism to such an extent that we cannot even speak it ,is beyond me. They were duped by the evil one me thinks. That stance has a show of righteousness about it but it is just foolishness when you think that God had other intensions for the name. He gave it to be used not to be mystified.

    In any case some examples of the name Jehovah are: 'Jehovah Gira' which means 'the LORD provides', 'Jehovah Rophi' which means 'the LORD is my shepherd' and ‘Jehovah Sidkenu’ ‘the LORD is my righteousness’ and so on. That's why are told to trust in the Name of the LORD when confronted in life by circumstances that defy His name(s). So if you are sick you claim ‘Jehovah Rophei’, ‘the LORD that heals’, if financial pressure is getting to you then you claim 'Jehovah Gira'. Whatever name you need that fits your life's circumstances, you grab it by speaking it forth from the heart and hold onto it and live with an expectancy of coming to pass because of the trust worthiness of the One who promised it. This simple daily action is called saving faith and anyone can do it. You don’t have to be a perfect human being to qualify.

    “The word is nigh you, its is in your mouth, speak it forth, for with the heart man believeth and with the mouth profession is made unto salvation.” Romans 10:10


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,023 ✭✭✭Tim Robbins


    I have no idea when. I had always seen it written that way and without being able to check would hazard a guess that it was written as such in teh KJV.:confused:
    I was reading St. Luke in the KJV version last night and it's "he" not "He".


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    I was reading St. Luke in the KJV version last night and it's "he" not "He".

    I can concur that is the case for the NRSV translation. I would always write He for Jesus though considering He is of the Holy Trinity.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,023 ✭✭✭Tim Robbins


    Jakkass wrote: »
    I can concur that is the case for the NRSV translation. I would always write He for Jesus though considering He is of the Holy Trinity.
    Can anybody actually answer the question I asked? Does anybody know when He and His was first used?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,980 ✭✭✭wolfsbane


    Can anybody actually answer the question I asked? Does anybody know when He and His was first used?
    As one who uses the capital, I can only say that I do so for convenience. Many sentences I write refer both to men and to God, so it is handy to have a capitalized pronoun to differentiate.

    Others may use it out of a sense of reverence - I assume that applies to its use in some versions. The old fashioned King James Version does not use it; the modern New King James does.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,023 ✭✭✭Tim Robbins


    wolfsbane wrote: »
    As one who uses the capital, I can only say that I do so for convenience. Many sentences I write refer both to men and to God, so it is handy to have a capitalized pronoun to differentiate.

    Others may use it out of a sense of reverence - I assume that applies to its use in some versions. The old fashioned King James Version does not use it; the modern New King James does.

    It seems to be a habbit that Christians all use without ever really thinking about the origins of.

    In the Ancient Greek version, is capital "whatever letter" used?

    If not, one could say the Holy Spiri inspired scripture does not use a capital letter so why should you. You are deviating from scripture, surely.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,245 ✭✭✭✭Fanny Cradock


    It seems to be a habbit that Christians all use without ever really thinking about the origins of.

    When I remember, I use it out of respect. I have briefly considered its origins, but it doesn't much bother me, TBH.

    You are making a mountain out of a molehill.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,686 ✭✭✭✭PDN


    Hi,
    Christians refers to God, Jesus with as He, His and not he and his.
    When did the capital H, first come into popular usage?
    In a literacy sense, was this technique used anywhere else before Christians adopted it.
    Regards

    In old English (16th Century) pronouns were capitalised for those to whom you wished to express respect. This included Kings and noblemen - not just God. Many Christians (myself included) still capitalise the pronouns to express our reverence for God as the one who deserves respect more than any other.
    If not, one could say the Holy Spiri inspired scripture does not use a capital letter so why should you. You are deviating from scripture, surely.

    Not really. The Hebrew Scriptures were written entirely in lower case letters (my Hebrew is really bad, but I seem to remember from my undergraduate studies that it has no Capital letters). Therefore, if we were really to be sticklers about this, we would only use lower case letters when discussing or quoting the Old Testament. this would be difficult to read in english and would read like lost expectation's posts or like the poetry of ee cummings

    The Greek manuscripts of the New Testament were written entirely in Capital letters - SO IF WE WERE STICKLERS ABOUT THIS THEN IT WOULD APPEAR WE WERE SHOUTING ALL THE TIME!

    As it is we use normal English usage, capitalising proper nouns such as names and places.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,163 ✭✭✭hivizman


    I've been looking at facsimile images of various early English translations of the Bible on the Internet. The first printing (1611) of the King James Bible (the Authorised Version) does not capitalise pronouns such as "he", "him" and "his" when referring to God and to Jesus (although, interestingly, "Word" is capitalised in the opening verses of John's Gospel). So the adoption of capitalisation of these pronouns in English-language printed sources is presumably a later phenomenon.

    Like Hebrew, Arabic doesn't use capital letters. However, English translators capitalise Allah (or God), pronouns referring to Allah, and also the various attributes (the "beautiful names") of God, such as "the Compassionate" and "the Merciful". The translator Muhammad Asad, in his The Message of the Qur'an, includes the Arabic script, an English translation, and also a transliteration into roman letters of the Arabic. He capitalises references to and pronouns for Allah in the transliteration as well as in the translation, even though there is no capitalisation in the original.


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