Are scuba courses a rip-off?

de breeze

This weekend I paid €280 for a 2 day, 3 dive course, non residential in the west for a teenage son. I thought this was on the high side as these were shore dives.

He was asking about Glenans for sailing and I did a quick comparison that shows the average cost of a 7 day teenage course is €90 per day which is full board and obviously includes equipment and instruction.

Does this suggest that at least some of the scuba courses on offer are to say the least a bit of a rip-off?

I'd be interested in getting any views out there on this

seadeuce

I assume it was an Open Water course, probably in Killary.

That price is reasonable, as some others charge up to €450

Shore diving would be the perfect way for a trainee diver to be introduced to the underwater world. Get some skillset right before venturing to depth from a boat.

No, I believe you got value for money.

And I did NOT come through this commercial route myself, as I'm CFT trained. So no bias here.


BTW he'll be a trainee for about three seasons, assuming he continues with scuba. No matter what C-Cards he gets. So he can take things slowly and easy.

He will agree with this summation when he reaches his fourth season.


Cheers,


Seadeuce

Borzoi

de breeze wrote: »

Does this suggest that at least some of the scuba courses on offer are to say the least a bit of a rip-off?

To reverse answer the question, nobody I know is making any big money in teaching scuba. Most do it for the combination of the love of the hobby and the nice lifestyle.

I'd agree that scuba is expensive, but then it has a lot of overheads, like gear, insurance etc

Scuba.ie

A 2 day 3 dive course was probably the Adventure Diver course? The price sounds about right as per advertised in different DCs.
The pricing is all about covering the costs of the Instructor including diesel, insurance, tank fills, manuals, certification envalopes (not cheap) etc. Also, he/she will need to make a small profit, otherwise why do it?

de breeze

Scuba.ie wrote: »

A 2 day 3 dive course was probably the Adventure Diver course? The price sounds about right as per advertised in different DCs.
The pricing is all about covering the costs of the Instructor including diesel, insurance, tank fills, manuals, certification envalopes (not cheap) etc. Also, he/she will need to make a small profit, otherwise why do it?

I think the two posters are missing the point here. You have two roughly parallel activities being offered one sailing the other diving. Yet the one providing FULL BOARD AND LODGING is CHEAPER by a considerable margin (€90 vs 140) on per day basis. Both activities need to support the overheads mentioned by Scuba.ie so that's hardly adequate as an explanation is it? I can't help feeling we're being taken to the cleaners quite frankly

yankinlk

Apples to oranges I think.
Ive been on both types of courses and sailing was way cheaper - I didnt feel ripped off by the scuba.

There were way more volunteers on the sailing course (unpaid) in my experience. How about the course you are talking about?

And to be honest, the amount of safety that's involved in Scuba versus Sailing measn id hope i was getting the best paid/qualified instructors to teach me or my son. you arent at risk as much in a dinghy thats for sure.

de breeze

Is there a suggestion here that a voluntary approach somehow compromises safety? Firstly Glenans, where I learnt to sail has never had a fatality in over 50 years of operations. This is exceptional considering the numbers that have gone through.

Regarding scuba, I started out as a club diver and got the basic training delivered by 'volunteers' and it cost hardly anything. Safety standards were very high - in fact safety was almost an obsession.

It's very wrong to associate safety with 'professionals' who have a vested interest in creating a mystique around scuba. As far as I can see the selling point for PADI is it's acceptance internationally but I have to insist the customer is paying very heavily to support this.

seadeuce

That's why PADI stands for Put Another Dollar In!


Best way to get value is to do their Open Water course, then join a CFT club. The commercial course will allow you to decide whether or not the sport appeals to you, without the added expense of gear purchase etc.

Then, if you still want to commit yourself, club membership can give you ongoing training through the volunteer route. Very well-trained volunteers I may add, with diving experience behind them.
Commercial route instructors can, at times, hold a qualification that has been achieved through the fast-lane approach. Okay for the classroom and the pool, but inadequate IMO for our open water conditions.

