2 Letters from An post seeking TV licence fee etc

niceirishfella

Hi,

We are only in our new house for a couple of months and my wife and I got a letter each the other day stating they see no record of our address having a TV licence - blah -blah- blah-.
They have enclosed a STATUTORY DECLARATION FORM and want it filled out and returned to them within 21 days etc.
They say that failure to return this form could result in prosection? Is this true?

They then go in bold type outlining the fines - €634.87 for 1st offence and then 1269.74 for a second!

Where does the law stand on all of this statutory forms stuff?


i'm curious - and interersted to know.

Thanks,
NIF

drunkmonkey

Not sure of the legal status of the forum....

What i've found works well is ignore all unsoliciated post and don't answer the door to strangers and post men who want you to sign for a letter...
Not sure on the legal status of this method either, I just know it works....

niceirishfella

Agreed Drunkmonkey........I dont answer the door to anyone too - usually just religious muppets or the like.
These letters came unregistered - no sig was requested - so they cant prove we got the forms/letters...........tho' they did deliver the letter themselves as they are anpost and they are they collector of the licence fee etc.

drunkmonkey

The Postman has absolutley nothing got to to do with your TV licence, he only pops the letter in your mail box the same as your esb bill....he is not questioned by higher powers....

It might be worth throwing the letter in your local post box and writing "house vacant" on it....that might throw them off

kizzyf

Usually they only chase you up after they've called to the house and you have to give them your names. Are you living in a new housing development? In these circumstances once they've found out that one person in the Estate hasn't got a licence or one of the owners transfers their existing licence to the new house they target the whole estate. The strange thing here is that it appears that they have both your names. Could they have obtained this information from the local authority of the Revenue? I'm not sure that they could.

The thing is that you will eventually have to just get a licence, as much as I am against this, because they do bring some people to court over it - although I'm sure there are very few people prosecuted.

niceirishfella

Re; the statutory form?

Where do we stand with that?

Rhonda9000

kizzyf wrote: »

just get a licence

Hear hear.

niceirishfella

wow Rhonda - your such a sheep!

smashey

An Post have the contract for TV licences. Once a year, every individual postman has to update his records. These are then logged and any new names or people without licences are contacted. They know you're there as they are delivering all your other mail so the easiest solution is just get a licence.

Rhonda9000

niceirishfella wrote: »

wow Rhonda - your such a sheep!

LOL. Seriously though irish, the easiest solution to your problem / query / anxiety regarding statutory declarations is to just buy the dang licence.

If you feel it's worth the risk to not get one, there is no point in trying to get a 'legal' answer that suits your position here - a legal practitioner cannot advise you take an illegal course of action even if as trivial as conning RTE out of 160 euro a year.

Ya cute whore you wouldnt be the first and wont be the last to try it...

pirelli

niceirishfella wrote: »

wow Rhonda - your such a sheep!

Attack the post and not the poster.

I would write to them and explain that you dont have a TV etc and challenge them as to whether they think you have and explain they are wrong and you would like to resolve the issue before any action is taken.
More of a reptile I would say In my opinion. Thats my two cents worth.

GerardKeating

niceirishfella wrote: »

Hi,

We are only in our new house for a couple of months and my wife and I got a letter each the other day stating they see no record of our address having a TV licence - blah -blah- blah-.
They have enclosed a STATUTORY DECLARATION FORM and want it filled out and returned to them within 21 days etc.
They say that failure to return this form could result in prosection? Is this true?

They then go in bold type outlining the fines - €634.87 for 1st offence and then 1269.74 for a second!

Where does the law stand on all of this statutory forms stuff?


i'm curious - and interersted to know.

Thanks,
NIF

If you have no TV, they cannot fine you for anything, if you have a TV, the fines above can and will be leveled against you.

Hobart

Rhonda9000 wrote: »

LOL. Seriously though irish, the easiest solution to your problem / query / anxiety regarding statutory declarations is to just buy the dang licence.

If you feel it's worth the risk to not get one, there is no point in trying to get a 'legal' answer that suits your position here - a legal practitioner cannot advise you take an illegal course of action even if as trivial as conning RTE out of 160 euro a year.

Ya cute whore you wouldnt be the first and wont be the last to try it...

Has the OP said that he does not have a licence? Why should he purchase a licence, if he already has one?

If I understand the question correctly, the OP clearly states that there in no licence recorded at that address. If the op recently moved from one house to another he could have taken his TV and licence with him, therfore he would have a licence for his TV.

The declaration would merely state that he has a current licence for his TV, but not registered at his current address.

Our man in Havana

The main reason for the statutory declaration is that An Post do not know your name and by completing that form they will now have your name and address. They will then have enough to prosecute you.
The general advice is not to respond to any correspondence from an post. It is up to them to prove that you have an unlicensed television not you and you are under no obligation to assist them.

Victor

But is it an offence to not complete and return the statutory declaration?

Our man in Havana

Nope. They make sound like it is.

Gobán Saor

Victor wrote: »

But is it an offence to not complete and return the statutory declaration?

It is. Section 7 (1) of the Wireless Telegraphy Act 1926 http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1926/en/act/pub/0045/sec0007.html (as amended by later Wireless Telegraphy Acts, various Broadcasting Acts and umpteen SI's) creates the requirement to return the statutory declaration and Section 7 (3) makes failure to comply an offence with a fine of £5 on summary conviction. Presumably this has now been increased to the amount mentioned by the OP.

Our man in Havana

Surely they cannot prosecute if they do not know who was to complete the statutory declaration? They use it as a means to get a name from the householder.

Carawaystick

I think the 1926 act mentions that the statutory declaration form is t be delivered by recorded delivery or registered post, if it's not, there's no obligation to declare??

You could always declare yer mobile phone.... an apparatus for wireless telegraphy par excelence!

chattyk

I paid my TV licence in January and got the same letter for 3 months afterwards and each time I had to bring my licence down to the post office to prove I had it. The following month I got a card through the letterbox from the licence inspector saying he called to the house as there was no record of a licence for this address. He declared he saw the tv through the window and threatened legal action if we did not acquire a licence within 7 working days. I stormed down to the post office again with my licence and demanded that she got whoever on the phone and sorted out the situation while I was standing there listening to her. She reluctantly did this and I got a meek apology for the error. Can't wait for renewal next year!!

Our man in Havana

It just goes to show that An Post are a law onto themselves.

GerardKeating

Bond-007 wrote: »

It just goes to show that An Post are a law onto themselves.

Many years ago, they managed to convict some with no TV for not having a TV licence.

pirelli

GerardKeating wrote: »

Many years ago, they managed to convict some with no TV for not having a TV licence.

Really! That's called tunnel Vision. There should be licences for officials with Tunnel vision, that refuse logic and fit their own logic, physically if they have to in order to get that conviction.

Ambitious people do cruel things, always have and always will.

lordhawhaw

Check out the letter

Its standard format, Dear Customer,

Please return to above address.....but it dosent have a return address on actual letter.

It does have a freepost envelope.

I was sent one even though the person who owns the house and tv didnt get one but others within the house got the letter.

I finally found the office that deals with it and tried to clarify the situation.

I was told Each household must have a TV licence. I infromed him that my other flat mates and other people who moved out got similar letter claiming 160 euro. 3 licences for 1 TV?

I guess we aint a family so they figured out that as we all have seperate shelves we are different households within the one flat.

Waiting for the dog licence letter, fishing rod license letter and plane license anyday now, oh wait... did An Post get those collection contracts to??

Victor

Is there a comparable offence to mail fraud here?