No well off people in Irish Films

Blisterman

Have you ever noticed, that the main characters in Irish movies are never well off professionals?
It's a bit strange, considering Ireland's now one of the richest countries in the world, and probably has a higher percentage of well off people than most other countries.
It seems Irish filmmakers love to make films about the underdogs. If you look at the most popular Irish movies set in the past 20 years...

The Commitments
Intermission
The Snapper
The General
In America
Once
The Van
Garage

All seem to have working class protagonists. The only movie I remember, which wasn't like this was About Adam, which wasn't very good, but at least it showed a different side of Ireland, poor downtrodden people, trying to make it in a tough world. It really shows a lack of imagination on the film makers part IMO.
What do you think?

Jessieannas

You're right there. Never really thought about it. It seems that the famine all those years ago gave people that idea. But famines happen to everyone! Only ours was a Great Famine. So if we're not well off we're leprachauns..

EDIT// Also, people connect Ireland with alchol problems. Not all of us you know!

Pride Fighter

Thats because professionals are not funny. People say 'oh the commitments is funny because of the cursing and inner city acting'. Who wants to hear 'lets get the dort to Lansdowne and loike watch Leinster play'.

vorbis

Ah well in fairness, I can understand the alcohol problems one!!!
Just because its a stereotype doesn't mean it isn't true.

The poor irish underdog is an easy sell. People almost expect it at this stage. About Adam as Blisterman said is the way forward. A conventional movie that just happens to be set in Ireland.

Pigman II

Goldfish Memory

ntlbell

D4/kiliney boat shoe wearing muppets are not very interesting and unfunny...

Guy:Incognito

The Van/Snapper/Commitmnets were from pre celtic tiger Ireland where there was mostly poor Irish people (relativly).

The General was fairly set in stone character wise from the outset. If they had Martin Cahill as a suit wearing city banker living in the IFSC it wouldnt really have been about him would it?

Jack B. Badd

It might be the films you're looking at. Most of the ones on your list are set before the peak of the Tiger. Things have change significantly in the past decade or so.

Sad Professor

In the case of Once the filmmakers very consciously chose to depict a version of Ireland where there was no economic boom. Glen Hansard thinks pre-Celtic Tiger Ireland is more romantic and interesting. And tbh he's probably right; from a filmmaking perspective modern Ireland and it's middle class is pretty boring. No one wants to see a movie about Ross O'Carroll-Kelly.

Blisterman

Well, I'm not specifically talking about D4/Ross O Carroll Kelly wannabes.
That's only a small minority.

Although, that's another thread, why is it, when someone hears of someone being well of in Ireland, ROCK is the first thing to come to mind?

Sad Professor

Well, I'm not specifically talking about D4/Ross O Carroll Kelly wannabes.

Neither was I, it was just an example.

Filmmakers have always cherry picked what parts of a city/country/culture to depict and what not to. Mostly they're drawn to the more romantic and unique aspects. As already said Ireland's professional class is pretty boring, there's nothing special about it.

Irish people have a difficult attitude towards success anyway. Culturally we probably feel safer seeing ourselves as the poor underdogs.

Ay Cee

Would it have anything to do with the economic situation the writer was in when he wrote it? Easier to write about what you know than what you don't know. Just a guess mind you

Predhead

ntlbell wrote: »

D4/kiliney boat shoe wearing muppets are not very interesting and unfunny...

Totally agree. A show or movie 'loike' that would be painfully unfunny.

The working class Irish thing in films works because of that sense of humour, and because the writer is from a similar background and is able to convey it perfectly.

Dont be at yourself

D4 isn't really Ireland.

Parrish_Crooks

You forgot Angela's Ashes!

EDIT And Adam & Paul! The list goes on!

deisebabe

ahha! heres one about a successful property developer...haven't seen it...cos i mean whos really interested in successful irish people.... http://www.phase9.tv/movies/tigerstail.shtml

inner city dubs are much more amusing and live a lot more "real life" than the middle class irish as all the middle class do is work/gym/whatever. and the kids all play their computer games rather than go out and play with their friends....i mean how boring are we really?!

Duggy747

deisebabe wrote: »

ahha! heres one about a successful property developer...haven't seen it...cos i mean whos really interested in successful irish people.... http://www.phase9.tv/movies/tigerstail.shtml

Yea, Tiger's Tail got shìtty reviews alright.

OP, ya got a good point. Never really thought about it, really. Honestly, I'm sick to death of 97% of Irish movies based in "Dooblin"! Is that really the only place in the country where "gritty, realistic, or off-the-wall" stories can be told? How about some bloody variety!

Same goes for Irish TV dramas, all set in Dooblin. Unlike the Irish films they seem to lean more on the Celtic Tiger side, focusing on the socialites of modern Ireland. They tend to be utter bollox and quickly vanish without a trace, thankfully!

