irish tv on the astra sat ?

Locker14

Can anyone help me unscramble Irish TV on the Astra sat . I have a dish in my camper and can get everything except RTE. Icontacted RTE direct and received the following answer.



Hi
Thanks for the mail,

RTÉ is not currently available on a satellite free-to-air service. Approximately 50% of our programming is acquired from UK and American sources. RTÉ only purchases Irish rights to these programmes. If we were on a free-to-air basis these programmes could be viewed outside of Ireland and RTÉ would be in breach of its rights agreements with the suppliers of this source of programming. RTÉ is only available on a subscription satellite basis on Sky or NTL which enables encryption and prevents access to RTÉ outside of the island of Ireland. This means that availability such as this is within our rights agreements.
RTÉ is obliged by law to provide a transmission network for its radio and television service. Our analogue terrestrial network fulfils this obligation. Looking to the future RTÉ is in the process of trialing a digital terrestrial television service. When this is up and running people in Ireland will be able to receive a wide range of channels via the existing (and upgraded) terrestrial transmitter network with much improved quality of picture and sound. The EU has suggested 2012 at the date for the switch over from analogue to digital for television services. On this basis the new digital service should be up and running within this timeframe.

Apologies that I don't have a more favourable response for you,

Kind Regards,



RTÉ Information

GerardKeating

Locker14 wrote: »

Can anyone help me unscramble Irish TV on the Astra sat .

The only LEGAL way to do this is via a SKY suibscription, any other interuption of your question is a request to pirate the sky signal and this would breach forums rules.

Mossy Monk

Surely that is the only way. Unless someone has hacked Videoguard. Use an aerial OP.

Invincible

Mossy Monk wrote: »

Surely that is the only way. Unless someone has hacked Videoguard. Use an aerial OP.

As Mossy said,an aeriel,could get what's known in local stores as a "Longford" aeriel,about 20" long,cost about 18 euro.

Locker14

I'm not looking for a way to illegally hack into RTEs scrambled signal all i was doing was highlighting the ridiculous situation were a licence payer has no access to RTE on a satellite platform unless we take out further subscriptions to an English company . :mad:

dhaumi

Locker14 wrote: »

I'm not looking for a way to illegally hack into RTEs scrambled signal all i was doing was highlighting the ridiculous situation were a licence payer has no access to RTE on a satellite platform unless we take out further subscriptions to an English company . :mad:

It is a ridiculous situation. Not to mention the people who can't get TV3...
RTE sold their soul on that one.
All you can do is wait for DTT to be rolled out. I'm sceptic about the coverage though, unless you live in major towns or close to them I doubt you'd get it anytime soon...

watty

It's actually owned by Austrailians that bought US citizenship. Ultimately they are not good for the UK either. Hence FreeSat.


It's been highlighted to RTE since ever they launched on Sky. At the time they regarded Satellite as only cordless cable.

They have always been in denial about how good coverage is. With coverage set to be worse with DTT, RTE and the Government need a coherent Irish Satellite strategy.

Mossy Monk

Locker14 wrote: »

I'm not looking for a way to illegally hack into RTEs scrambled signal all i was doing was highlighting the ridiculous situation were a licence payer has no access to RTE on a satellite platform unless we take out further subscriptions to an English company . :mad:

You do not need the 'English' compay to watch RTÉ though.

Bozacke

Mossy Monk wrote: »

You do not need the 'English' compay to watch RTÉ though.

That's true, but even though I have a good antenna for RTE and live close to a transmitter, the picture is very good quality, but it's still not as good as the picture quality I get from the satellite channels and it doesn't have an EPG. Plus that antenna only gets me RTE 1 & 2 and you need a second antenna for TV3 and TNG4. If the 5 Irish channels went FTV on satellite requiring an Irish card it would be great and certainly eat into Sky's customer base here, although many of us, myself included would need a new set top box.

watty

When the transmission is not Widescreen, the analogue is definitely better quality.

