Trek Madone 4.7 v Giant SCR C1 v Cannondale Carbon

Diarmuid

Sorry to start another one of these threads but I've been doing my home work and need a spot of advice.

I am in the market for a €2000 road bike. About me: I don't race seriously but I am pretty competitive on sportive races and take my training seriously, putting in 10+hrs a week (well more at the moment). I want to upgrade from my €500 bike so looking around now

I did a tour of the Local Bike Shops receiving various pieces of advice and seeing what they have in stock and currently my choices are :

1. Trek Madone 4.7. €2200. Ultegra all round. Botranger Race wheels. New carbon frame from last year built in Taiwan.
2. Giant SCR C1 €2500. Ultegra all round + Dura Ace Dérailleur. Mavic Ksyrium Elite wheels. Carbon "performance" (read: comfortable and forgiving) frame. I think it's called the OCR C1 in the US if that helps
3. Cannondale Carbon SL. €2200. Ultegra all round, Mavic Ksyrium Equipe wheels.

I must say I like the look of the Trek but the wheels on the Giant are a good step above the wheels on the other two. One bike shop, pushed the Cannondale (even though they stocked the Trek also), another the Trek (they also had Cannondale) and the third pushed the Giant so no help there.

So anyone have hands on experience of any of these three? Or maybe read a review in a magazine for any of these? Supposedly the Giant got bike of the year in one mag (in the plush category) but I don't have a link.

Any opinions or thoughts in general, any other bikes in this price range worth a look? I though about a Cervelo Team Soloist but one of the guys in the shop said that I would be mad to go for an ALU frame from at that price. The comfort of the carbon is worth the more relaxed ride. I also considered the Focus/Planet X option but I think I'd prefer to buy locally and am pretty set on a triple.

Vélo

Where are you getting the Giant SCR C1 for €2,500, I presume it's on the internet as Cycle Superstore have it for €3,400.

Then again I got my SCR C-3 for €1250 from wiggle and Cyclesuperstore were €2,200.

blorg

You really need to try them out and see which suits you. I personally have liked Trek and found them very comfortable and so would go for that one. Nothing wrong with it being made in Taiwan, the Giant obviously is also and the Cannondale almost certainly too. Wheels are easily upgradable so I would focus on the frame and what fits you best. Ksyrium Elites are not exactly top of the line anyway.

DirkVoodoo

It would be the madone for me. You could always get the 4.5 and have the shop upgrade the wheels, although its always worth haggling anyway.

jwwie

make sure you get on all of these bikes for a short spin. there will be noticable differences the way each one will handle. take the same route each time for comparison and try to get in a short climb or at least get out of the saddle and sprint. when i was shopping for a new bike there were a few that had nice components and looked great. but, i bought the one that felt right (giant ocr elite aluminium/carbon frame, all ultegra, heavy xero wheels but never have need to true them). try not to get too tied up with components. its the frame that will give you the best feel.

DirkVoodoo

Yeah, focus on the frame definitely.

Also, check what the manufacturer warranty is for each frame, it may prove to be an important deciding factor.

Diarmuid

Aquinas73 wrote: »

Where are you getting the Giant SCR C1 for €2,500, I presume it's on the internet as Cycle Superstore have it for €3,400.

No it's a local shop to me (in France) that has one on sale. The retail price is €3000

make sure you get on all of these bikes for a short spin. there will be noticable differences the way each one will handle. take the same route each time for comparison

I plan to do that, although it's hard to do side by side comparisons as they are all in different shops and no chance of cycling the same route.

Lifetime warranty on the Madone frame, not sure about the others

TinyExplosions

Personally, I love the Madone -always have and so would get it -the spec is fairly similar on all of them.

DirkVoodoo

Yeah, saw some Madones in Joe Daly's. Really sexy frames. (Can a bike be sexy?)

Diarmuid

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

Yeah, saw some Madones in Joe Daly's. Really sexy frames. (Can a bike be sexy?)

I guess so but I wouldn't take it too far!

ChickenBalls

Dont forget that these bikes value will drop big time come oct/nov - so think about an 2009 bike if you can hold out. That way if you dont like it at least you've a few months to get rid of it during the 09 year.

Personally I wouldn't go for any of those bikes to be honest - all your paying for is the name. Go for Planet-X(http://www.planet-x-warehouse.co.uk/index.php) SL Pro carbon with the same groupset for less. Focus bikes are also good - they sell on Wiggle.co.uk

Chips Lovell

keith123 wrote: »

Personally I wouldn't go for any of those bikes to be honest - all your paying for is the name. Go for Planet-X(http://www.planet-x-warehouse.co.uk/index.php) SL Pro carbon with the same groupset for less. Focus bikes are also good - they sell on Wiggle.co.uk

Could you enlighten us then as to why there is no difference between a Planet X frame and a Trek Madone or Cannondale Synapse?