Galvasean

Duggy747 wrote: »

Yea, Tiger's Tail got shìtty reviews alright.

Odd, while not great its better than most films to come out of Ireland.
Guess we only like scumbags.

film_gonzo

"It's something that crops up alot in Irish short films - the trial of the 'poor' working class person (often a child) in modern Ireland.

I think it's just cause we're guilty of the wealth we've had over the last 10-15years. Before we had sex and religion to be guilty about but now that the Church's stranglehold has loosened we gottafind another hangup to feel guilty about something. Enter wealth.

The idea that the working class are funnier or more interesting than the middle class is also bogus. Every section of society has interesting aspects, there just hasn't been any writer willing to look for them in modern Ireland instead going for the obvious 'weath has corrupted us and our morals, we have no time for our neighbour, no community, it's all drugs and booze etc, etc' writing that plagues our tv drama.

Also, have no doubt but that the people who write these stories of the working class are middle class people looking down at what they feel are lesser people. Ho wcan you write a story about something you're not really in the thick of without glamourising it or portraying it as something it's not.

No, Irish Film needs to cop on and wake itself to it's society's modern incarnation and stop feeling guilty for itself.

That's not to say that films about the poorer sections of society shouldn't be made but they shouldn't outweight every other kind of genre of film (and it is like we have made a genre of the 'We're poor but begorrah we're happy' film) I take into account that many of the OP's film suggestions were made before the 'boom' but in the last 15 years you'd think we could have produced something like a good film about the largest population demographic- middle class Ireland. And I'm not talking about D4 or Ross O'Carroll Kelly types, hells I'm not even talking about Dublin. I'm not a Dub and I'm bloody sick of hearing the Dublin accent in almost EVERY film I've seen, even plenty that aren't set in Dublin. In that respect 'Garage' was a very welcome break.

I would really hope that we lose these hangups and start making world class cinema that has less to do with the grim, miserable side of the Irish psyche and more about ideas and what it is to be a modern Irish person.

Parrish_Crooks

Duggy747 wrote: »

Yea, Tiger's Tail got shìtty reviews alright.

OP, ya got a good point. Never really thought about it, really. Honestly, I'm sick to death of 97% of Irish movies based in "Dooblin"! Is that really the only place in the country where "gritty, realistic, or off-the-wall" stories can be told? How about some bloody variety!

+1. I can think of a couple of places on the North side of Cork that would make some of these gritty tales of a heroin infested Dooooblin look like Beverly Hills!

:pac:

Galvasean

Why go to Cork when i can rent a camera from FilmBase and tape the freakshow people of Temple Bar

Nolanger

Tara Road.

rizzla

Boy Eats Girl, they where fairly well off, boarding school an all IIRC.

Parrish_Crooks

Galvasean wrote: »

Why go to Cork when i can rent a camera from FilmBase and tape the freakshow people of Temple Bar

Haha, lots of black clothes and dog collars yes??

phasers

Parrish_Crooks wrote: »

Haha, lots of black clothes and dog collars yes??

nah man the collars are out, it's all about tutus and black circles around the eyes :pac:

tIS hImSelF

What about The Tigers Tail (released last year with Brendon Gleeson and that tramp from Sex in the City). It trys to deal with 'Rich' & 'Modern' Ireland that is the Celtic Tiger, with wealthy buisness men, awards and corruption! The story got boring half way through it so I reckon thats why they don't make films about our rich elite

You should check out films that are set in the middle of the celtic bom (but don't deal with it directly) Such as 'The Trouble with Sex', 'Inside I'm Dancing', 'About Adam' & 'Starfish'

Check out 'Capital Letters' if you want to see a film about the exploitation of illegal immigrants in modern Ireland.

Parrish_Crooks

phasers wrote: »

nah man the collars are out, it's all about tutus and black circles around the eyes :pac:

Stripey tights... trench coats... them boots with the metal attached around the heel with flame designs on them.... black nail varnish etc?

We have the same problem in Cork! :rolleyes::pac:

Jack B. Badd

Parrish_Crooks wrote: »

Stripey tights... trench coats... them boots with the metal attached around the heel with flame designs on them.... black nail varnish etc?

We have the same problem in Cork! :rolleyes::pac:

Mini-goths! \o/

Rented Mule

Pigman II wrote: »

Goldfish Memory

Pigman shoots ....he SCORES !!

Tchaikovsky

Disco Pigs? They're not really underdogs (no pun intended), they're just strange outsiders.
Fantastic film by the way.

Nolanger

Are you taking the p**s?
Disco Pigs was total rubbish - stupid movie that consists of the two leads entering bars/clubs and starting fights.
In one scene they even beat up a real-life killer.