Unfortunately the picture is downsampled for analogue and re-cropped when the source is Widescreen.

IMO RTE had no right to go WS before having a nationwide Irish Digital Service.

There are only 4 Irish channels, not 5. C6 doesn't count as it is PayTV only.

You could almost discount TV3 too actually.

MisterAnarchy

dhaumi wrote: »

All you can do is wait for DTT to be rolled out.

You will be waiting a long long time for that to happen.:(

digitaldr

There's always Diaspora TV if/when in launches.

Bozacke

watty wrote: »

There are only 4 Irish channels, not 5. C6 doesn't count as it is PayTV only.
You could almost discount TV3 too actually.

Hi Watty,

I don't live in Dublin, but I thought C6 was free via terrestrial to people in the Dublin Area.

GerardKeating

Bozacke wrote: »

Hi Watty,

I don't live in Dublin, but I thought C6 was free via terrestrial to people in the Dublin Area.

C6 is only on UPC just now, it will be on DTT when ever it comes out.

watty

It's also on Sky now, but for a while was only on cable.

Niall1234

Its a disgrace that there isn't an FTV card available for Sky boxes to allow the 4 Irish terrestrial stations to be viewed without a Sky sub.

When is RTE's deal with Sky up regarding encryption and would a move to create an FTV card create much extra costs to RTE ?

It would solve a lot of problems regarding RTE availibility in different locations around the country.

With the main UK Terrestrial stations now gone FTA it would also give Sky an awful headache.

watty

Due to how Sky charge for EPG and Encryption at 99.999% profit margin, it would cost RTE Millions. RTE has been getting Encryption and EPG free under current deal (where Sky has the rights to charge what they like in which ever mix packs they like).

Antenna

I wonder will the planned digital Oireachtas Channel be available FTA on satellite?
I can't see any copyright issues with it being FTA (and available to Irish emigrants in the UK)

watty

It could have been available for the last 7 or 8 years then.

MACHEAD

Judging by the some of the pessamestic predictions of DTT roll out and when and if RTE will ever go unencrypted on satellite, the words of the old Zaeger & Evans song comes to mind 'In The Year 2525'. If RTE are not paying Sky for the EPG position and encryption, can there be any kind of binding contract keeping them there? And if not, what's to hinder them linking up with the UK Freesat service and launching an 'Irish region' on that platform via post code or pin number or whatever. I for one would drop sky myself if I couild get a decent digital package of the irish channels via another means. Up where I am (South Down) anywhere north of Newry the Irish DTT trial is too unstable, and even the UK DTT is dodgy enough down here, so for now it's satellite, or stick with grainy, ghosty old analogue.

watty

Rte signed a "secret" contract with Sky. I think it expires this year, but of course they could have "secretly" renewed it.

There is no security on Freesat. It is FTA. RTE can't afford the UK rights for their programs. Unless hell freezes, pigs fly and Hollywood/Sport changes how rights are paid for the RTE channels can't be on Freeview or FTA. Even home grown programs are a problem as performance payments could be x20 higher if the programs are able to be viewed in whole of UK.

Greenman

watty wrote: »

Rte signed a "secret" contract with Sky. I think it expires this year, but of course they could have "secretly" renewed it.

I suppose someone could do a Freedom of information request, I'm not sure what the cost is?

Tony

watty wrote: »

There is no security on Freesat. It is FTA.

Not so sure about that , ITV HD can only be viewed on a HD freesat box, why would they go to all that trouble?

bassy

not true tony,itv hd is viewable on a few various hd sat receivers,i know for sure itv hd can be viewed on a technomate 6800;)

Tony wrote: »

Not so sure about that , ITV HD can only be viewed on a HD freesat box, why would they go to all that trouble?

