ESB prices hikes 17% now and January

mike65

Batten down the hatches or at lest turn off the lights, the regulator has once again tried and heroicly failed to wave through a request to jack-up prices.

Two tranches - in 3 weeks and January

Mike.

It's a joke, sooner some competition comes the better.

mikemac

Meh, my bill have never topped €90.

In fact, much of it is made of fixed costs like standing charges and VAT so it's not realy worth being so careful.

Yes, my post will be ripped to shreds but the price of ESB is not a concern to all

mukki

its fine for all the wasters who get huge bills as they will now make a point to turn things off more

.....they might even make a saving




but the poor people who are always very careful with how much esb they use will just have to fork out more then they used too

Phototoxin

burn down the esb stations and use them for fuel! however with the oil hike it had to come. I just dont see why oil goes up in price

whiskeyman

hellboy99 wrote: »

It's a joke, sooner some competition comes the better.

Competition is here (Airtricity have announced their re-launch into the domestic market: http://www.rte.ie/business/2008/0709/airtricity.html) but they'll probably just follow the ESB tbh.


Elec prices have gone up by 30% in the UK already... was only a matter of time.

Oryx

Not as if its cheap right now anyway.:( Why is it that the price never seems to go so vastly down during the boom times?

Still, at least were not in South Africa where week long power outages are the norm now as the electricity companys sell power across the border and dont have enough to maintain a full supply to their own country.

mike65

This will make the economic downturn that bit deeper. I spent most of last winter in the dark as it was.

Mike.

whiskeyman

mike65 wrote: »

This will make the economic downturn that bit deeper. I spent most of last winter in the dark as it was.

Mike.

sure will... and businesses will be hit hard and will probably pass on the increase to customers.... it's like a double whammy.

ixoy

Even worse if you're on gas - rumours of a 35%-40% price increase there according to RTE News URL="http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0711/esb.html"]link[/URL.

mike65

Cheers, I might as well kill myself now, or move to Spain/Greece

Mike.

whiskeyman

whiskeyman wrote: »

Competition is here (Airtricity have announced their re-launch into the domestic market: http://www.rte.ie/business/2008/0709/airtricity.html) but they'll probably just follow the ESB tbh.

But will I be able to get it where I live ?

This country will be brought to it's knees not too long, no thanks to the government either.

whiskeyman

hellboy99 wrote: »

But will I be able to get it where I live ?

This country will be brought to it's knees not too long, no thanks to the government either.

You can signup for airtricity with ease.
Are you currently with ESB?
You don't change meters / cables etc... All you do is contact them and organise a contract. The process may take a few weeks, but then Airtricity will be billing you, and not the ESB.

ongarite

What do people expect? The era of cheap energy is over and everyone worldwide have to live with the consequences.
Companies suck up all the increased cost of energy and go out of business
OR
Pass on increase to customer and continue to make profit?

At least ESB are taking 300M charge to keep potential increase smaller than projected 30%.

BigglesMcGee

I wouldnt count on Airtricity.
Airtricity will probably be more expensive than ESB.
They just count on your conscience to allow them to gouge you instead of the esb

Davy

BigglesMcGee wrote: »

I wouldnt count on Airtricity.
Airtricity will probably be more expensive than ESB.
They just count on your conscience to allow them to gouge you instead of the esb

+1

Last figure i heard was 10% dearer than ESB

What do Airtricity charge ?

ejmaztec

hellboy99 wrote: »

What do Airtricity charge ?

Arm+Leg+vat @ 13.5%

Davy

ejmaztec wrote: »

Arm+Leg+vat @ 13.5%

nice

Clytus

I might just be a cynic here....but maybe its a very clever way of the Goverment to grab some extra revenue from VAT...given the state is already down by €560 big ones in the area of VAT recipets.

Scottie99

In the UK and you pay by direct debit you can avail of discounts to your bill. Here you get put into a fecking prize draw! :mad:

Cabaal

Might be all worth getting one of these http://www.ecologics.ie/online-store/

I got one last week and its piss easy install and your be surprised as hell what uses the most power, makes it VERY easy to track whats been left on and makes you aware of stuff you just don't need on

More info from offical website, but if your buying buy from link above - http://www.efergy.com/en/

Davy

Scottie99 wrote: »

In the UK and you pay by direct debit you can avail of discounts to your bill. Here you get put into a fecking prize draw! :mad:

Ye, or extra charges for not payin DD, not related to esb tho

Clytus wrote: »

I might just be a cynic here....but maybe its a very clever way of the Goverment to grab some extra revenue from VAT...given the state is already down by €560 big ones in the area of VAT recipets.