Sgt Hartman

Nolanger wrote: »

Are you taking the p**s?
Disco Pigs was total rubbish - stupid movie that consists of the two leads entering bars/clubs and starting fights.
In one scene they even beat up a real-life killer.

That's right, I read in the Indo today that Darren Healy got 3 years after he beat up a person in a bar, who then later died of a blood clot in his brain. There's a pic of him outside the court sticking his two fingers up at the media a-la Limerick thug Liam Keane.
I actually have a low-budget Irish film in my collection called "Crushproof" with Healy in the leading role, about a complete skanger who gets released from the Joy (not before beating the crap out of someone in the showers), and immediately gets in trouble with the police. He and his gang spend the majority of the film being pursued by the Gards led by a detective played by Michael McElhatton (Rats from Spin the Bottle/Paths to freedom).
How life imitatates art huh??

Oh, and yes, Disco Pigs WAS a loada scheisser. Cillian Murphy's character was a f**king freak.

asdasd

Totally agree. A show or movie 'loike' that would be painfully unfunny.

The problem with Ireland is that most films made here are expected to be about Ireland. US movies can be about what they are about, a comedy, a mystery, a rom com etc.

So if you set when Harry Met Sally here it wouldnt go well with the American crowd, or anyone else, who want to see "real" Ireland ( whatever that means), and the elephant in the room is this: the Irish middle classes live a life indistinguishable in most respects from America and Britain, so why not set the movie there?

constitutionus

Blisterman wrote: »

Have you ever noticed, that the main characters in Irish movies are never well off professionals?
It's a bit strange, considering Ireland's now one of the richest countries in the world, and probably has a higher percentage of well off people than most other countries.
It seems Irish filmmakers love to make films about the underdogs. If you look at the most popular Irish movies set in the past 20 years...

The Commitments
Intermission
The Snapper
The General
In America
Once
The Van
Garage

All seem to have working class protagonists. The only movie I remember, which wasn't like this was About Adam, which wasn't very good, but at least it showed a different side of Ireland, poor downtrodden people, trying to make it in a tough world. It really shows a lack of imagination on the film makers part IMO.
What do you think?

ever notice most of the people that write, direct , and act in those things tend to be ****ing loaded too?

i think its class guilt. TBH would you want to see a film based around the "posh" set in ireland.

id rather gouge my eyes out than watch a film based on the barrister set and their tribulations in trying to obtain the bar. or some IT engineer hanging out in ron blacks talkin to people from the IFSC. even the attempts at TV on the subject tend to be deathy dull affairs (the clinic et al)

To be brutally honest theres no heroes there. in the main most people want to punch the seriously rich guys cause there so fcuking annoying. and its hard to feel sorry for someone when mostly their biggest problem is which villa theyre going to stay in on holidays that year.

could be a good film about financial fraud in the waiting though ! look at the tribunals. THAT would be the establishment set. though you'd have to take liberties at the end.

you know , actually jailing people instead of the reality where they just get a state pension

brianthebard

Blisterman wrote: »

Well, I'm not specifically talking about D4/Ross O Carroll Kelly wannabes.
That's only a small minority.

Although, that's another thread, why is it, when someone hears of someone being well of in Ireland, ROCK is the first thing to come to mind?

Films/stories/plays/etc generally involve conflict, and the main character needs a certain amount of empathy from the audience. A middle class businessman/woman who develops a coke habit and generally splashes the cash around isn't empathetic, and the middle class life is generally devoid of any meaningful conflict. Hence not written about as much. (or less powerful at any rate)

Edit: although there was that P.S. I love you last year.

Nolanger

What do great directors such as Bunuel/Altman/Fellini/Antononi/Renoir do?
They make films that take the pi*s out of middle-class society.
As we don't (and probably never will) have an Irish director of that calibre there is no point in attempting to make good movies about the middle-classes here.

Shacklebolt

A good film dealing with modern Ireland is long overdue. Every film about Ireland that you see is either set in a backward 1950s countryside or a 1980s era Dublin slum. There is plenty of good material there for a film set in middle-class Dublin or rural Ireland during the past ten years.

Blisterman

brianthebard wrote: »

Films/stories/plays/etc generally involve conflict, and the main character needs a certain amount of empathy from the audience. A middle class businessman/woman who develops a coke habit and generally splashes the cash around isn't empathetic, and the middle class life is generally devoid of any meaningful conflict. Hence not written about as much. (or less powerful at any rate)

Edit: although there was that P.S. I love you last year.

I don't know what you're talking about.

There are literally hundreds of great movies, where the protaganist is from a well off background, and yet you can still empathise with them.
Just because you have money doesn't mean your life is trouble free.