What do you think of this

Rew

I had never seen it before today when I saw it on another forum:

Offences Against The State Act 1939

Unauthorised military exercises prohibited.

15.—(1) Save as authorised by a Minister of State under this section, and subject to the exceptions hereinafter mentioned, it shall not be lawful for any assembly of persons to practise or to train or drill themselves in or be trained or drilled in the use of arms or the performance of military exercises, evolutions, or manoeuvres nor for any persons to meet together or assemble for the purpose of so practising or training or drilling or being trained or drilled.

It shouldnt apply to Airsoft but it could be argues that it does. Maybe the govenment really needs to tidy up the law properly?

I knew about this but what do you think anyway:

Defence Forces Temporary Provisions Act 1946

21 (2) No person shall, save with the consent in writing of a Minister of State, go into any public place in the State while wearing any foreign uniform.

Hivemind187

<snip> No, the war was over for the most part - bad Ronan, no history stars for you.

Dunno. Seems to me that there are a lot of "laws"that need to be rethought and reworked (or outright rejected).

Chuck the Buck

Technically I don't think either apply to us - I'm not sure of the law but aren't airsoft toys just that - toys? In other words they're not guns in the legal sense (ignoring the whole assault with a deadly weapon because someone believed it was a real gun).

And as for the uniform thing does it only apply to a correct uniform verses the more usual shirt and pants with other mixed and matched things you see people with?

I remember there being a whole bitching session in shannon because some US soldiers went for a wander in battle dress (camo to you and me) while waiting for a connecting flight. The locals were not impressed, well the locals were happy (they had cash to spend) while unhappy campers were not impressed!

But like everything else the chances of a judge 'doing' you over it would be slim unless it was one of the few 'tickos' left or you got them on a very very bad day!

Rew

Chuck the Buck wrote: »

Technically I don't think either apply to us - I'm not sure of the law but aren't airsoft toys just that - toys? In other words they're not guns in the legal sense (ignoring the whole assault with a deadly weapon because someone believed it was a real gun).

That section doesnt say you have to be training with firearms, just military training or exercise.

And as for the uniform thing does it only apply to a correct uniform verses the more usual shirt and pants with other mixed and matched things you see people with?

Forien military uniforms so dont think mix and match counts but some people go the whole hog on their load out.

nonex

i got a letter last year on this bit,

Offences Against The State Act 1939

Unauthorised military exercises prohibited.

15.—(1) Save as authorised by a Minister of State under this section, and subject to the exceptions hereinafter mentioned, it shall not be lawful for any assembly of persons to practise or to train or drill themselves in or be trained or drilled in the use of arms or the performance of military exercises, evolutions, or manoeuvres nor for any persons to meet together or assemble for the purpose of so practising or training or drilling or being trained or drilled.

but as to date i got no more from them.

i think it was do with the ira training more so, but as it says we are breaking the law.

weeder

i doubt that could remotely effect us unless it was hardcore milsim with realcaps etc

o1s1n

Woodsballers play simulation style games and I've seen British DPM used.

If this were an issue for us, surely then it would have already arisen years ago with paintball?

birdman 1979

their is a massive difference in playing a sport, and 'drilling' or being on an ex. Also to class clothing to be a miltary uniform, should their be rank marking and the countrys colours on it and also unit badges on it too. Thats my 2 cents on the law Airsoft is great fun i dont think that anybody is useing it as a training ground

Tigger

weeder wrote: »

i doubt that could remotely effect us unless it was hardcore milsim with realcaps etc

baby rattles ftw

Tigger

birdman 1979 wrote: »

their is a massive difference in playing a sport, and 'drilling' or being on an ex. Also to class clothing to be a miltary uniform, should their be rank marking and the countrys colours on it and also unit badges on it too. Thats my 2 cents on the law Airsoft is great fun i dont think that anybody is useing it as a training ground

better not bbe i'm the person most likley to fail in a pointless attack on superior forces :pac::pac:

MAD Ozzie

OOOOPS sounds like im gunna be in some sh.t, I love the hard core mil-sim, and most games we play are of that type. (X army an all) I just cant help it.

Glad I changed the name from (Cork Training Ground) to (Southern Airsoft Site Cork)

Gould probly teach them a thing or two

Its all red tape, dont worry, im not, but we should be asking for the laws to be ammended. ( In our favor )

nonex

Unauthorised military exercises prohibited. 15. —(1) Save as authorised by a Minister of State under this section, and subject to the exceptions hereinafter mentioned, it shall not be lawful for any assembly of persons to practise or to train or drill themselves in or be trained or drilled in the use of arms or the performance of military exercises, evolutions, or manoeuvres nor for any persons to meet together or assemble for the purpose of so practising or training or drilling or being trained or drilled.

