How the hell do ya pass the test ??

rosiekwacker

I am trying to help my very :mad: hubby. He has just gotten notification of his bike test - this will be his 5th attempt at passing. Yes that's right - number 5 :eek:

He's been riding for nearly twenty years - full time on bike for 15 of those 20. Currently has 1100cc Kwacker and in all this time we've had only one accident courtesy of an L driver talking on his mobile who kindly rear-ended us about 6 years ago.

I could bore you with the details of each of the previous tests but I'll try and keep it short and sweet.

1 - Failed for lack of observation on Roundabouts on my 70cc chicken chaser
2 - Failed for being over cautious at a Zebra crossing (little kid ran away from his ma and stood at the crossing)
3 - Failed for being a white liner - exact term used by the tester - who also said - all you city boys come down here thinking you'll get an easy ride:(
4 - road positioning at junctions

For the last 2 tests he's had pre-tests with two different instructors who both told him that they cannot understand why he hasn't passed but both suggested it's due to the size and type of bike (sports tourer) he has - so this time round he's hiring a 650cc BMW.

Aside from using a smaller bike - has anyone any suggestions as to what he can wear, do, say that will help him get his licence this time round.

We've been told he should wear his leathers, also not to wear his leathers. Only to wear an armoured rain jacket and jeans i.e don't look too much like a 'biker'. He's even been told to shave off this beard (he already has short hair) as this could also be held against him. All suggestions or previous experiences would be gratefully received

At this stage hubby is starting to feel he has been black listed. (The irony is he passed his car test first time round!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Please help

Tigger

rosiekwacker wrote: »

I am trying to help my very :mad: hubby. He has just gotten notification of his bike test - this will be his 5th attempt at passing. Yes that's right - number 5 :eek:

He's been riding for nearly twenty years - full time on bike for 15 of those 20. Currently has 1100cc Kwacker and in all this time we've had only one accident courtesy of an L driver talking on his mobile who kindly rear-ended us about 6 years ago.

I could bore you with the details of each of the previous tests but I'll try and keep it short and sweet.

1 - Failed for lack of observation on Roundabouts on my 70cc chicken chaser
2 - Failed for being over cautious at a Zebra crossing (little kid ran away from his ma and stood at the crossing)
3 - Failed for being a white liner - exact term used by the tester - who also said - all you city boys come down here thinking you'll get an easy ride:(
4 - road positioning at junctions

For the last 2 tests he's had pre-tests with two different instructors who both told him that they cannot understand why he hasn't passed but both suggested it's due to the size and type of bike (sports tourer) he has - so this time round he's hiring a 650cc BMW.

Aside from using a smaller bike - has anyone any suggestions as to what he can wear, do, say that will help him get his licence this time round.

We've been told he should wear his leathers, also not to wear his leathers. Only to wear an armoured rain jacket and jeans i.e don't look too much like a 'biker'. He's even been told to shave off this beard (he already has short hair) as this could also be held against him. All suggestions or previous experiences would be gratefully received

At this stage hubby is starting to feel he has been black listed. (The irony is he passed his car test first time round!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Please help

yellow jacket with l plate over textile jacket
i don't know if the fundro will help but it won't hurt
test in sligo i've never heard of a biker failing there

galwaytt

Plain coloured helmet with an obvious sticker or something in the middle, on the back - this way, every movement of his head will be obvious, and will be put down to observing, correctly.

paulieeye

Exaggerate the Life Saver and left/right looks at all turns and junctions. Also exaggerate all mirror checks at regular intervals. The tester wont pick up a quick side ways glance even if u can check ur mirrors without moving ur head much.

KTRIC

I would say after 20 years of biking he's picked up some bad habits he's not aware of. Has he ever done a pre-test with anyone, I highly recommend them.

I had no lessons ever and the day before I took my test I did a pre-test with ISM and passed the test with flying colours.

Give it a shot, he might get a surprise.

CrazyRabbit

1 - Failed for lack of observation on Roundabouts on my 70cc chicken chaser

He needs to check for traffic coming from the right (of course), and also check the traffic on the left that will be entering the roundabout.

2 - Failed for being over cautious at a Zebra crossing (little kid ran away from his ma and stood at the crossing)

That's confusing alright.

3 - Failed for being a white liner - exact term used by the tester - who also said - all you city boys come down here thinking you'll get an easy ride

Stop 1 foot/12 inches/30 cm from white lines.

4 - road positioning at junctions

If turning right, move to the right side of the lane (after checking behind to ensure nobody is overtaking/filtering)
If turning left, move to the left side of the lane (again after checking behind for cyclist/motorcyclist who are undertaking....or vehicles in bus lanes)
If going straight, stay just 'left of centre' in the lane, which is the general road position anyway.