You makes your choice ...


Seadeuce

de breeze

Thanks Seadeuce, after doing the PADI open water I went down to CFT office to enquire about getting into a club as my former club seemed to have vanished with passage of years. They didn't seem at all impressed with my 'qualification' and while not exactly shown the door, was not welcomed with open arms either.

So how would I go about joining a club? I am now AOW with about 20 dives since getting back into scuba after a gap of only 20 years

seadeuce

Check

http://www.cft.ie

for a club near you.
Then contact their Diving Officer to ask about doing a crossover. You will be starting in the club as a Trainee Diver and working (diving) your way up to Club Diver.

Most clubs nowadays have PADI crossovers, and the old prejudicial attitude has mostly (thankfully) disappeared.

I'd be very surprised if you don't get a welcome.

Just in case you DO meet someone who has gotten out of the wrong side of bed that morning, remember, there's another club just down the road.
Check the map on that site above.

20 years? You have a lot of missed fishy friends just a-waitin' to get re-aquainted!!


Cheers


Seadeuce

scubaloops

Hi De Breeze,

I actually work in c.f.t. and im very sorry if you did not feel welcome, I'm not sure who you were talking to but we would be delighted to find you a suitable club. Perhaps you could call us on 2844601 and ask for Louise.

Sorry again, perhaps you caught one of us on a rare off day.

Hope to talk soon

Louise

de breeze

Thanks a million to seadeuce and particularly scubaloops (Louise) for pointing me in the right direction. Will get onto CFT office as advised. Should point out that it's 3 years since I was wrongfooted by CFT so things have likely changed in the meantime or I may have just caught someone on a bad day!

Thanks again

Einstein

seadeuce wrote: »

That's why PADI stands for Put Another Dollar In!

wow.
original.

Scuba G

Ah, agency bashing, a popular activity practiced by idiots who havent got a shred of knowledge on the subject matter. Comparing sailing and scuba is very different, although both activities are taken place in the environment of water, one is on top and the other below, this is where life as we know it is under different rules. Teaching sailing (I dojnt know much of the sailing thing, but have knowledge of boatmanship in regards to diving) is not in the same realm as scuba instruction, the student is in an environment where they are on life support and therefore the instructor has a massive responcibility. In respnce to the post of instructors fast tracking, yes they can be sh*te but so can club instructors and divers, saying that a student is a trainee until season four, sounds like they are compared to a bloody tree! The problem with diving in Ireland is politics, if its PADI its deemed a rip off (but the money/time we have put in over the years training to become instructors and to upkeep courses ourselves, insurances and equipment maintenance is what makes it slightly more expensive) and clubs the better route (clubs get grants and support from the government, but membership is €500 a year, and then you normally get your own gear and pay for reduced boat useage) then thats a bad opinion, the only bad instructors or divers are the ones that have not been trained correctly, regardless of agency. Getting back to the point of the kids course being a rip off, having your child under safe and competant instruction is money well spent IMO. Also sailing is subsidised and normally sailing clubs are fairly wealthy....Rant over!:p

Scuba G

seadeuce wrote: »

That's why PADI stands for Put Another Dollar In!


Best way to get value is to do their Open Water course, then join a CFT club. The commercial course will allow you to decide whether or not the sport appeals to you, without the added expense of gear purchase etc.

What about club membership and fee's? I looked into joining a club to get mid week boat trips and its €500 a year and 10 quid a trip, do the maths!

Then, if you still want to commit yourself, club membership can give you ongoing training through the volunteer route. Very well-trained volunteers I may add, with diving experience behind them.
Commercial route instructors can, at times, hold a qualification that has been achieved through the fast-lane approach. Okay for the classroom and the pool, but inadequate IMO for our open water conditions.

You makes your choice ...


Seadeuce

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