Desmonds flashes re Charlies death

cooker3

So when Desmond had his flashes the final one featured Claire leaving the island in a helicopter and a big reason why Charlie voluntarily went to his death. This hasn't happened yet. I was always under the impression that the flashes tended to follow on pretty close in time.
Considering Claire situation on the island was this an overcite from the writers or you think it will happen in season 5+6?

Sad Professor

If the vision was true then I don't think it really matters when it happens. I mean Desmond saw Charlie die, what?, 20 times before he actually did. So the future can be changed or at the very least delayed.

danniemcq

perhaps it is still to come if kate brings aaron back to the island too...

cooker3

Sad Professor wrote: »

If the vision was true then I don't think it really matters when it happens. I mean Desmond saw Charlie die, what?, 20 times before he actually did. So the future can be changed or at the very least delayed.

Yeah but Desmond took action which purposely stopped that or least delayed it happening, here everything happened as the flashes said they should. In general the events in each flash occured in a fairly short time frame.

I suppose what I am getting at is when they wrote that did the writers have Claire down as 1 of the O6 maybe. I don't think they write it without intending it to happen, it would make Charlies death a waste but maybe a change of plan or just your standard lost delayed gratification?

rhapsody

I've wondered about this too, and was Charlie's death pointless because Desmond's premonition hasn't happened yet. As danniemcq said though, it might happen when/if they all head back to the island next series. I hope so, he thought he was dying to save Claire & it doesn't seem so yet. it will make it one draaaaaaaaaaaaaawn out mini-conclusion to a story though

Sad Professor

The writers were asked about this at Comic-con earlier. There isn't an exact quote yet but they said they have a plan for this and it will be resolved but not for a while.

I suppose what I am getting at is when they wrote that did the writers have Claire down as 1 of the O6 maybe.

Yeah I think this is quite likely. But if so it's a good change imo. Her current storyline where she's separated from Jack and Aaron and hanging with Christian is more interesting imo. Although with Emilie no longer a member of the regular cast it looks like her story is on hold until the 6th season.

Mellor

cooker3 wrote: »

I suppose what I am getting at is when they wrote that did the writers have Claire down as 1 of the O6 maybe.

Sad Professor wrote: »

Yeah I think this is quite likely

To be honest, I don't think they did. In fact I'm kinda sure of it (as sure as I can be anyway).

This week I started watching season one again, 3 or so episodes a night. and there are so many little tiny things that at the time (when S1 aired) would of meant nothing, and likely didnt notice. But on a seconf viewing (after seeing up to S4) make loads os sense.
Example;
Locke teaches backgammon to Walt. He says, kinda spookily, "there's two sides, one light, and one dark"
Most people would say black and white, but the writers choose light and dark specificly, as it ties in to the over all theme of conflict and choices in later seasons. The dead bodies in the caves also had two stones with them, one light one dark.

I seen claires first flashback episode last night. The main idea was that she is pregnant and a palm reader tells her only she must raise the baby. (his abilities are confirmed before as he "reads" that she is pregnant, and that he BF left her).
A pretty big deal is made out of this, and the palm reader buys claires ticket on the Oceanic flight and we eventually are led to believe that he knew abnout the crash and did it to ensure that she raised the baby.
It was made into such a big deal, that i'm am, pretty sure that the writers always intended to re-visit via somebody minding him



As for the vision, the future changes, maybe some thing that happen with the cabin and christian changed it.

ArmaniJeanss

Haven't at least 2 of Des's premonitions been wrong in major detail though?

As well as Claire not going onto the helicopter with Aaron, there was also his first Penelope premonition that she would parachute onto the island, but it turned out to be Naomi instead.

I originally thought that the premonitions were 'lying' to him, showing him actual events but with the wrong people, though with Des now off the island I'm guessing that idea won't be developed.

Sad Professor

Mellor wrote:

I seen claires first flashback episode last night. The main idea was that she is pregnant and a palm reader tells her only she must raise the baby. (his abilities are confirmed before as he "reads" that she is pregnant, and that he BF left her).
A pretty big deal is made out of this, and the palm reader buys claires ticket on the Oceanic flight and we eventually are led to believe that he knew abnout the crash and did it to ensure that she raised the baby.
It was made into such a big deal, that i'm am, pretty sure that the writers always intended to re-visit via somebody minding him

Yeah I think the Kate/raised by another stuff is working well. The writers said early in the first season that Aaron was of huge significance to the story. Seems he'll be grow up to be someone of great importance but he'll need Claire's guidance.

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

As well as Claire not going onto the helicopter with Aaron, there was also his first Penelope premonition that she would parachute onto the island, but it turned out to be Naomi instead.

He saw flashes of Penny from the past but he never actually saw her as the parachutist. I think he just wanted to believe it was her. Tbh with the exception of the last 5 minutes that whole episode was pointless.

I originally thought that the premonitions were 'lying' to him, showing him actual events but with the wrong people, though with Des now off the island I'm guessing that idea won't be developed.

I never liked the flashes storyline and I'm glad it appears to be over.

My theory regarding the flashes is that Desmond became *slightly* unstuck in time after the hatch implosion. Basically in a much lesser form of what happened to him in The Constant he was jumping forward in time momentarily and coming back with only vague memories of the future. He had met Charlie busking on the streets of London in 1996 during his first time-travel experience and as a result Charlie became a kinda of constant which is why all his flashes focused around him.

Bah it's not a perfect explanation but it works for me.

cooker3

It was Naomi and not Penny who was the parachutist because he saved Charlie's life again and therefore changing what his flashes suggested were supposed to happen.
The difference between all the flashes that we know off and the final one which I mentioned above is that everything happened in the way it should have according to the flashes and Claire getting on the copter should have so followed.

As an aside I really liked the flashes storyline but I love all stories involving Desmond

Sad Professor

cooker3 wrote: »

It was Naomi and not Penny who was the parachutist because he saved Charlie's life again and therefore changing what his flashes suggested were supposed to happen.

I think Naomi was always the parachutist and Des just misinterpreted the flashes. All the shots of Penny are from previous episodes.

cooker3

Sad Professor wrote: »

I think Naomi was always the parachutist and Des just misinterpreted the flashes. All the shots of Penny are from previous episodes.

I'd think that be more due to didn't want to or couldn't bring in Sonya Walger to film a new scene (at a guess)

ItalianPosh

In Lost it seems the writers sometimes get entangled in the plot that it becomes very difficult to follow and Desmond's flashes are a prime example.

Talisman

cooker3 wrote: »

So when Desmond had his flashes the final one featured Claire leaving the island in a helicopter and a big reason why Charlie voluntarily went to his death. This hasn't happened yet. I was always under the impression that the flashes tended to follow on pretty close in time.
Considering Claire situation on the island was this an overcite from the writers or you think it will happen in season 5+6?

I don't recall Desmond having the vision of Claire getting on the helicopter but he did tell Charlie about it. My take on it was that Desmond was getting pissed off with repeatedly saving Charlie's life and decided to let Charlie die. He told Charlie that he had to die in order for Claire and Aaron to be saved so that he would face his death with dignity and be a hero.