Other suggestions.
Don't accelerate too fast or too slow. Too fast = Reckless. Too slow=lack of progress

If passing parked vehicles, leave enough of a gap so that you will not be hit by cars doors being opened. Of course, on some narrower roads this may not be possible, so reducing speed would be the alternative.

When stopped in traffic, leave a good gap between you and the vehicle in front....about the lenght of a small car.

Be a confident driver.

Imagine a line down the centre of the left lane....drive just to the left of this unless you're about to turn, or passing parked vehicles.

Hope this helps. Please free to correct me guys if the advice is incorrect.

P.S. If he honestly believes the examner failed him in error, he can appeal. Absolutely 0% chance of appeal being upheld, but you usually get a free retest in a few weeks by one of the more experienced examiners.

Run_to_da_hills

Perhaps if he could borrow a scooter, the tester might feel sorry for you and give you a pass.

Esel

CrazyRabbit wrote: »

3 - Failed for being a white liner - exact term used by the tester - who also said - all you city boys come down here thinking you'll get an easy ride.

Stop 1 foot/12 inches/30 cm from white lines.

Don't think this is the white line the tester meant! I'd say it's the centre line on the road.

paulieeye

[QUOTE=CrazyRabbit;560069773 - Failed for being a white liner - exact term used by the tester - who also said - all you city boys come down here thinking you'll get an easy ride

Stop 1 foot/12 inches/30 cm from white lines.
[/QUOTE]


White Liner..City Boy??? did he have any white powder on his beard???

lukester

1 - Failed for lack of observation on Roundabouts on my 70cc chicken chaser

I'd add that before he exits the roundabout, he should do a shoulder check to the left (life-saver) to ensure it's safe to move left, i.e. that no-one is trying to undertake him.

2 - Failed for being over cautious at a Zebra crossing (little kid ran away from his ma and stood at the crossing)

Hard to know without knowing more about the circumstances.

3 - Failed for being a white liner - exact term used by the tester - who also said - all you city boys come down here thinking you'll get an easy ride

I'd have thought this refers to the centre line as well, did he cross it at all, perhaps while filtering?

CrazyRabbit wrote: »

Imagine a line down the centre of the left lane....drive just to the left of this unless you're about to turn, or passing parked vehicles.

I'd say ride dead centre in the middle of your lane, obviously altering this according to any hazards. The idea is that you command the space you are riding in, and riding left of centre invites car drivers to overtake or to try and edge up beside you.

To be honest, if he's taken a few pre-test lessons and instructors can't see why he'd fail, then it's a bit of a mystery. He's obviously a competent rider, just is displaying a few gotchas in a test situation.

In addition to other suggestions, I'd get him to ride in test mode for a full two weeks or so before the test. It'll be a bit frustrating, but if he's been riding a long time he may have bad habits that just pop up on the test. By riding in strict test mode for a few weeks it'll make it easier on the day to ride like that, it will be second nature, not something he has to think about.

dewsbury

OP , I passed recently after 25 years. Never did test before.

I did test in Churchtown (Dublin) and had no problems.

There seems to be a lot of half-truths & myths spoken about some of the more subtle details of the test. In my experience the test is not very technical and all that is required is common sense.
I know that this is not my help however!

Two suggestions.

1. Change test centre.

2. Get a couple (no more than 1 or 2) pre-test lessons.

3. Bear in mind that (I think) the test is a test mainly concerned with safety and not with smaller technicalities.

colm_c

lukester wrote: »

I'd say ride dead centre in the middle of your lane, obviously altering this according to any hazards. The idea is that you command the space you are riding in, and riding left of centre invites car drivers to overtake or to try and edge up beside you.

It's standard practice to ride just to the left of the centre of the road, same principle as going through a junction that you should be in the left lane.

OP -- get your pretest by someone who knows the test routes and the test centre as there are some slight test centre differences for testing, not much but it could be enough to fail. In terms of bike, ensure that your hubby is familiar with the machine he's riding on the day, if not he could look nervous.

rosiekwacker

Thank you all so much for taking the time to reply to my question - I really appreciate it

Re: his previous tests

Whiteliner - the road was narrow and recently resurfaced with no road markings at all. Hubby reckoned he was in the centre of his 'section' of the road but tester said no - he was too near the middle.

Road placement at junctions - hubby (and I did the same when I was on the bikes) always keeps over but not over so far that a car can get up the inside/ outside of you. See that crap happen too often - us bikes are bloody invisible to anything with four wheels or more. Hubby argued this one with the tester and failed. Tester reckoned he needed to be over by another foot.

