"Here on Today fm, we're so indie"

Ekels

First and foremost, indie is among my favourite genres of music and like to think of myself as being fairly well-equipped to comment on the genre's radio exposure etc. (www.last.fm/user/ekels21)

I often find myself feeling a little ill when daytime radio puts the top 40 (mostly top 10) in the music charts on repeat. It gets a bit too much when the latest Sugababes single is to be heard every hour.

In the past, I've found myself questioning why Irish radio stations tend not to give much daytime exposure to alternative music. I don't mean The Decemberists getting a spin on Rick O'Shea's show. I mean the Irish bands such as Delorentos, the Flaws and co. I can't stand some of them (particularly those mentioned) but I feel it takes a previously acclaimed band a smash hit single and commercially successful album to forge a good relationship with it's Irish DJ's (see Bell X1).

Perhaps referring to the Irish indie guitar bands is straying off the main point of my argument, but it's a factor.

Anyway, I was recently delighted to hear that Alison Curtis had received her own show, each week day, for the two hours following Tom Dunne. Curtis and Dunne are two fine DJs, likeable characters with decent taste in music.

I recently decided I was going to try my utmost to listen to the shows of Dunne and Curtis, to show my support to Today fm's clear new evening-time direction. I was rather optimistic.

My opinion has now changed. I've come to the conclusion that five hours of indie/alternative music per day is too much. The main reason is Dunne and Curtis' pedestrian choices. Their shows largely feature today's most bland indie guitar bands. Their is little or no desire to branch out into genres such as electronic, ambient, jazz or post-rock. It's just too easy for the pair of them to sit on their stools each night and play the same old stuff.

Fair enough if some of you think I'm talking nonsense and being contradictory. I just feel that the pair could make better use of the five hours that they receive.

What is everyone's verdict on this?

mike65

Electic is great if you are the DJ and your audience is er you. On radio sadly it doesn't work like that and even the most "out-there" shows end up focusing thier playlists on a relative handful of acts and styles. The audience of course forms around that output and so there is no great pressure to change and if everyone started e-mailing demanding to hear thier favs the DJ would almost certainly ignore everything exept whatever happened to pique his/her interest.

Mike.

Ekels

I can see the sense in everything that you're saying and I think you're right on many counts. I just think it's a wasted opportunity.

I see what you mean. I'll put it in political terms. Daytime Today Fm is far right. Whatever grandoise that one can associate with the evening couple, they are still only straying slightly towards centre and are still fundamentally right i.e conservative. I don't want them to become all out lefties, just to mix things up a bit.

I don't think that Curtis is capable of becoming eclectic though. From what I've heard over the past few years, she remains very close to the stereotypical Pitchfork muso template.

Furthermore, she doesn't aspire to pleasing the desires of her listenership and has never played anything by the Arctic Monkeys. On one occasion, she was reviewing albums and said that she didn't get the Arctic Monkeys. Another day she read a request from a listener for the Arctic's latest single. Yet, I have never once heard her play a song by the AM's in spite of their popularity among fans of generic indie, which she still plays regularly.
Basically, Alison sometimes conveys that she is her audience. She continuously satisfies her own tastes, as shown by her continuous praise of each song she plays.

Firetrap

Perhaps Today FM's being a commercial station stops it from playing the sort of stuff the OP would like to hear. Even if Tom Dunne plays stuff that isn't in the Top 40, it's still not going to singe the eardrums off the casual listener and have them reaching for the dial.

I've never really listened to Alison Curtis but she's gone up in my estimation now that I know she doesn't play the overrated Arctic monkeys

_feedback_

Fareplay OP, good post. You're critising but giving reasons! Something that I haven't seen on here for a while ....

Think I know what you mean about the safe music that the 'indie' shows play. You'll notice though that Today FM have a certain kind of sound, and it is commercial radio after all. They are merely sticking to that Today FM sound while trying to be a bit different. I'm sure you'll agree that their music choice, while not extraordinarily different, is good.
They probably do play a lot of stuff that they themselves like/relate to. Believe it or not, a lot of radio DJ's/presenters (who are not playlisted) play the stuff that they think 'will sound good on the radio'. Most of them wont play something that has a 2 minute quiet period in the middle of it, or something that sounds like an air siren. The average Joe browsing the dial in their car won't stop at Today FM for the sound of an air siren, or indeed something that soundsa like dead air. They will probably stop for a bit of a catchy tune like The Decemberists - 16 Military Wives.

RE the Irish music. ? A lot of the type of bands are played more regularly than you might think, on radio stations all around the country. Have a look at the playlists on this thread for example http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055211878
The likes of the bands you mentioned are very often on Today FM, in fact Ian Dempsey regularly (once or twice a week?) has bands like you mention in studio. 20-30% of music output on any BCI licensed station, MUST be Irish. I realise that a lot of what fits in to the 'Irish' bracket isn't what you speak of (or even Irish !!!) but there is a fair amount on the radio.

