Anyone watching Manuel Barroso on the TV?

mike65

As I suspected - he is basicly telling Europe that the vote should be respected and then ignored.

Mike.

Mr.Nice Guy

Yes typical fascist line from Barroso. Utter disgrace.

Zube

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Yes typical fascist line from Barroso. Utter disgrace.

I hope you like being a second-class citizen of Europe, it's what you voted for.

VoidStarNull

What is he saying? (For those who can't watch TV in work )

SkepticOne

VoidStarNull wrote: »

What is he saying? (For those who can't watch TV in work )

I only caught the end of it but he is basically saying that the remaining countries should proceed with ratification despite the Irish result. The logical implication of this is that the Irish will be asked again to vote on the issue and this time hopefully get it right.

He also wants to hear Cowan's explanation of what went wrong.

Cannibal Ox

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Yes typical fascist line from Barroso. Utter disgrace.

:rolleyes:
Enjoy trolling much?

I think it was rushed, they haven't a clue what they're going to do so they sent him out with a vague statement that could be interpreted either way. What else could they do.

Mr.Nice Guy

Zube wrote: »

I hope you like being a second-class citizen of Europe, it's what you voted for.

No I voted to be a citizen of Ireland and not one day, a European Superstate.

Cannibal Ox wrote:

:rolleyes:

Enjoy trolling much?

Bitter much? :cool:

Amazotheamazing

"Fascist", how so?

dilallio

Copied from http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0613/eulisbonreax.html
European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso has urged other EU states to continue ratifying the Lisbon Treaty despite an apparent resounding No vote.
He said the No vote in Ireland has not solved the problems that the Lisbon Treaty is designed to solve.
Mr Barosso said that the European Commission believes that the remaining ratifications should continue to take their course.
He called on Taoiseach Brian Cowen to present ideas to address the concerns of No voters at an EU summit in Brussels starting next Thursday.
He said that was the place for EU leaders to take 'joint decisions' on the way forward.
He added that it is not the first time that there has been a treaty rejected in Europe.

Mr.Nice Guy

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

"Fascist", how so?

"We respect the vote but it doesn't mean anything" is what their position is.

bill_ashmount

No way Jose

murphaph

I watched him there. What bloody arrogance! When France and the Netherlands said NO the proces STOPPED! THIS TENDENCY TOWARDS SELECTIVE DEMOCRACY IS WHY I VOTED NO!!! The ordinary people of Europe will start asking serious questions if they proceed with ratification. It is obviously NOT a club of equals, if it ever was. I used to be very pro-Europe and pro-EEC/EC/EU......now I'm just pro-Europe. I hope my European neighbours sitting in their living rooms watching the news tonight feel similar outrage at Manuel's words.

Mr.Nice Guy

murphaph wrote: »

I watched him there. What bloody arrogance! When France and the Netherlands said NO the proces STOPPED! THIS TENDENCY TOWARDS SELECTIVE DEMOCRACY IS WHY I VOTED NO!!! The ordinary people of Europe will start asking serious questions if they proceed with ratification. It is obviously NOT a club of equals, if it ever was. I used to be very pro-Europe and pro-EEC/EC/EU......now I'm just pro-Europe. I hope my European neighbours sitting in their living rooms watching the news tonight feel similar outrage at Manuel's words.

Yep Sky News have been pointing out how they are going back on their earlier words. Completely undemocratic.

Here is what French Prime Minister Francois Fillon, said yesterday:

"If the Irish people decide to reject the treaty of Lisbon, naturally, there will be no treaty of Lisbon."

What a difference a day makes eh? You can't trust these guys one bit.

CtrlSource

murphaph wrote: »

I watched him there. What bloody arrogance! When France and the Netherlands said NO the proces STOPPED! THIS TENDENCY TOWARDS SELECTIVE DEMOCRACY IS WHY I VOTED NO!!! The ordinary people of Europe will start asking serious questions if they proceed with ratification. It is obviously NOT a club of equals, if it ever was. I used to be very pro-Europe and pro-EEC/EC/EU......now I'm just pro-Europe. I hope my European neighbours sitting in their living rooms watching the news tonight feel similar outrage at Manuel's words.

