What to do with languages?

Claire121

I'm just looking for advice, and yes, I know it's up to me to decide what to do with my life but everything has gone off track lately. Basically, I decided to do languages in college as I pick them up easily, enjoy learning them and am really interested in linguistics. I was always told it was a good 'general' degree to have (I was also interested in doing web design, speech therapy and psychology but kept changing my mind).

In the back of my mind I guess I always wanted to be an interpreter or translator and wanted to do a postgrad in translation (I even have an offer at UCL for this year!) but I've realised it's pretty much impossible to be an interpreter unless you grew up bilingual/trilingual and work for translators is hard to find and badly paid. Any job I can find requiring a language degree is usually in a call centre paying under 21K! People keep saying 'ah you'll have no problem finding a great job with your languages', but I'm not finding anything, not anything that doesn't require loads of experience or skills I don't have. I'd be willing to take a low paid job and be able to move up to something I really want, as I'm currently doing admin work which has nothing to do with my degree or plans. I speak Spanish and French, and passable German, and would be willing to move abroad if necessary.

AARRRGH

You were given bad advice. Languages, although they are a great skill, are nearly worthless when it comes to employment.

I know a quad-lingual girl (Spanish, German, French, English) who can only get jobs around 26k.

Could you do some kind of management course and try to be a manager in a call centre?

Edit: Just thought of a good idea: You could work as a localiser in a games company?

Claire121

I know people who did languages and have great jobs or prospects, working in Brussels, but most of them did European Studies or Law with a language - wish I'd gone down that route, but it's too late now. I would be willing to do a postgrad course in business or European Studies if it would be useful. The problem seems to be having JUST languages. It's odd that we were constantly told though school and college that there are loads of companies who employ 'any graduate' once they have a good degree from a good college. Is that just untrue?

I definitely don't want to be a manager in a call centre if I can help it, and I'm not sure what a localiser is?

lee_humphrey

How about a PGCE, and to teach the languages?

Claire121

Definitely have no interest in teaching children in a school. I am interested in teaching ESL, especially abroad, but don't know if I'd want to do it forever!

AARRRGH

Claire121 wrote: »

I know people who did languages and have great jobs or prospects, working in Brussels, but most of them did European Studies or Law with a language

European Studies and Law are both very different than linguistics!

Claire121 wrote: »

It's odd that we were constantly told though school and college that there are loads of companies who employ 'any graduate' once they have a good degree from a good college. Is that just untrue?

There are lots of companies who would be delighted to employ people with degrees. Unfortunately they only offer ****ty call centre jobs with crap pay.

Claire121 wrote: »

I definitely don't want to be a manager in a call centre if I can help it, and I'm not sure what a localiser is?

Localiser is a software tester who is fluent in a language. Software testing is a good job with good prospects.

My advice: do a post graduate course.

Cato

Ive been speaking Spanish since a young lad, (half Spanish) i don't really mention on the CV but normal only mention in the interview gives me something to talk about, i think out of all the interviews i have done it was looked upon as a positive trait by the employees, but it has yet to solely get me a job on its own. Then again i never took advantage of the skill and studied some sort of EU studies type course, mainly because im not sure if is something im interested in

I try to use my second language as a sort of "benefit to hiring" me an added extra that comes with me free, and has probably put me higher up on the list with a regular Joe with just English and have gotten jobs ahead of other people because of it! i try to make the most of it! (Jammy bastard yer thinking?:D)

I supose i could get a job solely on my Spanish skills theres not many out there i can think of that i would enjoy, a secondly language is very usefull in getting you a job though!:pac:

Claire121

European Studies and Law are both very different than linguistics!

I didn't do linguistics, I did languages which included history, politics, language, literature, translation and some linguistics. There's very little difference between that and European Studies (we had almost all the same classes, only they had a few extra politics instead of literature), yet ES graduates seem to be more employable.