Having said all that, I still haven't heard Alsion Curtis' new show... best of luck to her.

Ekels

Firetrap wrote: »

Perhaps Today FM's being a commercial station stops it from playing the sort of stuff the OP would like to hear. Even if Tom Dunne plays stuff that isn't in the Top 40, it's still not going to singe the eardrums off the casual listener and have them reaching for the dial.

I've never really listened to Alison Curtis but she's gone up in my estimation now that I know she doesn't play the overrated Arctic monkeys

I don't like them either but I was just using them as an example for my point.

Ekels

elviscostello wrote: »

Fareplay OP, good post. You're critising but giving reasons! Something that I haven't seen on here for a while ....

Think I know what you mean about the safe music that the 'indie' shows play. You'll notice though that Today FM have a certain kind of sound, and it is commercial radio after all. They are merely sticking to that Today FM sound while trying to be a bit different. I'm sure you'll agree that their music choice, while not extraordinarily different, is good.
They probably do play a lot of stuff that they themselves like/relate to. Believe it or not, a lot of radio DJ's/presenters (who are not playlisted) play the stuff that they think 'will sound good on the radio'. Most of them wont play something that has a 2 minute quiet period in the middle of it, or something that sounds like an air siren. The average Joe browsing the dial in their car won't stop at Today FM for the sound of an air siren, or indeed something that soundsa like dead air. They will probably stop for a bit of a catchy tune like The Decemberists - 16 Military Wives.

RE the Irish music. ? A lot of the type of bands are played more regularly than you might think, on radio stations all around the country. Have a look at the playlists on this thread for example http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055211878
The likes of the bands you mentioned are very often on Today FM, in fact Ian Dempsey regularly (once or twice a week?) has bands like you mention in studio. 20-30% of music output on any BCI licensed station, MUST be Irish. I realise that a lot of what fits in to the 'Irish' bracket isn't what you speak of (or even Irish !!!) but there is a fair amount on the radio.

Having said all that, I still haven't heard Alsion Curtis' new show... best of luck to her.

Thanks! I can't see the point in saying "This DJ is so ****e."


I think that I'm beginning to agree with what you're saying. Someone that I think provides a clear instance of what I'm talking about is Dan Hegarty. He really does find the perfect blend between alternative hip-hop, metal, electronica, post-rock and indie. Perfect!

dave.omeara

Well, I have to say I don't listen to Today Fm or most other stations because they tend to play all the same music. The top 10/20 of the charts (and I'll ask you when was the last time you bought a single) are mainly determined by the younger age group, what say 14 to 20 year olds (might be wrong there, don't know) so people in that age group only hear what is played in the radio and what they see on tv which is pop and all that stuff.

Irish music is really starting to take off again, Delorentos, New Amusement, Fight Like Apes, Cathy Davey, The Flaws, Future Kings of Spain, Autamata, Jape, Oppenheimer, The Minutes, The Mighty Stef, and so on. But when was the last time you heard one of there bands being played regularly on Today Fm. Yes they have to play a certain percentage of Irish music, but a few westlife/bouzone/U2 songs and thats probably the quota covered.

My suggestion for a radio station, Phantom. I've heard bands on there months before they were suddenly brand new acts on other radio stations. Either that or stick on your iPod all day.

_feedback_

dave.omeara wrote: »

Delorentos, New Amusement, Fight Like Apes, Cathy Davey, The Flaws, Future Kings of Spain, Autamata, Jape, Oppenheimer, The Minutes, The Mighty Stef, and so on. But when was the last time you heard one of there bands being played regularly on Today Fm.

Last time you heard one of there bands being played regularly?

Don't really get your question, but presume you mean to say they aren't played regularly on Today FM.

But in reality, most of them are.

paddylonglegs

Ekels wrote: »

My opinion has now changed. I've come to the conclusion that five hours of indie/alternative music per day is too much. The main reason is Dunne and Curtis' pedestrian choices. Their shows largely feature today's most bland indie guitar bands. Their is little or no desire to branch out into genres such as electronic, ambient, jazz or post-rock. It's just too easy for the pair of them to sit on their stools each night and play the same old stuff.

To say that TodayFM don't play enough alternative is a bit unfair to be honest.They are a commercial countrywide station with high paid Djs and heavy advertising clients, therefore they must conform to a slight commercial sound to keep a general audience.TodayFM don't expect a listener to be glued to their station every minute of the day because of the difference in shows (compare Matt Coopers show to Donal Dineens for example) just like newspapers don't expect a reader to read their paper from cover to cover with the different sections of business,sport,gossip,music etc.

There may be a desire by said Djs to branch out into different genres,i'm sure they would love to,but they are simply tied down to some conformity.Tom Dunne has had his show for god knows how many years suggesting he is doing the job right.OP for a fix of some different sounds I would suggest RnaG from 11pm midweek,Phantom fm in general,Annalivia and Lyric fm at weekends night time for jazz and funk, Donal Dinneen on Today fm,Dan Hegerty, and Cormac Battle on Sunday nights 2fm to bring you back to reality.