Well said

ircoha

What was interesting about that piece of VTR was that we, the people of Ireland, knew, 2nd hand what our leader was thinking.
Biffo should have addressed the nation BEFORE discussing the matter with his EU masters:mad:

Just shows they have learned nothing.

On TV this aternoon the only Minister who showed any connect with the people was E Ryan.
Roche/Lenihan/Hanifinn all still the same political elite.

thecoolfreak

murphaph wrote: »

I watched him there. What bloody arrogance! When France and the Netherlands said NO the proces STOPPED! THIS TENDENCY TOWARDS SELECTIVE DEMOCRACY IS WHY I VOTED NO!!! The ordinary people of Europe will start asking serious questions if they proceed with ratification. It is obviously NOT a club of equals, if it ever was. I used to be very pro-Europe and pro-EEC/EC/EU......now I'm just pro-Europe. I hope my European neighbours sitting in their living rooms watching the news tonight feel similar outrage at Manuel's words.

France and Netherlands have a combined population of nearly 80 million and we have about 5 million. Added to this France is one of the fonding members. Of course the process will stop when they say no. In the overall scheme of things we are pretty insignificant and the EU

DarkJager

Anybody hear Lenihan on the Last word earlier this afternoon? Talk about sounding like an arrogant prick

Rb

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

What a difference a day makes eh? You can't trust these guys one bit.

Fully agree. Not at all trustworthy.

Also, just had a chuckle at Sky News interrupting someone speaking to go to Brian Cowen, then going "Oops, he's speaking in Irish" and back to the first guy.

Edit again: He's not impressed.

Sherifu

VoidStarNull wrote: »

What is he saying? (For those who can't watch TV in work )

He said, "Get a new job"

parsi

ircoha wrote: »

On TV this aternoon the only Minister who showed any connect with the people was E Ryan..

Hmm. He's probably happy because Europe won't be able to block the Green's lightbulb ban.

I do believe that the other countries should continue with the ratification process. If someone else's parliament votes to reject it then there may be more impetus for change.

On the News at One the interviewer mentioned to Mary-Lou that SF had done a very good job of articulating the views of the English eurosceptics - the Murdoch media and the Red Tops - cue much spluttering from Mary-Lou...

K-9

As commented on by Sean Whelan, It doesn't matter what he says.

He's the President of the Commission.

Makes me wonder why the Commission was an issue!

claudiog

thecoolfreak wrote: »

France and Netherlands have a combined population of nearly 80 million and we have about 5 million. Added to this France is one of the fonding members. Of course the process will stop when they say no. In the overall scheme of things we are pretty insignificant and the EU

Is this the measure of your dignity?

axer

Was just watching news on RTL here in Germany and Merkel was saying the Irish Vote should be respected.

KnifeWRENCH

I saw Barroso speaking earlier. He seemed rather bemused - he was probably expecting a resounding YES and probably had a big "Let's celebrate the United States of Europe" speech prepared.
I think what he said was fair enough: the other nations still have the right to ratify the Treaty and their Government's will expect that right to still be given to them.
He said that he respects Ireland's decision and recognises that we still very much want to be part of the EU: whether or not he actually believes that, I don't know.
His speech was an exercise of damage limitation: he delibarately tried to respect both the Irish right to vote NO and the other nations' right to vote however they want.

murphaph

axer wrote: »

Was just watching news on RTL here in Germany and Merkel was saying the Irish Vote should be respected.

Given Germany's 'troubled' past they pretty much have to say that. I like Merkel but her partner in crime Mr. Sarkozy is slippery as an eel.

claudiog

Italian president Napolitano said that Ireland now should leave the EU.