Ive been speaking Spanish since a young lad, (half Spanish) i don't really mention on the CV but normal only mention in the interview gives me something to talk about, i think out of all the interviews i have done it was looked upon as a positive trait by the employees, but it has yet to solely get me a job on its own. Then again i never took advantage of the skill and studied some sort of EU studies type course, mainly because im not sure if is something im interested in

Yeah.......I was originally going to do a 'useful' type course (computer related or business) and do the languages on the side, but I was told that a language degree was better as otherwise I wouldn't have 'proof' that I spoke the languages or was really interested in them. Yes I see now that was rotten advice. People always said 'sure you can do the business course after' but they're not the ones having to cough up the fees to do it :rolleyes: I guess postgrad it is, however!

Localiser is a software tester who is fluent in a language. Software testing is a good job with good prospects.

Sounds interesting, can you get into that with just languages?

AARRRGH

Well you can't get into it without languages. If you have good IT skills, you could get a job doing it.

You may have gotten bad advice, but at the end of the day you're in your situation because of your own decisions. Do a post grad and you'll be able to get a better job. It'll work out ok with a bit of effort.

Claire121

LOL you say that in every post
Yes, I know it's because of my own decision, I just wish I'd been warned earlier of how difficult it is to make it as a translator/interpreter (my dream job). I would love to do a postgrad, just it's going to be a struggle to pay for it so I wanna make sure it's something I'm really interested in. Is it worth doing something like business or European Studies or is it equally useless for getting a job?

Calina

Claire,

let me give you some background to me. I studied French and German in college with major in translation. From there, I did an assistantship in a French lycée, and then moved into junior marketing admin in Germany. I then spent some time in France working as bilingual secretary before going back to the UK to do a postgrad in interpreting. The plan from that was to go interpreting in Brussels but my timing was somewhat off in that they were rationalising the freelance set up at the time. So I wound up back in admin, at around 28000E. 10 years ago. Incidentally, growing up bi or trilingual is not a minimum requirement to be an interpreter, but you do need a minimum of three passive languages. Most English native speakers don't manage this.

When I came back to Ireland in 1999, I was told "you'll have no trouble, with your languages and your background". I had major, major problems with my languages and my experience. I was offered the equivalent of 15000E a year as a tech support analyst with two languages. In addition to native English, I mean.

I'm going to be blunt about this. If you want credit for your languages you will need two things: to get the hell out of this country. The ability to communicate effectively in another culture is only valued here if you come from a culture that is not English native speaking. The other thing you need is a bit of vision for yourself.

NOthing is going to land on your plate without you actually going to get it. You say you've some admin experience.

This is what I did when I was 23 years old. I jacked in a job I hated and moved to Paris and temped. And I temped in Brussels. And on each occasion I was in a position to turn down good and well paid jobs in both places.

For you, I get the impression you have no idea what you really want to do. This is probably the root of your problems rather than having a language degree. If you don't know what you want to study I strongly advise against doing any postgrad until you've identified something you do have an interest in.

If you're willing to move, then go. It is the first step forward.

AARRRGH

Claire121 wrote: »

LOL you say that in every post

Yeah, sorry, but I'm a big believer in personal responsibility and working hard to get what you want.

Claire121 wrote: »

Yes, I know it's because of my own decision, I just wish I'd been warned earlier of how difficult it is to make it as a translator/interpreter (my dream job).

Yep. I got no advice. Luckily I did computer science (because I liked computer games) as I didn't have a clue what I wanted to do!

Claire121 wrote: »

I would love to do a postgrad, just it's going to be a struggle to pay for it so I wanna make sure it's something I'm really interested in. Is it worth doing something like business or European Studies or is it equally useless for getting a job?

I'm not sure.

You need to find a balance between what you want to do and what will give you a job.

What age are you?

Claire121

Calina thanks for the advice!

let me give you some background to me. I studied French and German in college with major in translation. From there, I did an assistantship in a French lycée, and then moved into junior marketing admin in Germany. I then spent some time in France working as bilingual secretary before going back to the UK to do a postgrad in interpreting. The plan from that was to go interpreting in Brussels but my timing was somewhat off in that they were rationalising the freelance set up at the time. So I wound up back in admin, at around 28000E. 10 years ago.

Can I ask how you managed to get the job as a marketing admin and bilingual secretary? Did you just see and ad and apply for them? Did you have contacts?