The government don't decide the increase its the energy regulator

Clytus

davton wrote: »

Ye, or extra charges for not payin DD, not related to esb tho



The government don't decide the increase its the energy regulator

Energy regulator= Quango????

mike65

Clytus wrote: »

I might just be a cynic here....but maybe its a very clever way of the Goverment to grab some extra revenue from VAT...given the state is already down by €560 big ones in the area of VAT recipets.

This was mentioned on radio today, it was suggested that the government could tweak matters so VAT was paid on part of a unit to give some relief. Dunno how legal that would be under EU law.

Mike.

Davy

Clytus wrote: »

Energy regulator= Quango????

Well stuff like this is always going to have this question of doubt behind it. Not much can really be said unless on the inside I guess, but for the basic answer we have the CER to deal with this an independent.. or so were told anyway

Clytus

Im sure like every business in this country Board Gas and the ESb have been forced to absorb material cost increases....but it would be interesting to see to what level.

Scottie99

Ye, or extra charges for not payin DD, not related to esb tho

Wrong

Davy

Ye well i suppose the refund of 3/4 of the profits is some sort of relief. Its like the 6million dollar question, how will anyone know the right percentage. Have to best work on figures we hear, published etc. I think it was obvious that an increase was on the cards, every business that uses fuel has increased. Has anyone done investigation for the fuel surcharges of airlines etc did they actually merit the amount they increased

Davy

Scottie99 wrote: »

Ye, or extra charges for not payin DD, not related to esb tho

Wrong

Want to expand a little? Three ireland is one example, their is a €4.50 charge for not paying by DD

If you don't have a bank account you can pay by postal order. They're similar to cheques and you can buy them at any An Post. You'll be charged a €4.50 fee each month if you pay by postal order.

I think Ntl had something similar, but might have changed it again cant remember. Bit of thread topic anyway.

Scottie99

davton wrote: »

Want to expand a little? Three ireland is one example, their is a €4.50 charge for not paying by DD

The discount is given as an encouragement to pay direct debit. If you don't its just the bog standard bill and no extra charges are added. If I remember correctly UPC here charge for non D.D.

I can't remember off hand what the discount is but I'll try and contact family and edit later.

EDIT- picked this off British Gas website

° Monthly Direct Debit £57 Discount Gas customers paying by Monthly Direct Debit will receive a discount off their quarterly consumption charges of 10.3%, up to a maximum of £16.89 (including VAT) per quarter. Based on average annual gas consumption of 20,500 kWh as at 8th May 2008, is rounded and includes VAT at 5%. Discount received varies according to seasonal consumption.Subject to status, and not having an overdue gas account.

Davy

We don't live in Britain? Why are you quoting British terms? I was talking about Ireland and what applies to us. UPC is a €2 charge.

Why is there is a €2 non-Direct Debit fee on my bill?

Your new bill will itemise our non-Direct Debit charge which was previously included in your normal subscription fee. Paying by Direct Debit is the most convenient way to pay your bill; it will save you time and it’s hassle free with the reassurance that your bills are always paid on time. To pay your bill by Direct Debit please complete the Direct Debit mandate on the back of your bill and return it to UPC, PO Box 321, Dublin 3, or call us on 1908 and one of our agents will assist you.

I don't see this as a discount, or a normal bill

The_Conductor

Ok- so the price rise is 17% on the 1st of August- whats the story with the 1st of January when the ESB EUR300m subsidy runs out? Another 17-20% rise? Ontop of an estimated 38-40% rise in gas? Fcuk..... I think we'll have to buy extra heavy quilts and thermal underwear....... I see M&S are whacking up prices on them too....... Can't win.......:(

Davy

This would be a nicer scenario, they seem to be looking into it, the odds of a change I gather are slim to none? Have they ever got anything major changed?

“We feel that the current situation is not beneficial for consumers as peak electricity usage times are usually in the months leading up to Christmas. We would therefore be looking for the ESB’s contribution to come into effect from August 1st to coincide with the interim price increase of 17.5%.”

Colonel Sanders

Maybe its time to revisit the report by Deloitte and see can savings be made within the ESB rather than just automtically jacking prices up.

The Government has ruled out a partial break-up of ESB, even though its own consultants maintained it would improve competitiveness and thereby reduce prices to the consumer.

The Deloitte report maintains high labour costs and inefficiencies at ESB power stations adds €100 million to costs, compared to its EU peers.

mike65

smccarrick wrote: »

Ok- so the price rise is 17% on the 1st of August- whats the story with the 1st of January when the ESB EUR300m subsidy runs out? Another 17-20% rise? Ontop of an estimated 38-40% rise in gas? Fcuk..... I think we'll have to buy extra heavy quilts and thermal underwear....... I see M&S are whacking up prices on them too....... Can't win.......:(

An electric overblanket is the way forwards they hardly use any power on a low setting - just sling it over you and the misses as you watch tv in January.