Tony

Is this a patched version by any chance? I speak of receivers straight out of the box. Have you seen this yourself?

bassy wrote: »

not true tony,itv hd is viewable on a few various hd sat receivers,i know for sure itv hd can be viewed on a technomate 6800;)

givecredit

Tony, i have an unpatched Humax 2000, and can watch ITV HD with no problems. I think i've seen every part of London from the air at this stage!!

I could not program it in under a normal scan. But by using the Humax Channel editor provided on the Humax support site (Called Formula) i could get the channel no problem.

But i do agree with you. It is a sort of security. How many people across Europe would actually bother using Channel Editors on their PCS to get a channel. Most i believe would not bother, or not know what im talking about. So i suppose ITV have managed to keep copyright holders happy.

Tony

This is good news in so far as it can be programmed in, I stand corrected on that point. Your point is well made its all about keeping the rights holders happy even though the channel can be viewed outside its target area. May I have a URl for the support site as I have a new HD receiver coming in and i'd like to see if I can get ITV HD on it.

givecredit wrote: »

Tony, i have an unpatched Humax 2000, and can watch ITV HD with no problems.



But i do agree with you. It is a sort of security. How many people across Europe would actually bother using Channel Editors on their PCS to get a channel. Most i believe would not bother, or not know what im talking about. So i suppose ITV have managed to keep copyright holders happy.

givecredit

Humax Channel Editor;

http://www.humaxdigital.com/hcsa/download/products/HDCI-2000.asp#f

ITV HD Parameters for Humax and others; (This can be loaded onto humax with channel editor)

http://www.satellites.co.uk/satellite/freesat/124971-itv-hd-humax-hdci-2000-a.html

You need to register to this site in order to download the file. (POST 3, SEE FILE)

Tony

Thanks appreciate it.

givecredit wrote: »

Humax Channel Editor;

http://www.humaxdigital.com/hcsa/download/products/HDCI-2000.asp#f

ITV HD Parameters for Humax and others; (This can be loaded onto humax with channel editor)

http://www.satellites.co.uk/satellite/freesat/124971-itv-hd-humax-hdci-2000-a.html

You need to register to this site in order to download the file. (POST 3, SEE FILE)

fat-tony

Tony wrote: »

This is good news in so far as it can be programmed in, I stand corrected on that point. Your point is well made its all about keeping the rights holders happy even though the channel can be viewed outside its target area.

The fact that the ITV HD can be viewed on a non-Freesat box confirms what I posted earlier about "security by obscurity" being no security at all. I'm surprised that it was circumvented so quickly, though.

Prediction - a rash of "special " versions of FTA receivers (including PVR facilities) in the coming months to support Freesat EPG and PID allocations and also regular FTA programming. :cool:

In the grand scheme of things, these types of boxes will appeal to specialist users (particularly those of us in good old Ireland), and probably won't make a dent in standard Freesat box sales.

As long as the rights holders are happy with the current arrangement, though.

Tony

I think the epg may be a problem as I dont think its open software, would love if that were the case though means we could get all the freesat benefits with a good priced receiver and the ability to have multi sat and motorised on the same box.

fat-tony wrote: »

Prediction - a rash of "special " versions of FTA receivers (including PVR facilities) in the coming months to support Freesat EPG

Tony

Tony wrote: »

Not so sure about that , ITV HD can only be viewed on a HD freesat box, why would they go to all that trouble?

Made a total liar of myself, now working on a ferguson HD box.

fat-tony

There were rumblings on Digital Spy about the potential for the Freesat EPG being incorporated into future FTA receivers. I know it's a proprietary EPG, but it's not encrypted, so some enterprising linux hacker will probably reverse-engineer the table and produce a patch for Dreambox-type receivers etc. Some posters on the DS forum have had some limited success in reading the EPG data but it appears to be compressed.

Difficult one to call for the mainstream FTA box makers. With the market sewn up by licenced Freesat receivers there would be little financial incentive to produce an enthusiast's box. But never say never

Tony

fat-tony wrote: »

Difficult one to call for the mainstream FTA box makers. With the market sewn up by licenced Freesat receivers there would be little financial incentive to produce an enthusiast's box. But never say never

I don't think the financial aspect will be a constraint. What may happen is a HD FTA receiver is produced and a software "patch" appears on the internet which makes the epg data work. I can see them making this as firmware on existing boxes.

