Health Insurance

warrenaldo

folks,

Maybe i should have but i dont have health insurance - basically because i am ignorant to the benefits of it.
Does our public health system cover us in case of all these problems?

I have a partner and 2 kids and am now considering it? But i dont know WHY i should get it?
Reading leaflets and booklets tell you all the things that you can avail of - but i always thought i could avail of these things through the public health system?

What am i missing? Please inform me.

hunnymonster

I'm only involved in the health service as a user but from what I can figure out you generally wait a very long time for non-urgent (and urgency appears to relate to if you will die or not, not your quality of life) treatment in the public system. That's not to say the private system is perfect. For example to get a private gynaecology appointment in Cork at the moment, the minimum wait is 9 months.

Fulton Crown

warrenaldo wrote: »

folks,

Maybe i should have but i dont have health insurance - basically because i am ignorant to the benefits of it.
Does our public health system cover us in case of all these problems?

I have a partner and 2 kids and am now considering it? But i dont know WHY i should get it?
Reading leaflets and booklets tell you all the things that you can avail of - but i always thought i could avail of these things through the public health system?

What am i missing? Please inform me.

What you are missing my friend is SPEED and CHOICE plus a certain degree of comfort:

Let's suppose one of your kids has tonsillitis OK ?

Public system - No choice of Doctor or Hosp..possibly long waiting time ...child missing school...no choice as to hosp admission time...probably will be the week before your Spanish holiday an your on Ryanair !!On admission just a number ...will only speak to juniors(not their fault).

Private Speedy consultation / direct attention from consultant / choice rregarding admission time / dealing direct with consultant - important if complications / nicer room an better visiting hours.

Overall saving a huge amount of your time ..less hastle in getting time off work etc.

Health Insurance ..WELL worth the money I say

warrenaldo

So basically its all about the SPEED and CHOICE.

So i will not get any better treatment? If i or any of my family get a serious illness/injury i will get the same treatment FREE?

IS that right?

hunnymonster

In theory yes, in practise no.

As an example (mod's hope it is ok to give a personal example?)

Start Feb - ran and won 80 mile ultra marathon (just putting this in to give idea of my lifestyle)

end February: (Friday) rash on legs, lots of pain, couldn't walk. I went to see GP who sent me to A&E where I waited for hours and then sent home

following Monday - Still unable to walk, still extreme pain and still rash. Was carried back to hospital by BF. In fact was pretty much carried everywhere those few days. Was kept in for IV antiobiotics but on whole treatment no better, sent home to bed without proper diagnosis and treatment

Thur of same week, still no improvement, back to GP who is disgusted by treatment in Hospital, says "wait a minute, you've got vhi" seen by private rheumatologist next morning, all tests done by that evening, diagnosis (erythema nodosum and sarcoidosis) that day and treatment begun.

I'm still not 100% but I'm getting there. If I was still being treated as a public patient, who knows. As it is I've had to cancel my summer races and my lungs are shot from the sarcoid. I don't know if I'll ever run again.

Would you be happy if it was your child not able to sleep for weeks with pain, left sitting around a hospital in pain without so much as a stool to put sore, lesioned legs on, told by a doc that you shouldn't expect treatment because you run long distances,......

it's absolutely wrong, I admit it but I gladly pay my subs every month. I love the scandaniavian and German type systems where treatment is much more equitable but let's not pretend for one minute that Ireland is like that.

ergo

hunnymonster wrote: »

Was kept in for IV antiobiotics but on whole treatment no better, sent home to bed without proper diagnosis and treatment

.

