Should the Government borrow for Metro North and DART Interconnecter

darkman2

Two of THE most vital transport infrastructure projects Ireland will probrably need this century IMHO and yes they should borrow if nessacary. What do you think?

Random

I think they should let another company who has proved themselves abroad come in and take over the planning, construction and operation of the system. This way it doesn't cost us anything, we don't earn anything financially .. except that we have a better transport system and all the benefits it brings.

I want a Dublin underground. Simple as.

darkman2

Random wrote: »

I think they should let another company who has proved themselves abroad come in and take over the planning, construction and operation of the system. This way it doesn't cost us anything, we don't earn anything financially .. except that we have a better transport system and all the benefits it brings.

I want a Dublin underground. Simple as.

If a mod wants to edit the poll and stick that in as an option aswell because id go along with that if it was needed. As long as it is not a West Link style contract of course!

amacachi

Get an outside company to operate it but make sure it'll be fully integrated with everything else. Including when we get a proper public transport ticketing system in place in Dublin :P

Arthur Daley

With all the development at the airport now after we spent years correctly complaining about how poor the facilities were there, it would be incredibly short sighted not to run a proper public transport link to it.

It's a no brainer. It's embarrasing when you visit larger airports around Europe and find good metro/rail links into the the city centre. Dublin airport is now busier than Manchester, and is the 15th busiest in the world by passenger numbers flowing through.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World%27s_busiest_airports_by_international_passenger_traffic

Or the short term view is 'Ah but sure they can all keep getting on rickety dublin buses they'll be grand and keep sending us through their tourist dollars/euros/pounds etc.':rolleyes:

murphaph

Random wrote: »

I think they should let another company who has proved themselves abroad come in and take over the planning, construction and operation of the system. This way it doesn't cost us anything, we don't earn anything financially .. except that we have a better transport system and all the benefits it brings.

I want a Dublin underground. Simple as.

The bit in bold is obviously completely wrong. It usually costs more when a government takes the PPP route, it just looks like it costs nothing, but the PUBLIC end up paying more.

Cool Mo D

The terms of the metro PPP are such that no money is due for the thing until it's actually carrying passengers. So it'll optimistically be 2014 before major cash has to be forked out.
I think the payment method is 30 equal yearly payments to the builder, with penalties if the metro breaks down for extended periods. It is the PPP consortium who are responsible for putting the finance together - paying for the PPP is basically the same as a loan (but at higher rates), so borrowing won't be necessary.

I do think that the Government should borrow for the interconnector and associated works - clearly the most important transport project for the capital since the Loop Line was built.

Fishtits

darkman2 wrote: »

Two of THE most vital transport infrastructure projects Ireland will probrably need this century IMHO and yes they should borrow if nessacary. What do you think?

You obviously live in Dublin...

IMHO, THE most vital transport infrastructure projects Ireland needs to address are decent links to the west - and no, a Motorway between Dublin and Galway doesn't solve the problem.

We need to make all areas of this SMALL country accessible in order to create a long term sustainable and solid economy... IMHO.

PS, I don't live in the West.

Random

I'm just saying we let someone build and operate it. They take in all the associated costs etc of it in exchange for all the profits from it. I'm sure this could be worked some how but I've not done extensive research, nor do I work in any of the related fields so this is just an outsiders perspective (why is this the case with most of my posts? ).

I'm not saying the government go into partnership. I'm saying we simply let this other company do it all. The government can then charge VAT or whatever it is.

jimmycrackcorm

The reality is that it depends on how long payback takes. How many years will it take for the billions in costs and interest to be repaid in ticket sales. Otherwise it's just an over expensive white elephant of a convenience for some people.

robd

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

The reality is that it depends on how long payback takes. How many years will it take for the billions in costs and interest to be repaid in ticket sales. Otherwise it's just an over expensive white elephant of a convenience for some people.

Major infrastructure projects such as Metros don't generally have a payback. If they did then private companies would have got in on the act long ago. Hence they are built by the state and the capital costs written due to major socio economic benefit. At best a metro will cover its running costs and possibly rolling stock renewal.

paulm17781

Fishtits wrote: »

IMHO, THE most vital transport infrastructure projects Ireland needs to address are decent links to the west - and no, a Motorway between Dublin and Galway doesn't solve the problem.

We need to make all areas of this SMALL country accessible in order to create a long term sustainable and solid economy... IMHO.

So instead of ensuring that 80% (or more) of our economy runs smoothly, we should ensure 4% (or less) gets connected to that other bit and forget about the main bit. Right... I hope you're not an economist.

D.L.R.

Fishtits wrote: »

You obviously live in Dublin...

you obviously don't

Fishtits wrote: »

IMHO, THE most vital transport infrastructure projects Ireland needs to address are decent links to the west - and no, a Motorway between Dublin and Galway doesn't solve the problem.

what then, tgv? maglev?

murphaph

Fishtits wrote: »

You obviously live in Dublin...

IMHO, THE most vital transport infrastructure projects Ireland needs to address are decent links to the west - and no, a Motorway between Dublin and Galway doesn't solve the problem.

We need to make all areas of this SMALL country accessible in order to create a long term sustainable and solid economy... IMHO.

PS, I don't live in the West.

Dublin is choked. Last thing we need is even more roads feeding into it. Dublin needs sorting first. Where do you think all the taxes spent in Galway come from? Choked Dublin=choked national economy=game over for all of us. Support your capital city and don't be so parochial for God's sake!

Nostradamus

darkman2 wrote: »

Two of THE most vital transport infrastructure projects Ireland will probrably need this century IMHO and yes they should borrow if nessacary. What do you think?

Correction: THE MOST VITAL PROJECTS

Fianna Fail would commit political suicide if they were retarded enough to cancel these projects.

An entire generation would never forgive them and they would end up as a footnote in Irish political history if they did. There would be murder in North Dublin if the Metro was shelved. Absolute wipe-out for Fianna Fail for all eternity. They would never recover.

They can't be that stupid, can they.

greyed

Though I like the idea of fianna fáils political death, I think they have exposed the two projects to the masses too much to pull back... TV ads, posters everywhere, public consultation letters, some guy in work throwing a "dart underground" leaflet around... At least I hope so...