Internet stations can be good but a bit impersonal,its comforting to hear the irish accent inbetween tunes to tell you about the song or give info on the artist/where they're playing.

Ekels

paddylonglegs wrote: »

To say that TodayFM don't play enough alternative is a bit unfair to be honest.They are a commercial countrywide station with high paid Djs and heavy advertising clients, therefore they must conform to a slight commercial sound to keep a general audience.TodayFM don't expect a listener to be glued to their station every minute of the day because of the difference in shows (compare Matt Coopers show to Donal Dineens for example) just like newspapers don't expect a reader to read their paper from cover to cover with the different sections of business,sport,gossip,music etc.

There may be a desire by said Djs to branch out into different genres,i'm sure they would love to,but they are simply tied down to some conformity.Tom Dunne has had his show for god knows how many years suggesting he is doing the job right.OP for a fix of some different sounds I would suggest RnaG from 11pm midweek,Phantom fm in general,Annalivia and Lyric fm at weekends night time for jazz and funk, Donal Dinneen on Today fm,Dan Hegerty, and Cormac Battle on Sunday nights 2fm to bring you back to reality.

Internet stations can be good but a bit impersonal,its comforting to hear the irish accent inbetween tunes to tell you about the song or give info on the artist/where they're playing.

Read my post again and see if you can get it right the next time.

ifconfig

Ekels wrote: »

My opinion has now changed. I've come to the conclusion that five hours of indie/alternative music per day is too much. The main reason is Dunne and Curtis' pedestrian choices. Their shows largely feature today's most bland indie guitar bands. Their is little or no desire to branch out into genres such as electronic, ambient, jazz or post-rock. It's just too easy for the pair of them to sit on their stools each night and play the same old stuff.

I agree wholeheartedly with what you've said above. I guess Donal Dineen's late night spot to an extent addresses the electronic/ambient/post-rock side of things.

I think Tom Dunne, while a very nice guy, is too much in danger of being complacent in his comfort zone of playing the jingly-jangly guitar bland/bands. As has been commented elsewhere on this forum I think Tom Dunne excels more when he is out of his usual comfort zone, eg when presenting other folks shows. His laid back style can be slightly infectious although his accent irritates me (but that's besides the point here and not noinety-noin purr-cent relevant.. if you know what I mean .. )

--Ian

Over&Over

Check out An Taobh Tuathail, RnaG
http://www.rte.ie/rnag/antaobhtuathail.html

Small Hours on Today FM
http://www.todayfm.com/sectional.asp?id=905

paddylonglegs

Ekels wrote: »

Read my post again and see if you can get it right the next time.

Ah come on Ekels,I wasn't having a go at you,I was just making the point that not all radio persenters are allowed to step outside the box due to circumstances out of their hands.When Alison Curtis was pitching for her show,she would have had to give her boss an idea of what she would be playing,he then relays it on to everyone else involved,and then gets the green light.Thats the way a commercial nationwide station have to run,I understand that the five hour slot could probably be split up a bit better as Dunnnes and Curtis' show can run into each other a bit,I agree,unfortunately they can't please everyone.

Ekels

This makes for horrible reading: http://www.todayfm.com/Article.asp?id=777090.
It's a horribly watered-down version of her old Sunday night show. Some stuff like The Feeling, Eminem and the Scissor Sisters creeping in there. It started with mostly guitar stuff, but now it lacks cohesion with crappy, cheesy pop and very good alternative stuff like Feist and Radiohead. It's clearly been enforced upon Alison to play this sort of stuff, I'd doubt it's her own decision to play Eminem so often, I could be wrong though.
Either way, it's a little silly.

DM-BM

Over&Over wrote: »

Check out An Taobh Tuathail, RnaG
http://www.rte.ie/rnag/antaobhtuathail.html

Small Hours on Today FM
http://www.todayfm.com/sectional.asp?id=905

The best two shows on Irish radio

Ekels

Yeah, an Taobh Tuathail is quality.

lostinsuperfunk

Yeah, an Taobh Tuathail is quality.

+1

It is occasionally surprising, occasionally irritating, but most of the time it's great. For me, that's the mark of a good programme, it's always pushing things a bit. Tom Dunne sticks to the script far too much, although I would agree that he can be very good when he is forced to do something different, like daytime radio. I like his laidback style and even his musical taste improves once he escapes from his little jingly jangly indie ghetto. longlegs is probably right though, most presenters probably aren't given carte blanche when it comes to music selection.

During the daytime, the pirates are the only way to go! I'd prefer to listen to continuous boy racer happy trance than to Gerry Ryan stuffing his gob with cake while reading the newspaper aloud or to d'Arsey's inane banter and constant moralising.