(Don't be worried, he need to move air into the mouth :pac:, in Italy who really count are labour unions)

Iwasfrozen

lol, I really don't see the problem here, if 26 countries vote yes then why should the stupid working class people of Ireland who voted (witch comes in at around 75,000) hold back the vote of almost 500,000,000 bring it on José, if the people of Ireland are to stupid to yes then why should 26 countries who voted yes be given the finger ?
That not democracy.

is_that_so

All that happened is that the people spoke and our ratification didn't happen. Common sense approach by him, imo. There are a further 7 to address, so it is best to get them out of the way and then address the problem. That is how Europe tends to work and as has been posted Lisbon has taken 7 years and I can understand why they are not just going to call a halt to the ratification process.
I am also a bit puzzled by those who were on the No side being upset because they couldn't bring Europe to a halt.

kerry4sam

is_that_so wrote: »

...
I am also a bit puzzled by those who were on the No side being upset because they couldn't bring Europe to a halt.

+1 to put it mildly

mike65

The Czech PM has said he regards the Treaty as dead.

Mike.

axer

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

then why should 26 countries who voted yes be given the finger ?

because it has to be ratified by all 27 countries or it is no good.

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

That not democracy.

Unfotunately there seems to be varying opinions as to what democracy is or is not. I would think that not letting the citizens of europe decide whether to accept the treaty or to let them decide and then go against their decision is undemocratic.

is_that_so wrote: »

All that happened is that the people spoke and our ratification didn't happen. Common sense approach by him, imo. There are a further 7 to address, so it is best to get them out of the way and then address the problem. That is how Europe tends to work and as has been posted Lisbon has taken 7 years and I can understand why they are not just going to call a halt to the ratification process.
I am also a bit puzzled by those who were on the No side being upset because they couldn't bring Europe to a halt.

It is a waste anyone else ratifying since one cannot. It is just trying to make Ireland look bad i.e. to be able to say 26 have ratified except Ireland.

I am a bit puzzled by those that think Lisbon is still alive.

Pride Fighter

Maybe Barosso is a facist but a better word and more factual one would be to call him an oligarch. I hope the British parliament votes against it, give Brown more hassle. If its passed in Britain I wonder if the Lords can block it?

is_that_so

axer wrote: »

because it has to be ratified by all 27 countries or it is no good.
Unfotunately there seems to be varying opinions as to what democracy is or is not. I would think that not letting the citizens of europe decide whether to accept the treaty or to let them decide and then go against their decision is undemocratic.

It is a waste anyone else ratifying since one cannot. It is just trying to make Ireland look bad i.e. to be able to say 26 have ratified except Ireland.

I am a bit puzzled by those that think Lisbon is still alive.

Not at all what I was talking about. If there is any "looking bad" it has been brought about by the people themselves.
IMO This is how Europe tends to work, lumbering from one crisis to another and fixing things at the 11th hour. Their view is that a way has to be found to "fix" it.

KnifeWRENCH

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

lol, I really don't see the problem here, if 26 countries vote yes then why should the stupid working class people of Ireland who voted (witch comes in at around 75,000) hold back the vote of almost 500,000,000 bring it on José, if the people of Ireland are to stupid to yes then why should 26 countries who voted yes be given the finger ?
That not democracy.

*yawn

Do you think it would be democratic if the Treaty was passed despite Ireland's rejection? Perhaps it would be if the Treaty didn't clearly state that ALL 27 states MUST ratify it.It makes no difference if the other countries continue ratification or not - even if it ends up 26 to 1, Lisbon is still dead.

murphaph

Pride Fighter wrote: »

Maybe Barosso is a facist but a better word and more factual one would be to call him an oligarch. I hope the British parliament votes against it, give Brown more hassle. If its passed in Britain I wonder if the Lords can block it?

I think they can because (IIRC) the Parliament Act (remember the foxhunting saga) can only be invoked by the House of Commons if the issue is in the National Interest and I think it has to have been included in the government's manifesto/programme for government (ie, have been passed by the people at general election time) for that to be the case (or something like that). I may have this backwards!