Incidentally, growing up bi or trilingual is not a minimum requirement to be an interpreter, but you do need a minimum of three passive languages. Most English native speakers don't manage this.

Oh I know it isn't, officially, but every interpreter I've met has grown up with at least 2 languages. I started to think, how can I possibly compete with these people? Yes, very negative but quite realistic from what I've seen/heard By a minimum of 3 passive languages, do you mean total fluency in English + 2 languages, or English + 3 languages?

I'm going to be blunt about this. If you want credit for your languages you will need two things: to get the hell out of this country. The ability to communicate effectively in another culture is only valued here if you come from a culture that is not English native speaking. The other thing you need is a bit of vision for yourself.

I don't mind getting out of this country at all, I'm not even Irish, in fact. One of the reasons I did languages was to have the chance to live in other countries. Your experience working in France and Belgium is exactly the kind of thing I want to do - just work and live in another country/culture and keep up my fluency in the languages. I just don't really know where to start re moving abroad, what kind of jobs I'd realistically get etc. I have worked in France and Spain before but just menial jobs like cleaner, waitress and au pair.

Can I ask how fluent your French and German were before you moved abroad? Would you have already been fairly fluent just from doing the degree? Sorry to be so nosy but I'm really interested

Claire121

Yeah, sorry, but I'm a big believer in personal responsibility and working hard to get what you want.

Me too. It's knowing what you want that's the killer!

What age are you?

Just turned 23, out of college a year.

faceman

Claire i would recommend studying another discipline or skill which will add to your skillset. E.g. finance etc. It will definitely open you up to higher paying jobs. There are many EMEA companies in Ireland that cry out for skilled multilinguals. (i.e. multilinguals with other qualifications etc)

Calina

Claire121 wrote: »

Calina thanks for the advice!

You're welcome.

Claire121 wrote: »

Can I ask how you managed to get the job as a marketing admin and bilingual secretary? Did you just see and ad and apply for them? Did you have contacts?

Marketing admin turned up in the jobs newsletter from college. This was pre-internet days I must confess. I did not have contacts. Bilingual secretary - I was on a recruitment agency's books and the contact was via them. It was a short term contact but I turned down permanency.

Claire121 wrote: »

Oh I know it isn't, officially, but every interpreter I've met has grown up with at least 2 languages. I started to think, how can I possibly compete with these people? Yes, very negative but quite realistic from what I've seen/heard By a minimum of 3 passive languages, do you mean total fluency in English + 2 languages, or English + 3 languages?

You interpret out of a passive language into your active. In your case, as an English native speaker, English is your active. You need three passives, in my case that would have been French and German plus I was looking at adding Spanish and Finnish. Quite a lot of the intepreters I knew grew up bilingual, but, it's fair to say not all of them. Most of the English natives didn't, as it happens. That being said, interpreting is intellectually very, very tough work. I miss it though but I was making the call between living in Ireland and living in Belgium when I turned my back on it.

Claire121 wrote: »

I don't mind getting out of this country at all, I'm not even Irish, in fact. One of the reasons I did languages was to have the chance to live in other countries. Your experience working in France and Belgium is exactly the kind of thing I want to do - just work and live in another country/culture and keep up my fluency in the languages. I just don't really know where to start re moving abroad, what kind of jobs I'd realistically get etc. I have worked in France and Spain before but just menial jobs like cleaner, waitress and au pair.

Okay. For the most part I shipped off to somewhere and found a job while I was there. So from a practical point, you need, at this stage, to start saving money so that you have the wherewithal to set yourself up when you get somewhere. For that purpose, you'll need rent and a deposit plus something to live on for at least a month. I went into admin because it was comparatively easy to find work in it. If you're going to go down that road you need a high level typing speed in at least one of your languages. The standard for English is around 60 upwards in the UK; it was about 50 in Belgium (they didn't get so many of the supergood secretary/admins there for some reason). You need something to sell in addition to yourself. My experience is that competent admin staff will not want for work. I haven't worked in admin for 9 years but I can still type 90 wpm.