[GA] (2) A Minister of State may at his discretion by order, subject to such limitations, qualifications and conditions as he shall think fit to impose and shall express in the order, authorise the members of any organisation to meet together and do such one or more of the following things as shall be specified in such order, that is to say, to practise or train or drill themselves in or be trained or drilled in the use of arms or the performance of military exercises, evolutions, or manoeuvres.

this next bit is what i got the letter for,

[GA] (3) If any person is present at or takes part in or gives instruction to or trains or drills an assembly of persons who without or otherwise than in accordance with an authorisation, granted by a Minister of State under this section practise, or train or drill themselves in, or are trained or drilled in the use of arms or the performance of any military exercise, evolution, or manoeuvre or who without or otherwise than in accordance with such authorisation have assembled or met together for the purpose of so practising, or training or drilling or being trained or drilled, such person shall be guilty of a misdemeanour and shall be liable on conviction thereof to imprisonment for a term not exceeding two years.

[GA] (4) This section shall not apply to any assembly of members of any military or police force lawfully maintained by the Government.

[GA] (5) In any prosecution under this section the burden of proof that any act was authorised under this section shall lie on the person prosecuted.

Hivemind187

Actually ... does this apply solely to physical activity? Surely the years I spent war gaming and LARPing could be considered under the same catagory?

Tigger

Hivemind187 wrote: »

Actually ... does this apply solely to physical activity? Surely the years I spent war gaming and LARPing could be considered under the same catagory?

only you could larp with out exercise

Hivemind187

Tigger wrote: »

only you could larp with out exercise

It's a talent, what can I say?

JonAnderton

Is this one of them laws that they choose to forget about unless needed...

ie. should AQ be found up the mountain doing some hardcore 'teambuilding', then they can be done, but if you're playing a harmless sport, they don't bother with it???? I think the word is discretion...

weeder

Tigger wrote: »

baby rattles ftw

your wrong again.
midcaps ftw

CrazyRabbit

We are not involved in military training or exercise. We are involved in Airsoft training or exercise.

A 'military' is an armed group. We are not armed.

Hivemind187

CrazyRabbit wrote: »

We are not involved in military training or exercise. We are involved in Airsoft training or exercise.

A 'military' is an armed group. We are not armed.

... neither are the RDF!

... sorry, I couldnt resist.

Miscreant

Probably said already but don't paintballers do this all the time? Paintball has been up and running a lot longer than Airsoft in this country and has not had any issues with this Law.

As crazyrabbit said a Military is an armed group, we are not armed.

ED E

Yeah, PB guns are legally firearms so technically they are armed.

And the uniforms would only count if as ful uniform with all the insignias ect.

Rew

Lads it says with or without firearms so dont be getting hung up on that. You can train and do execices witout guns. The tacics and drills are the important bit not the firearms.

Rhinocharge

Hivemind187 wrote: »

... neither are the RDF!

... sorry, I couldnt resist.

That's a downright lie.....................they've got sandbags!!

Spetzcong

Interesting, I think it's unlikely that the DoJ are gonna start calling round to sites and doing people for taking part unauthorised military training/manouvers. But it does look like certain aspects of our sport could be viewed as technically illegal according to that law as it currently stands.

Certainly when taking part in team training the main things we focus on are communication, and fire and manouver drills, with a bit of room clearance thrown in for good measure. Although these things are useful for airsoft, it could be argued that they'd be similarly useful from a military point of view and as such are military exercises.

I don't think it matters whether we use firearms, toys, sticks or whatever. Didn't the IRA used to train with hurleys as rifles back in the distant past?

If someone thought that airsofters in general, or a particular bunch of airsofters were infact a clandestine organisation using the sport as a cover to train for more sinister purposes then I'd say the DoJ would (quite rightly) use this law to put a stop to their shenanigans.

I doubt if they'll be in any hurry to change a law that serves a very important purpose in terms of the security of the state, especially not to suit the wishes of a very small group of sports enthusiasts. I also doubt that they'd use a law like this against us unless they really saw airsoft as a threat.

Basically unless Jimmy the Terrorist and his shady bunch of mates start turning up at your local skirmish site, trying to recruit you to their team, and training for something other than airsoft then I don't think we've given the powers that be any reason to bother us.