new gear dillema

melekalikimaka

right loan time for some new gear and just wanna get some views on some gear options.

was all set on a d300...now the d700 being full frame has tempted me greatly, has anyone got one yet? is it worth the extra? and more importantly, noise? is it much better o same same as d300?

flashes? was thinking sb800(stuff ther sb600, will be keeping d50 and it doesnt have wireless commander), looking at the sb900, whats the deal, is it the replacement or upgrade to the sb800?

gonna consider a lens or two also, ideally 10.5 fisheye, but maybe the sigma 15 mm either or , xshayx i know got pretty much that kit, how do you find it?

conkeroo

melekalikimaka wrote: »

right loan time for some new gear and just wanna get some views on some gear options.

was all set on a d300...now the d700 being full frame has tempted me greatly, has anyone got one yet? is it worth the extra? and more importantly, noise? is it much better o same same as d300?

flashes? was thinking sb800(stuff ther sb600, will be keeping d50 and it doesnt have wireless commander), looking at the sb900, whats the deal, is it the replacement or upgrade to the sb800?

gonna consider a lens or two also, ideally 10.5 fisheye, but maybe the sigma 15 mm either or , xshayx i know got pretty much that kit, how do you find it?

The D700 is the D3 guts in a D300 body. Same sensor, same chips and same high iso. If you could get one then fair play but its about 3 grand, isn't it? Bit more than the D300!

Edit: List of specs and difference between the D700 and D3...

Nikon D700 Key Features

• 12.1 megapixel full-frame sensor (8.45µm pixel pitch)
• Image Sensor Cleaning (vibration) *
• ISO 200 - 6400 (with boost up to ISO 25600 and down to ISO 100)
• Also supports DX lenses, viewfinder automatically masks (5.1 megapixels with DX lens)
• 14-bit A/D conversion, 12 channel readout
• Same ultra-fast startup and shutter lag as D3
• Nikon EXPEED image processor (Capture NX processing and NR algorithms, lower power)
• New Kevlar / carbon fibre composite shutter with 150,000 exposure durability *
• Multi-CAM3500FX Auto Focus sensor (51-point, 15 cross-type, more vertical coverage)
• Auto-focus tracking by color (using information from 1005-pixel AE sensor)
• 95% coverage, 0.72x magnification viewfinder *
• Auto-focus calibration (fine-tuning), fixed body or up to 20 separate lens settings
• Scene Recognition System (uses AE sensor, AF sensor)
• Picture Control image parameter presets
• 5 frames per second continuous with auto-focus tracking*
• Optional MB-D10 Battery Pack (same as D300), increases burst rate to 8 fps *
• UDMA compatible single CF card slot *
• 3.0" 922,000 pixel LCD monitor
• Live View with either phase detect (mirror up/down) or contrast detect Auto Focus
• Virtual horizon indicates if camera is level (like an aircraft cockpit display)
• HDMI HD video output
• 'Active D-Lighting' (adjusts metering as well as applying D-Lighting curve)
• Detailed 'Control Panel' type display on LCD monitor, changes color in darkness
• Magnesium alloy body with connections and buttons sealed against moisture
• Improved Info display on main screen *

* Different to D3

Nikon D700 vs D3: Key Differences

Although the D3 and D700 are essentially the same camera in a different form factor (the D700 being far closer to the D300 in design and control layout), there are a few important specification differences.

• Smaller, lighter body *
• Built-in iTTL flash (G.No 17 / ISO 200)
• No rear information panel (new info display on main LCD)
• D700 doesn't have the D3's 5:4 aspect ratio option
• 95% coverage, 0.72x viewfinder (D3: 100% / 0.7x)
• Focus screen DX mode now indicated with a rectangle rather than shaded area
• Lower burst rate (5.0 fps / 8.0 fps with optional MB-D10)
• Smaller battery (EN-EL3e)
• Optional battery grip (MB-D10, same as D300)
• Expanded Function button options (can assign any camera menu item)
• Live View can be assigned to FUNC, AE-L or Preview buttons (allowing LV + different drive modes)
• Virtual Horizon can be overlaid on Live View preview image
• Different shutter (150,000 cycle rating - same as D300)
• Image Sensor cleaning ('sensor shake' dust reduction)
• Single CF slot (D3 has two)
• Minor menu and control differences (control layout is almost identical to D300)

Arciphel

D300 is a lovely camera, I am tempted by the D700 too but you have to factor in the cost of full frame lenses also. How many of your current lenses will work on the D700?