ChickenBalls

el tonto wrote: »

Could you enlighten us then as to why there is no difference between a Planet X frame and a Trek Madone or Cannondale Synapse?

Well I will admit there will be differences but not enough for you to notice - its the carbon fibre weaves that are one difference and where the frame is made.

Just to name a few:
Cervelo's are made in China (PMC).
Time-France
Look-france and Taiwan (They have a facility in tunisia that produces many of their frames)
Colnago-Italy and Taiwan
Giant-Taiwan and china
IF-USA(they use reynolds carbon)(Actually....They use tubing from ICE now, Reynold's is now China (though still owned by Maclean))
Seven-USA
Trek-USA-but the tubing is made in Utah by Maclean(reynolds)(Trek no longer uses Maclean for tubing, some made in house, some from china)
BMC-Swiss (Made in China, except for TT01 custom)
Kestrel(now Fuji)-Taiwan (and China)
Aegis-USA
Corima-France
Lotus Sport-South Africa
Guru-Canada and Taiwan (Custom lugs/tubes sourced from USA)
Scott-Taiwan (China)
Agron 18-Taiwan (China)
Calfee-USA
Parlee-USA-they use reynolds carbon tubing (Parlee uses Edge, and ICE tubing)
Cannondale- System Six, 613, Super Six, Scalpel: USA, Taiwan(not the us)(Actually made in China)
Specialized-Made by Giant in China (Made in China, but not by Giant)
Gary Fisher-Trek and some in China by Giant
LeMond-Trek (China not USA)

Its the frame that the most important part here as the rest is upgradable, the planet-X is made in taiwan and as you can see above the big names are also made there thats why your paying for the name...

Diarmuid

keith123 wrote: »

Dont forget that these bikes value will drop big time come oct/nov - so think about an 2009 bike if you can hold out. That way if you dont like it at least you've a few months to get rid of it during the 09 year.

Yea that was my plan, however the Giant is already discounted 15% and I could only find one in my size. Likewise with the Trek, Trek Europe has no more 2008 Madone 4.7 in stock (in my size) and of the 5 Trek shops I tried I could only find 1 Madone 4.7 in my size. (Also the Trek is not changing this year, apart from the paint job, so I don't know if there will be big discounts) In theory waiting for the sale in Oct/Nov makes sense but in practise it's not so clear cut. I was hoping with a bit of haggling I might get a few percent off but no guarantees there either.

Go for Planet-X(http://www.planet-x-warehouse.co.uk/index.php) SL Pro carbon with the same groupset for less.

I considered that but a number of things put me off.

1. I can't try it out before I buy
2. If there are problems I like the option of just taking it into the shop
3. No triple option.

I configured a carbon frame with Ultegra SL (I just picked the defaults) and with shipping it came to just under €1900, so not worth it for me.

Diarmuid

keith123 wrote: »

Its the frame that the most important part here as the rest is upgradable, the planet-X is made in taiwan and as you can see above the big names are also made there thats why your paying for the name...

I don't think it's fair to assume that because two frames are made in the same country, it makes them equal.
Different companies can have different processes, different designs, different QA etc.

Chips Lovell

keith123 wrote: »

Well I will admit there will be differences but not enough for you to notice - its the carbon fibre weaves that are one difference and where the frame is made...

Its the frame that the most important part here as the rest is upgradable, the planet-X is made in taiwan and as you can see above the big names are also made there thats why your paying for the name...

But surely who designs a frame is a bit more important than where the manufacturing is outsourced to? If that were the case, it would be like saying that an iPod is no better than some no-name MP3 player because manufacturing of both is outsourced to Taiwan.

flickerx

Diarmuid wrote: »

I guess so but I wouldn't take it too far!

I knew someone would link to that as soon as someone else talked about bikes being sexy

ChickenBalls

I agree with what your both saying but I think a Carbon frame is a Carbon frame - I dont know about the inner techie details of what carbon processes are being used in Taiwan etc.. and maybe the bigger manufacturers could be making a better frame that absorbs more shocks than others for example... I take it all back now

Yeah I saw that Planet-X SL Ultegra clearance bike for 1900 but I picked the same kind spec here(http://www.planet-x-warehouse.co.uk/acatalog/SL_Pro_Carbon_Road_Bike.html) and it came to 1100 Sterling including delivery.

Chips Lovell

keith123 wrote: »

I agree with what your both saying but I think a Carbon frame is a Carbon frame - I dont know about the inner techie details of what carbon processes are being used in Taiwan etc.. and maybe the bigger manufacturers could be making a better frame that absorbs more shocks than others for example... I take it all back now

Stiffness, weight, frame geometry, they all come into it.

trek climber

Diarmuid wrote: »

Sorry to start another one of these threads but I've been doing my home work and need a spot of advice.

