Issues with search facility...

Ronan H

Y'all...

Before I post a thread i generally always search the existing ones to see if the topic has been covered before. Quite a number of times i have found that the following occurs:

- I search (advanced) for a particular phrase, using accurate keywords and selecting "Search Titles Only" in the drop down box beneath the keyword text box
- Results with little relevance come up in the search
- I post a new thread
- Someone tells me theres another thread (or threads) on the same topic existing
- I feel like a tool, but then get annoyed that the search facility didnt pick up on it

How come the existing thread doesnt come up when I search for it using accurate keywords? Instead i get pages of search results that are nothing whatsoever to do with what i am looking for?

Heres an example: I started a thread ages ago entitled "Water Hardness In Ratoath" so I know that thread exists for sure. Just now i searched in the exact manner described above and the thread and was presented with 488 results with my thread being #66 in that list, half way down the third page of results. Not very accurate. Had i been looking for any of the following however...

Water on mars
Water in Tramore
Water reservoirs in Galway
Smoke on the water
People trying to establish a gaelscoil in ratoath

...then apparently "Water Hardness In Ratoath" is a good phrase to use!

The above were all ranked higher than my own thread. That makes no sense to me whatsoever.

If anyone can shed any light on this or has had similar problems please let me know as its quite frustrating, in fact i have given up searching for threads before i post them as a result of it. Not ideal, but either is the search facility...

To further illuminate the randomness of the search facility, i searched for "iPod Touch". One of the first results that comes up is for wedding photography... ... ...

Any mods or Boards.ie gods able to shed any light on this?

Thanks in advance .

Head

Gordon

When I search for that combination of keywords I get the two threads relating to Water Hardness In Ratoath. Both by title search or entire posts. Not sure why you are getting those results tbh.

Ronan H

Thats interesting, i wonder what could be causing it for me then. I wonder if there are any other users experiencing the same thing. Ive double checked what i am doing when i search and it all seems OK.

Ive just done another search (using the search function on the menu bar above ^^^ ) and this actual thread came up as the fourth result. The fifth one was about Joy Riding Mechanics and the first three were about Timetable Changes and The Daily Drudge??? The thread i am looking for is nowhere to be seen in the first three pages at least...

There doesnt seem to be any reason to it at all, no pattern except from complete randomness, its bizarre.

Gordon do you know is there anyone that i can contact about it that is involved with the administration of the actual vBulletin software that might be able to help? If you could let me know id appreciate it thanks...

Confused Head

seamus

Can you post a screenshot of the search screen as it appears just before you hit "search"?

Ronan H

Here ya go:

http://picasaweb.google.com/harryhalpenny/Search

It has a picture before the search and also the first page of search results...

Head

seamus

That's pretty bizarre alright.

The main difference I can see is that above your search results it says,

Search: Keyword(s): Water Hardness in Ratoath

Whereas mine says

Search: Keyword(s): Water, Hardness, Ratoath

I can't see anything odd about your profile either. I'll move this to development as a bug report. There may be some hidden search options which can be applied to users.

Ronan H

Thanks Seamus...

I searched for the phrase "Water Hardness In Ratoath" (without the inverted commas) without any commas between the words...

I also just tried to search for Water, Hardness and Ratoath separated by commas as per your own search and it still produced random results with my thread on the third page of results...

Thanks again for your help...

Head

CuLT

Hi, the vbulletin search options apply broadly across all users with some minor differences for moderators and administrators (ten second wait between searches not applying).

Other than that, search is simply configured at the user end. You might try using the option at the bottom of the search page for clearing preferences:


And then try searching again? I've checked with some test accounts with standard privileges and this problem does not occur with any of them, so it is possible your browser or preferences are mangling the request.

A good way to check whether it's the browser or not is to try the same search while logged out (the only difference is that you'll have to fill out a CAPTCHA check).

If that works, the problem is probably with your account/preferences, if that also doesn't work the problem is likely with your browser, or possibly some plugin for it if you're using Firefox or similar.

Adam

Incidentally I found the OP's thread to be result 80 with the keywords Water, Hardness, Ratoath

Then I tried to clear preferences and search again, but didn't get that far because I broke the space time continuum apparenty...

Ronan H

The Wrath of CuLT wrote: »

Incidentally I found the OP's thread to be result 80 with the keywords Water, Hardness, Ratoath

Then I tried to clear preferences and search again, but didn't get that far because I broke the space time continuum apparenty...

Hah, now thats bizarre! Marty McFly would be proud!