I know of my own lenses that only my Nikon 50mm f1.8, Sigma 70-200 f2.8 and sigma 24-70 f2.8 will work. I would need to buy a new wideangle, porbably the Nikon 14-24 f2.8 which is a beast and caosts about €1,400. So it's not just the cos of the body. Also, unless you like to shoot really wide or do massive prints, or shoot in low light without flash, will you get the benefit of the full frame?

For flashes, I think the SB-900 is an upgrade o the SB-800, the main selling point being it has a wider zoom range. But apparatly it might be prone to over heating andmight melt in yer hand so maybe best to stick with SB-600 or 800. Ihave one of each and I think the 600 is better, more intuitive buttons layout and better battery life with only a negligible decrease in light.

For lens, I would skip the 10.5 fisheye to be honest, unless you plan on doing a lot of PP work to de-fish-eye-ify each image, and go for an ultra wide angle, the two best being the sigma 10-20mm f4 or the Tokina 11-16mm f2.8, I have the Tokina and love it!

let me know if you decide to plump for the D700, if you do fair play to you!

melekalikimaka

its closer to 2 grand from the best i can find, bout 1700- 2100 on ebay, so its not too big a jump

xshayx

yeah, thats what i got alright.

I have absolutely no issues with the D300 - noise not a problem, especially compared to the D70. If I was to be looking at buying it now, the D700 would tempt me loads, only being put off by the price... plus having to get the grip on top of the extra price.... but full frame would be nice.

I havent had a chance really to use the 10.5 since getting it back from NY, where it was great for building shots. Have only used it here for gig shots - prob will always use it for gig shots, fantastic. But I'm so glad I got it, cant wait for a chance to get out with it properly here.

The SB-800, also nothing bad to say about it, still experimenting and learning it, its great using it off camera and fairly easy to learn the menu. I'm not too sure how the SB-900 differs.... but I am going to get another SB-800 or two if the price comes down because of the new one

DO IT!

conkeroo

melekalikimaka wrote: »

its closer to 2 grand from the best i can find, bout 1700- 2100 on ebay, so its not too big a jump

Thats a great price, for essentially a D3. But yeah the lenses thing too, will they work? I'd go for the D700 for its speed but personally, I dont have that kind of money to get one!!

melekalikimaka

conkeroo wrote: »

Thats a great price, for essentially a D3. But yeah the lenses thing too, will they work? I'd go for the D700 for its speed but personally, I dont have that kind of money to get one!!

neither do i, this cam is gonna be doin me for a few years

melekalikimaka

Arciphel wrote: »

D300 is a lovely camera, I am tempted by the D700 too but you have to factor in the cost of full frame lenses also. How many of your current lenses will work on the D700?

I know of my own lenses that only my Nikon 50mm f1.8, Sigma 70-200 f2.8 and sigma 24-70 f2.8 will work. I would need to buy a new wideangle, porbably the Nikon 14-24 f2.8 which is a beast and caosts about €1,400. So it's not just the cos of the body. Also, unless you like to shoot really wide or do massive prints, or shoot in low light without flash, will you get the benefit of the full frame?

yes they would cept for my 17-55 piece of tripe
and low light is the main reason i want something in the 2.8 region

Arciphel wrote: »

For flashes, I think the SB-900 is an upgrade o the SB-800, the main selling point being it has a wider zoom range. But apparatly it might be prone to over heating andmight melt in yer hand so maybe best to stick with SB-600 or 800. Ihave one of each and I think the 600 is better, more intuitive buttons layout and better battery life with only a negligible decrease in light.

600 wont cut if for my d50 ya see, and i would intend on working with wider zoom anyway

Arciphel wrote: »

For lens, I would skip the 10.5 fisheye to be honest, unless you plan on doing a lot of PP work to de-fish-eye-ify each image, and go for an ultra wide angle, the two best being the sigma 10-20mm f4 or the Tokina 11-16mm f2.8, I have the Tokina and love it!

yeah thats a consideration too, nice price, but i can myself wanting the fisheye alot for gig work

Stephen

DX lenses will work fine with it - it will just crop the sensor to fit their smaller image circle so they'll behave the same as they would on a D300.