Mike.

Seth Brundle

hellboy99 wrote: »

It's a joke, sooner some competition comes the better.

Could this be a way for the ESB to raise prices before competition comes in?

whiskeyman wrote: »

Competition is here (Airtricity have announced their re-launch into the domestic market: http://www.rte.ie/business/2008/0709/airtricity.html) but they'll probably just follow the ESB tbh.


Elec prices have gone up by 30% in the UK already... was only a matter of time.

How can airtricity be that expensive, especially given that their costs are not significant on an ongoing basis?

Colonel Sanders wrote: »

Maybe its time to revisit the report by Deloitte and see can savings be made within the ESB rather than just automtically jacking prices up.

Yeah, the unions would love that and we know how strong FF are towards the unions!

Davy

Colonel Sanders wrote: »

Maybe its time to revisit the report by Deloitte and see can savings be made within the ESB rather than just automtically jacking prices up.

But I think esb (generation) have to sell there stations, I think the CER is forcing them to a maximum market share of 40% for generation by next year regards of the break up or not. Im pretty sure poolbeg is sold already (the towers as their know as)

This price increase is from ESB gen, of course which 'customer supply' has to pass on, so this break-up wouldn't have an effect on this increase I think.

dsane1

mike65 wrote: »

This was mentioned on radio today, it was suggested that the government could tweak matters so VAT was paid on part of a unit to give some relief. Dunno how legal that would be under EU law.

Mike.

Hi ,this eu law bit is part of the reason the lisbon treaty was rejected ,a simplistic view i know but true too.!

Scottie99

davton wrote: »

We don't live in Britain? Why are you quoting British terms? I was talking about Ireland and what applies to us. UPC is a €2 charge.

I don't see this as a discount, or a normal bill

The reason being is that we don't get discount for using DD here unlike UK. We should be getting discount!!!!

poolfan

hi anyone know if airtricity gona be competitive against the esb. how could it be dearer if they get there energy for free!!

craichoe

poolfan wrote: »

hi anyone know if airtricity gona be competitive against the esb. how could it be dearer if they get there energy for free!!

Initial investment and ongoing costs for maintenence are there. I was with Airtricity and they charged the same as the ESB
Although renewable energy is the opposite to fossil fuels, the more people use it the cheaper it gets rather than GAS which is the opposite

Seth Brundle

craichoe wrote: »

Initial investment and ongoing costs for maintenence are there. I was with Airtricity and they charged the same as the ESB
Although renewable energy is the opposite to fossil fuels, the more people use it the cheaper it gets rather than GAS which is the opposite

With renewable energy, as with any other form, there is a large initial outlay but with renewable energy there is't the same level of ongoing cost. However, I can't see any of the renewable providers wanting to significantly undercut the ESB on price. Call me sceptical but I also can't see the regulator allowing them to either!

ejmaztec

Got a 22nd May issued Airtricity bill in front of me for one of the companies that I deal with.


If anyone's interested:

Fixed Commercial Day 0.1597 per unit
Fixed Commercial Night 30% 0.0781 -do-
Standing charge P6 Fixed 0.4399 per day

All plus vat & 13.5%

The bill tells the customer that 1297kgs of CO2 have not been released into the atmosphere as a result of the customer's dealing with Airtricity.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

hellboy99 wrote: »

It's a joke, sooner some competition comes the better.

I think you're missing the whole point here. Competition in the Irish market has been in place for a number of years now and this led to several increases in price in order to encourage other participants in to the market. The domestic market has been ignored by all other suppliers as they say they can't make money on it. Airtricity tried a couple of years ago and then just abandoned their customers when they pulled out. They say they will try again in 2009...wait and see.
Do you want competition in only the Supply & Generation businesses or do you want it on the Transmission and Distribution business as well? Imagine the cost (not to mention the mass of lines) if each competitor build all their own networks through the country!
Also, keep in mind that when competition came in the new companies picked the customers that yielded the max profit with min cost - e.g. Dublin City but not remote rural customers.
The increases proposed are actully below those being applied in other countries and you can't have lived on this planet for the past year and not expected it, when Oil & Gas have risen so much. The labour costs in ESB are not the problem; it's the fuel.
I'd be interested to see how usage will decrease when price go up again because for the past 7 years there has been a substancial increase in the average usage by domestic customers. Perhaps electricity isn't expensive enough if people continue to use more and more of it. :P