Hero Of College

watty wrote: »

Rte signed a "secret" contract with Sky. I think it expires this year, but of course they could have "secretly" renewed it.

There is no security on Freesat. It is FTA. RTE can't afford the UK rights for their programs. Unless hell freezes, pigs fly and Hollywood/Sport changes how rights are paid for the RTE channels can't be on Freeview or FTA. Even home grown programs are a problem as performance payments could be x20 higher if the programs are able to be viewed in whole of UK.

SO if I go out and get a sky subscription now, with part of my motivation being to enjoy the Irish channels, there is no chance that I will wake up in the morning and see that these channels have disappeared onto another format or supplier???

You see, SKY can cut these channels and get away with charging you the same, because they are part of a BONUS pack, we didn't pay for them in the first place.

BHG

is the ITV HD obscurity not for reasons of rights but for reasons of exclusivity!

ITV HD will be a simulcast of ITV1 even some SD ITV1 (correct me if i'm wrong) but as ITV1 is FTA a while now ITV have no issues with spilling rights on the country size principle, UK is bigger than Ireland & therefore the EU directives, the national courts the rights owners & holders don't give a monkeys. Ireland is a small country therefore the above mentioned do care about our spill over while ignoring the UK big 4 and associated spins offs spill over.

Exclusivity: is it not that ITV HD is NOT on Sky, not on Sky EPG and only on Freesat. This is seen as an advantage to Freesat but will (long term) be a disadvantage to ITV. Free To Air signals want to be free not FTV or soft crypted etc.

RTE3 mentioned elsewhere today sounds interesting, the RTE letter on post #1 of this thread says "RTÉ is not currently available on a satellite free-to-air service" not currently also not true, RTE is FTA for radio so where rights are not an issue they can be FTA with SKy AND/OR freesat. RTE secret deal allows Sky to gain €0.5bn revenue in the small island. That's why EPG & crypt would be free, for that reason alone RTE should be pulled by Govt. out of the deal. RTE3 + Diaspora + FTA-Films + Dáil TV fta on Freesat inside 3 years i guess. Forget RTE1&2 with Holywood GAA & soccer keeping them videoguarded into the future.

bhg http://RTE2FTA.com

Tony

In this particular case i would say exclusivity

BHG wrote: »

is the ITV HD obscurity not for reasons of rights but for reasons of exclusivity!

Zaphod

BHG wrote: »

is the ITV HD obscurity not for reasons of rights but for reasons of exclusivity!

This issue already cropped up on the other ITV-HD thread. To reiterate, the transmission of ITV-HD with hidden PIDs has everything to do with copyright and nothing to do with Sky.

The ITV SD channels are broadcast from Astra 2D, so (nominally) their footprint covers primarily the UK and Ireland. This has been sufficient to satisfy the rights holders since ITV went FTA.



ITV-HD is not able to currently transmit from 2D because there is not enough bandwidth available on that satellite. It is instead broadcast from Eurobird 1 which has a Europe-wide footprint. In order to limit its reception to the UK and thus satisfy the rights holders, they have hidden the PIDs for the stream. This means that only Freesat boxes can readily extract the PID data from the Freesat EPG stream (also on Eurobird).



If their intention was solely to prevent Sky digiboxes from receiving the channels, they could either 1) send an encrypted flag which would cause the digibox to 'black out' the channel or 2) use a symbol rate which a digibox can't handle e.g. 26666.

The channels could have been made available to digiboxes as well as but that would have required ITV to transmit a second ITV-HD stream encrypted in Videoguard, pay NDS for the privilege, pay Sky for inclusion on their EPG, and pay Eutelsat for the additional bandwidth required.