Ultimately, if you want to go other places, it's up to you to go there and make it happen for yourself.

Claire121 wrote: »

Can I ask how fluent your French and German were before you moved abroad? Would you have already been fairly fluent just from doing the degree? Sorry to be so nosy but I'm really interested

By the time I finished college, both my French and German were comparatively fluent. My fluency, however, was born of spending quite a lot of time in both countries during the degree time; one year in Germany at university and a summer in France. Of the two of them now, my French is probably better.

As a general note, you're in a fantastic position in that the internet makes research quite a lot easier. For example, you're interested in Belgium. You can, with comparative ease, ask google to help you find out how much basics like accommodation cost there. You can have a look at what's available in the jobs market, and tailor your documentation accordingly. When I did all this, it was...not quite so easy, I must say.

AARRRGH

Claire121 wrote: »

Just turned 23, out of college a year.

You're young, so don't be worrying or hard on yourself.

I'm 30 and only really got my **** together around two or three years ago.

As long as you keep an open mind and don't allow yourself get stuck in a rut, you'll eventually land in the right job.

Defo try to go the post grad route though!

rio1

I think with languages you do need to maybe move away from them for awhile, in work at least, but keep them up, get experience in something else, and then go back to combine two valuable skills.

I have a degree in German and Spanish, I worked in a call centre for a year after college to save some money, then went to Germany for 2 years. When I came back I started a job in financial services, using my German for the first year, but not for a few years then as I built up my CV. At the same time I did professional accountancy exams, and then once qualified decided to find something where I could use my languages again...there are plently of opportunities for German speaking accountants, you do need to be very fluent in business as well as conversational German though.

I heard the same about how it would be simple to get a good job with my languages too, but its just not enough to speak the languages...there is too much competition for roles from Europeans who speak English almost as well as us, plus their own mother tongue and often other languages as well, and they have other qualifications too, so you need to add more strings to your bow as well.

legs11

learn japanese, and do IT work like VB, java etc.

guranteed work in japan and nice money.

Claire121

By the time I finished college, both my French and German were comparatively fluent. My fluency, however, was born of spending quite a lot of time in both countries during the degree time; one year in Germany at university and a summer in France. Of the two of them now, my French is probably better.

I spent a year at uni in Spain and worked summers in France and Spain as well, so I do at least have some experience of surviving in another country. I suppose it's hard to define 'fluency' - I was one of the best in oral classes and general 'speaking' of the language, but not so great when comparing myself to bilingual people in terms of vocabulary. I'm probably being too hard on myself, but I do lack confidence in my ability. I think I need to get myself out there, in the country, to feel confident. For some reason I feel a bit stupid/self conscious speaking French and Spanish in Ireland because I'm not surrounded by it, it feels very forced and awkward.

Claire i would recommend studying another discipline or skill which will add to your skillset. E.g. finance etc. It will definitely open you up to higher paying jobs. There are many EMEA companies in Ireland that cry out for skilled multilinguals. (i.e. multilinguals with other qualifications etc)

The thing is, I went to school in the UK, so I did A-Levels. I did French, German and English Lit, which effectively cut out all my maths/sciencey options. I haven't done maths since I was 15, and I only got a C in GCSE, which meant I didn't even have the option of studying economics or finance at college. Would I be able to get into it now I have a degree or would I face the same problem as before?

Euro_Kraut

Languages are a sauce. Pretty useless by themselves, but make the world of difference on top of something else.

My advise (another poster already suggested this) is to do a post grad in some other area such as biuness or economics. With a technical qualification topped up with your linguistic abilities (you are clearly talented at langauges) you will be very employable.

The language may not help you get a job, but they will be very useful when you are in the job.

By the way I have a Arts degree in German & Econ and a Masters in Economics - just to let you know where I am coming from.

dundealgan

Hi Claire,

I am in the EXACT same position as you! I am 23 and graduated with a degree in German and Spanish with translation specialism 2 years ago.

I have applied for translation jobs with gaming companies but to no avail, you have to have an interest in that area. I went into Admin straight after college and have gained a lot of experience since then, but 2 years on I am being made redundant and am unable to find a job that I like with the lingo! I absolutely love speaking Spanish and it really pains me that I cant get the opportunity to use it!