I am in the market for a €2000 road bike. About me: I don't race seriously but I am pretty competitive on sportive races and take my training seriously, putting in 10+hrs a week (well more at the moment). I want to upgrade from my €500 bike so looking around now

I did a tour of the Local Bike Shops receiving various pieces of advice and seeing what they have in stock and currently my choices are :

1. Trek Madone 4.7. €2200. Ultegra all round. Botranger Race wheels. New carbon frame from last year built in Taiwan.
2. Giant SCR C1 €2500. Ultegra all round + Dura Ace Dérailleur. Mavic Ksyrium Elite wheels. Carbon "performance" (read: comfortable and forgiving) frame. I think it's called the OCR C1 in the US if that helps
3. Cannondale Carbon SL. €2200. Ultegra all round, Mavic Ksyrium Equipe wheels.

I must say I like the look of the Trek but the wheels on the Giant are a good step above the wheels on the other two. One bike shop, pushed the Cannondale (even though they stocked the Trek also), another the Trek (they also had Cannondale) and the third pushed the Giant so no help there.

So anyone have hands on experience of any of these three? Or maybe read a review in a magazine for any of these? Supposedly the Giant got bike of the year in one mag (in the plush category) but I don't have a link.

Any opinions or thoughts in general, any other bikes in this price range worth a look? I though about a Cervelo Team Soloist but one of the guys in the shop said that I would be mad to go for an ALU frame from at that price. The comfort of the carbon is worth the more relaxed ride. I also considered the Focus/Planet X option but I think I'd prefer to buy locally and am pretty set on a triple.

Personally I would definitely go for the Trek as to me they are a beautiful bike, but I will qualify that by saying that I am a Trek owner. As for the wheels, you can easily upgrade them later but I had no problems with my set of Bontrager's.

copacetic

gotta say I like the cannodale of those 3, but not the team colours. Have to also ask as a specialized man, have you looked that the tarmac expert?

http://www.specialized.com/bc/SBCBkModel.jsp?spid=34008

or the comfort model roubaix:

http://www.specialized.com/bc/SBCBkModel.jsp?spid=33546

Murph100

I'm at the same process at the moment with the same budget, and thanks to some of the lads here I've found some great bikes outside of the 'big' brand names with a lot better spec.

Ridley Orion

Wilier Mortirolo

Bianchi 928 C2C

and a new Viner about to be launched which will be arriving at this excellent shop this Fri / Mon, having said that, the range of Viners in there at the moment look like fantastic bikes for the money !

http://www.epic-cycles.co.uk/Viner.htm

Ask for Phil or Chris

Sorry to throw more options into the pot



Murph

blorg

Murph100 wrote: »

Ridley Orion
Wilier Mortirolo
Bianchi 928 C2C

Have been out with Boards lads on each of these bikes and they are all very nice, the Mortirolo in particular is a beautiful bike.

Chips Lovell

blorg wrote: »

Have been out with Boards lads on each of these bikes and they are all very nice, the Mortirolo in particular is a beautiful bike.

Who's got a Bianchi 928?

Diarmuid

Murph100 wrote: »

Ridley Orion
Wilier Mortirolo
Bianchi 928 C2C

Thanks for the suggestions. I'll have a look around but it can be difficult to find more exotic bikes in the LBS

blorg

el tonto wrote: »

Who's got a Bianchi 928?

Sorry, I think it's the alu/carbon Via Nirone version of the C2C I'm thinking about here. LDB and Hobojojo (that is P, right?) I think there is more than one with the Orion (all from Cycleogical) and just the one with a Mortirolo (although I've seen another in the W200.)

DirkVoodoo

I have the Orion, lovely bike, a bit nerve wracking going down the steeper descents, but as Tom pointed out to me last week, that is a common feeling for people moving from aluminium to carbon.

Chips Lovell

blorg wrote: »

Sorry, I think it's the alu/carbon Via Nirone version of the C2C I'm thinking about here. LDB and Hobojojo (that is P, right?) I think there is more than one with the Orion (all from Cycleogical) and just the one with a Mortirolo (although I've seen another in the W200.)

Yep, it's the Via Nirone that P and LDB have. C2C is the name of the range actually, not the frame. Bianchi have a few frames in each range.

Hobojobo isn't P by the way.

TinyExplosions

el tonto wrote: »

Hobojobo isn't P by the way.

So why's he stolen "Manky Bianchi's" bike! :eek:

blorg

el tonto wrote: »

Hobojobo isn't P by the way.

I have a fair bit of trouble keeping names, handles and bikes together!