Head

Ronan H

CuLT wrote: »

And then try searching again? I've checked with some test accounts with standard privileges and this problem does not occur with any of them, so it is possible your browser or preferences are mangling the request.

A good way to check whether it's the browser or not is to try the same search while logged out (the only difference is that you'll have to fill out a CAPTCHA check).

If that works, the problem is probably with your account/preferences, if that also doesn't work the problem is likely with your browser, or possibly some plugin for it if you're using Firefox or similar.

Have tried this logged out with the same random results. Am using a completely fresh version of Firefox with no plugins whatsoever, on a different laptop! Would that indicate that its my account that messed up then?

Head

CuLT

Head wrote: »

Have tried this logged out with the same random results. Am using a completely fresh version of Firefox with no plugins whatsoever, on a different laptop! Would that indicate that its my account that messed up then?

Head

Ok, try now.

r3nu4l

I don't know if your changes have had a global effect on all accounts CuLT but when I search "Water Hardness In Ratoath" in Thread Titles only, in all Open forums, I get one result:

This

CuLT

r3nu4l wrote: »

I don't know if your changes have had a global effect on all accounts CuLT but when I search "Water Hardness In Ratoath" in Thread Titles only, in all Open forums, I get one result:

This

Yep, that should do it.

Boolean search has been enabled across registered and guest accounts, moderators would have been able to the whole time.

r3nu4l

However, taking a different thread:

My first diesel, what do I need to know?

and use the words,

diesel, what, need, know

My thread comes 9th in the list.

1. Why have Diesel / Petrol prices not come down?
2. Diesel Skoda Fabia 1.4
3. Green Diesel
4. Sick Diesel engine - need help
5. Good Diesel Mechanic?
6. Running Diesel cars on Vegatable Oil?
7. which is better- Petrol or Diesel??
8. Carlow Diesel/Petrol Prices

The above are all given higher preference as possible matches than my own thread.

Okay it's only 9th, not pages down the results list or anything but it is odd. the only common word in any of those threads and my search is "diesel", yet my thread has all four words I searched for in the title and comes ninth compared to others with only one word in common. I've even put the search words in the order they appear in my original thread title.

I'm searching by thread title only and across all open forums.

Steve

r3nu4l wrote: »

However, taking a different thread:

My first diesel, what do I need to know?

and use the words,

diesel, what, need, know

I searched for "My first diesel, what do I need to know" and the search engine reported:

The following words are either very common, too long, or too short and were not included in your search: My, first, what, do, I, need, to, know

so in effect you only searched for diesel.

r3nu4l

SteveC wrote: »

I searched for "My first diesel, what do I need to know" and the search engine reported:


so in effect you only searched for diesel.

Did you use my search terms? I don't think you did, in fact, i know you didn't from what you posted

I get the following for my search terms:

Search: Keyword(s): Diesel,, what,, need,

The following words are either very common, too long, or too short and were not included in your search: know

Thereby searching for 3 words diesel, what and need), all of which appear in my thread title and it still comes ninth when only one word is common to all the others.
EDIT: I saw the double commas in there so performed the search again without the commas in my search. The result is the same.

CuLT

Words of four letters and below are excluded from search results.

r3nu4l

CuLT wrote: »

Words of four letters and below are excluded from search results.

1. Why? That seems way OTT imo.
2. Why did my search not exclude "what" and "need"
3. Surely with the use of Boolean operators four letter words can be allowed?

CuLT

r3nu4l wrote: »

1. Why? That seems way OTT imo.
2. Why did my search not exclude "what" and "need"
3. Surely with the use of Boolean operators four letter words can be allowed?

1. It's been set that way since before I came aboard, may have been set to four back around the time search was disabled in an effort to curb the effects of slowdown before disabling it entirely.

2. It actually searched for "what," and "need,". There may have been some character exclusion or intelligence at a lower level, that may be a bug in vBulletin or just the way mysql fulltext search is handled.

3. Probably, I don't mind giving it a shot, it means more db intensive queries, but obviously if the database can handle that it's fine.

Steve

r3nu4l wrote: »

Did you use my search terms? I don't think you did, in fact, i know you didn't from what you posted

No, I searched for the entire string (without quotes) to see what would happen.

How does the boolean search work?
I tried [+need +know +diesel],[+need+know+diesel] - same thing.

Edit, just saw CuLTs point re "need," so it was still just a search for "diesel"

Ronan H

CuLT wrote: »

Ok, try now.

Well you can't ask for better than that really. Bang on the money when I search for the thread now. Thanks a million CuLT...

Head