If you were kept in for iv antibiotics initially (as in admitted to hospital) presumably you were seen by a consultant (as all admitted patients are). These are the same consultants that work in the private system. In this case (and to be honest I don't think that this case is a good idea to illustrate the benefits of the private system - that's just my opinion) it seems the diagnosis was missed initially but you have to remember that

1. If you had gone directly privately they may have treated with iv antibiotics initially as common things are common and it is probably fair to say that it's a rare enough presentation and the fact that you had run an ultramarathon is a major distracting factor - therefore they had the benefit of knowing the initial public treatment didnt work

2. as I said above, if you did get seen by a consultant, well the majority of private consultants work in the public system too

back to the original topic, well I'm not sure about the private insurance thing. I don't have it. It is good for procedures with long waiting times etc or maybe if you end up with a chronic illness that needs specialist follow up for a prolonged period of time.

if you're actually acutely sick you want to be in a public hospital though.

There is also an argument for putting the equivalent amount of money to an insurance premium in a decent savings account and it's there if and when the need arises..........any thoughts on that.......?....I need to figure this out too cos need to start thinking about pensions/health insurance and all that stuff *sighs*

tallaght01

I have private health insurance. Have had for the last 3 or 4 years. It's been well worth it for me.

I've not been sick much, except for the last year, when i ended up in hospital twice, and I had to see a neurologist and have two head MRIs.

When I needed to come into hospital, the first time it was urgent. So, I was seen in the public A+E by the registrar, who was excellent. He operated on me out of hours, and everything went well. My room I recouperated in was pretty grotty, and the food was pretty lousy. There was also about 20 other patients on the ward, and maybe 3 or 4 nurses.

Having said that, it was top quality care, and I was quite proud of the guys for sorting me out to a high standard, despite working in a pretty horrible hoispital.BUT, I never saw a consultant. The SHO discharged me. That was fine. It was entirely appropriate for my condition, but I never once saw a consultant.

When i went into hospital 2nd time, it was non-urgently, so the health insurance kicks in. I saw the consultant in his private rooms , and he slotted me in for the op 2 weeks later! I recouperated in a private room that was honestly like a hotel room, with a plasma TV and an amazing food menu!There was a nurse who was constantly coming in to see if I was OK. he seemed much less harrassed, and was able to get anything I wanted. These things make a huge difference when you're sick. A consultant anaesthetist anaesthetised me. The consultant surgeon did my op, and came to see me a few hours after it. He then reviewed me in his private rooms after a week or so. He gave me his mobile number to ring him any time if I had any post op problems. When I was back in work he paged me to see how I was doing. Because I was private I could choose my consultant, and I chose him as he was the most experienced specialist there.

When I needed to see a neurolgist I had some visual field problems. Could have been a tumour, so i was pretty stressed. When I spoke to them on the phone, they were able to see me the same day. Got an MRI and the all clear 2 hours later.

I think health insurance is well worth it. My parents have it too, and it makes me feel a lot better that they do.

There's an interesting argument about health cover, though. Some public health people argue that If the middle/upper classes all get health insurance, then the only ones left using the public system are the poor. And any service used exclusively by the poor inevitably gets neglected. It's probably a fair point, but not enough to stop me paying my annual premium :P

Dr Galen

well the fear about the poor being forced to use an underfunded and staffed "public " system is well founded, butI have t admit I have private healthcare too eventhough I'm employee of the health service.

I've also had reason to seek the services of a neurologist, now even though I know this consultant fairly well, and he agreed to see me asap, it was still nearly 3 months. When i said, I'll go to his private clinic he saw me within a week and he is most definitely not the sort to be holding out for the private cash.

a lot of what Fulton Crown says is true unfortunately. The downside though to provate healthcare now though is that nearly 60% of the population have some form of private cover..........so if everyone has it then the waiting times will grow.........

You also have to remember that if you ever need anything fairly major done, you'll have to go to a public hospital, the private sector do not and will not have the facilities to deal with it. In that case you'll be lucky to get a room on your own, as single rooms in the public hospitals are not "private" they are isoloation rooms, e.g for MRSA type patients. you might be lucky and it might be timed right so that you'll get the room, but likewise, if a medical need arises you'll get shifted.