Arciphel

If you shoot with a DX lens on it you only get 5MP images. Might be big enough for you but then again might not.

See below, this is what the 10.5mm fisheye will look like on a D700 ...

melekalikimaka

Stephen wrote: »

DX lenses will work fine with it - it will just crop the sensor to fit their smaller image circle so they'll behave the same as they would on a D300.

if it crops to 5mp, does that mean it doubles the focal length?

quilmore

sigma has a 12-24 full frame at a decent price, not sure about IQ but 12mm in FF must me great!

low light performance of the D700/D3 sensor is outstanding, no noise up to ISO 1600

but I'm reluctant to lose reach on my 70-200 2.8 vr, probably I'd stay a little longer with DX (a 300 2.8 vr is too heavy and too expensive)

melekalikimaka

Arciphel wrote: »

If you shoot with a DX lens on it you only get 5MP images. Might be big enough for you but then again might not.

See below, this is what the 10.5mm fisheye will look like on a D700 ...

excellent point, i overlooked its dx, hummm 16mm nikkor or sigma seems to be a better option

Arciphel

melekalikimaka wrote: »

if it crops to 5mp, does that mean it doubles the focal length?

I think you are confusing crop factor and resolution here!

melekalikimaka

Arciphel wrote: »

I think you are confusing crop factor and resolution here!

just slightly , the ol sun is doing wonders for my concentration today

mloc

d300 is just not comparable to d700 for noise. There is a popular misconception that they are comparable because the D300 and D3 were released around the same time and both were applauded for improved low noise, people thought they were both about the same in low noise stakes. Of course, this isn't true; whilst the d300 was a pretty big jump ahead of the d200 etc in noise stakes, the d3 ****s all over both of them. And seeing as the D700 is basically a smaller D3 (in noise respects at least), it is far superior to the D300 in that category.

How superior? From what I can tell from reviews and sample shots, D300 at 1600 is comparable to D700 at 6400. So thats basically 2 stops of extra light you get, in a practical sense. Well worth it for low light stuff really. Also, if you don't mind maybe a B+W conversion, ISO 25600 is certainly usable.

melekalikimaka

mloc wrote: »

d300 is just not comparable to d700 for noise. There is a popular misconception that they are comparable because the D300 and D3 were released around the same time and both were applauded for improved low noise, people thought they were both about the same in low noise stakes. Of course, this isn't true; whilst the d300 was a pretty big jump ahead of the d200 etc in noise stakes, the d3 ****s all over both of them. And seeing as the D700 is basically a smaller D3 (in noise respects at least), it is far superior to the D300 in that category.

How superior? From what I can tell from reviews and sample shots, D300 at 1600 is comparable to D700 at 6400. So thats basically 2 stops of extra light you get, in a practical sense. Well worth it for low light stuff really. Also, if you don't mind maybe a B+W conversion, ISO 25600 is certainly usable.

as i suspected, also the extra few mm with full frame on the wide end is so tempting

mloc

in terms of wide angle lenses, the 20mm nikkor might be something to look at. It's f2.8 and a 20mm on a d700 is the same as a 13mm on a DX body. Probably gonna get one myself, a bit short on the short end at the moment.

melekalikimaka

mloc wrote: »

It's f2.8 and a 20mm

aint fisheye tho

eas

Arciphel wrote: »

If you shoot with a DX lens on it you only get 5MP images. Might be big enough for you but then again might not.

See below, this is what the 10.5mm fisheye will look like on a D700 ...

that's how it will look until you modify the 10.5 (shave off the hood)

after you modify it...you'll get this (not my photograph - follow the link below to dpreview to see more)




http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1021&message=28385854

melekalikimaka

its still cropped tho is it not?

eas

that's the image you get at full resolution (full frame) - is that what you meant?

I regularly use my 12-24 tokina DX lens on my d3. At 12mm you get severe vignetting, but from 16-17mm you get none at all.