My fear is that he'll lose the rag altogether the next time if he fails - and ride over the next tester. It'll also mean we'll have to sell his bike (pride and joy).

But fingers crossed and if anyone else has anymore tips - please feel free to post. I'm making a list here!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:D

lukester

colm_c wrote: »

It's standard practice to ride just to the left of the centre of the road, same principle as going through a junction that you should be in the left lane.

Standard practice, according to whom? It might be common behaviour, but that doesn't mean it's correct, or the safest position. In any case, as long as you're riding at, or close to, the centre of your lane, you are commanding your space on the road, and not inviting car drivers to push up either side of you.

rosiekwacker wrote: »

Whiteliner - the road was narrow and recently resurfaced with no road markings at all. Hubby reckoned he was in the centre of his 'section' of the road but tester said no - he was too near the middle.

Road placement at junctions...Tester reckoned he needed to be over by another foot.

Sounds like the tester was being very picky, but might indicate it's worth focusing on this a wee bit. I'd agree with colm_c that it could be worth getting lessons/pretest with someone who knows the test centre and the testers- they'll have an idea of what they look for. Also, if he tells them all the specific points he has failed on and targets those, he's giving himself an even better chance.

Hotblack Desiato

CrazyRabbit wrote: »

Imagine a line down the centre of the left lane....drive just to the left of this unless you're about to turn, or passing parked vehicles.

Good advice for passing the test, but dangerous in the real world as it invites cars to try to squeeze past you when there might not be enough room.

The testers, by and large, do not ride bikes (although do hold a bike licence) and the test requirements were drawn up 40-odd years ago when most bikes on the road were slower than today's mopeds, the priority was keeping out of the way of traffic!

CrazyRabbit

ninja900 wrote: »

Good advice for passing the test, but dangerous in the real world as it invites cars to try to squeeze past you when there might not be enough room.

Two instructors from ISM 'warned' me to stay 'left of centre' during the test. The examiner will be looking for this as it is considered the best general road position. I've honestly have no idea why though.

dewsbury

Just a small comment on instructors.

I had one pre-test lesson (and it was worthwhile).

However, I was a very experienced rider.

The point I wish to make is .. Sometimes the instructors go overboard in terms of technique. They feel they need to spot something wrong even if you are a good rider.

lukester

CrazyRabbit wrote: »

Two instructors from ISM 'warned' me to stay 'left of centre' during the test. The examiner will be looking for this as it is considered the best general road position. I've honestly have no idea why though.

Not being funny, but I'd take anything the ISM say with a tablespoon of salt. They mainly focus on cars- there are a slew of good bike instructors around.

dewsbury wrote: »

Just a small comment on instructors.

I had one pre-test lesson (and it was worthwhile).

However, I was a very experienced rider.

The point I wish to make is .. Sometimes the instructors go overboard in terms of technique. They feel they need to spot something wrong even if you are a good rider.

Have to say, I've never had this experience, and the OP's two instructors both couldn't understand why he hadn't passed. Also, for the test, even a good rider can fail for something silly, and an experienced rider may have picked up a few habits that are fine in normal riding, but will cause you to fail a test.

Instructors are there to help you - if you don't have any riding issues to improve on, there's no motivation for them to point something out just for the sake of it.

CrazyRabbit

lukester wrote: »

Not being funny, but I'd take anything the ISM say with a tablespoon of salt. They mainly focus on cars- there are a slew of good bike instructors around.

The ISM instructor I spoke to only deals with bikes (Joe in the Drumcondra branch). I found his advice to be superb, and I was a 100% better driver after his training. Two days after the training I took my test (in Tallaght) and passed with no faults.

Hotblack Desiato

CrazyRabbit wrote: »

The ISM instructor I spoke to only deals with bikes (Joe in the Drumcondra branch). I found his advice to be superb, and I was a 100% better driver after his training. Two days after the training I took my test (in Tallaght) and passed with no faults.

Well done.

You do a pre-test, you (rightly) get told what will get you through the test. What the testers are looking for is NOT always the safest or best way to ride, positioning being just one example. Who, in the real world, would always wait in gear at lights? On a Guzzi you'd have a left forearm like Popeye if you did, on a Duke you might overheat the clutch! but that's what the testers are expecting.

Now on an advanced course they would explain why and when you should do things differently e.g. last in queue = first to be hit, so stay in gear, keep scanning your mirrors and have an escape route. Otherwise, there is no point staying in gear and it's more mechanically sympathetic not to.