I am hoping to do a home study business management course when I finish up work in a few weeks, with the hope that this will help me get a job in a Business-y field... Would you be interested in something like this? I can send you details if you like.

Personally, I think I would like to go into Management, but of the office type, not retail. Even still, this doesn't give me much more scope to use the Spanish.

flycruise

Hi Claire,

Would you think of studying something abroad? What about a post graduate (or equilivent (SP!)) in Spain or Germany? This would increase confidence in your ability in a learning environment, along with increasing your employment opportunities...

Just a suggestion!

Claire121

Would you think of studying something abroad? What about a post graduate (or equilivent (SP!)) in Spain or Germany? This would increase confidence in your ability in a learning environment, along with increasing your employment opportunities...

I'd love to but no idea WHAT to study. I don't want to make the mistake of doing another pointless course. I don't think I'm qualified for most finance/economics courses, as I haven't done maths since GCSE, and I'm not sure about business. I'm a very easygoing person, can't stand the 'career women' types so not sure how how much that kind of environment would suit me. Stuff I'd be really passionate about would be film, TV, media work, tourism, welfare/charity/human rights organisations etc. Something where I could feel like I was making a difference or doing something interesting and exciting with my days.

Sitting in an office 9-5 crunching numbers would be soul destroying - my dad was an artist who became an accountant and seeing how unhappy it made him, I wouldn't want to go down that path.

NinjaTruncs

Dublindube mentioned getting into localisation. for testers/engineers/translators it's low enough pay unless you get into the right company, but project management in localisation pays OK. you could alway look into doing a IT or Project Management course.

tmax

Hi Claire,

If you are determined you will get a job in translation, but not necessarily immediately. There are many companies that need bilingual administrators etc - you could do a keyword search with "Spanish" in jobs.ie once a week, something always crops up. If you like travelling try that, have some fun and improve your languages. It wont hurt your CV to be experimenting with different jobs/ countries (while you're in your 20s) and travelling now might help you settle down later. Maybe try Disney/ Port Aventura and have a laugh :rolleyes:

There are many translation/interpreting companies in Dublin (see the golden pages), the biggest of which is probably Lionbridge in Dun Laoghaire. Usually its part time work at all hours going to police stations/ prisons/ courts/ hospitals etc, paying €25+ per hour. There's a part time course in DCU for translation, a little add-on to your CV (for professionalism). If I was you I wouldnt commit to a full time course right away. When doing interviews its far more convincing talking about previous work experience than previous study.

Good luck

Serafijn

I was in a very similar situation to yourself in that I studied just languages and had trouble finding anything after finishing. I worked in a call centre for a couple of years and developed my languages on a business level. After a while I got really bored and was looking round for something new when I got lucky and got a administrative job in the recruitment department of a huge international company. It's spiralled from there and 2 years on I'm happily working as a recruiter in another large, well-known company

If your interest is in media, tourism etc then as tmax says it wouldn't hurt to try places like Eurodisney and the like and work there whilst doing a part time translation course. Chances are that something will come up when you're least expecting it! I think a lot of the people who really love their jobs just kinda wound up there without really meaning to so don't worry too much if you haven't got a 5 year master plan!

galah

Get into technical translations (if you like that sort of thing). English native speakers who can competently translate from German, for example, are always needed.

Pay is actually ok if you're with the right crowd.

(I studied Technical Translations in Germany, which meant classes in Mechanical Engineering, Electrical Engineering, Network Technologies, general software concepts, translation theory and linguistics, and CAT-tools, both in English and German. Great craic, if you like technical stuff. If you can't get your head around technology in any shape or form, don't go there....)

Macha

Friend of mine runs a translation business. PM me your details & I'll pass them on

radioactiveman

Whatever you do don't go into technical support. Dead end. Very poorly paid also for what is actually a very skilled job if you are working with 2 or 3 different languages.
How about accountancy with a language? It could open a lot of doors if you were prepared to do even a basic accounting technician course.