The standard of care though is pretty much the same once your in the door and getting sorted. All the patients are equal once they are in the public hospital, so just because you are an inpatient and have your VHI say in St James or Beaumont, you won't get scans done quicker than the public Joe beside you, or the care attendants won't be making you extra cups of tea. Certainly though as an outpatient - things move a lot quicker with the private care.

angeldelight

I know you said you have a partner and children already, but I think having private healthcare also has advantages when it comes to maternity care - I'm not well up on it at all but from what I've seen over in the parenting forum there seems to be advantages. Maybe someone else could shed some light on that as it hasn't been mentioned

PyrO_PrOfessOr

This seemed to be about the most relevant topic i could find so please dont shoot me if im hijacking a thread - I am moving to dublin in a few weeks, and have a variety of medical conditions. I want to join with a GP in order to be able to be monitored while I'm staying (about a year). Are there any costs that I should be prepared for? the only thing i really need done is blood tests - I have no clue about the irish healtcare system or whether the UK one covers me while I'm in Ireland.

Would I need to get health insurance as im pretty sure I don't have it up here. All my treatment has been on the NHS

Any help would be really appreciated.

Edit: I'm moving to Maynooth, In case that helps

wheresthebeef

I'm a student nurse in a large academic teaching hospital and i have worked on private wards as well as public wards. I do not treat private patients any differently. I do not care if you have VHI. I treat you the same, i offer you the same amount of cups of tea, i do not entertain your requests for private rooms (aka Isolation Rooms for people with infectious diseases), i do not spend more time talking with you or helping you do things. I spend most of my time with the people who need the most of my time. It sickens me to think that our most vulnerable people who do not have the means to pay for health insurance such as the elderly or the socially disadvantaged would be neglected at the expense of private patients sitting in public hospital beds. Private patients have no place in a public hospital. If you want to pay for private health care then go to a fully private hospital where everything is privately funded. Consultants make a mint from private consultations and procedures in public hospitals as they are being paid by the hospital and by the VHI/Quinn/Vivas crowd whilst using public rooms, equipment, nurses etc...

I do not have private health care because i do not agree with it on principle. Health care should not be a commodity, its a human right to which we are all entitled on a basis of need not ability to pay. Private Health Care is a dog eat dog situation that is being driven by the government by scaremongering and inadequate resources. Private Health Care is selfish, and basically people don't care about the old woman down the road who needs a hip replacement if it means they can get their tonsillectomy a little bit quicker.

Private patients also have a bit of a chip on their shoulders regarding the care they are given by nurses when they are in the hospital. How many times have i heard the expression "But i'm a private patient". I don't get any extra money to look after you and wouldn't want it, so you will get the same excellent standard of care that I afford to everyone irregardless of their income depending on a fair assessment of your health care needs.

So to the original poster, if you want to get private health insurance for your family work away, its your choice, but i'll treat you based on your needs, not on what "plan" you have.

And yes i know i sound like a communist.

Dr Galen

pinko liberal commie..........:)

welcome back beefy

tallaght01

But private healthcare isn't about how you're treated. It is, for most people, about access to services. In some cases there is a relationship between your health insurance and how you're treated. My dad had a procedure done ina private hospital, and the nursing ratios were much better than you will ever get in an irish hospital. My sister works in a large hospital in Dublin in the summers while she's at college, and after seeing the standard of healthcare their she literally begged my parents to put her on their healthcare plan.

You can pay a fortune and get the private healthcare that entitles you to a bed at the beacon as an inpatient. In most countries, private healthcare does entitle you to a bed in a private room. But not in ireland. That will probably change as more private hospitals open their doors. Here in oz, if I get sick, I go to a private hospital, unless I need a liver transplant or something.

But what it does mean, at the moment, is that you can see the neurologist in 3 days, rather than 6 months. It means you can get your MRI on the same day. It means you'll always see a consultant at clinic.

I don't think it's neccesarily a selfish act. The ethics people all have differing views on it. Some say that when most of the population has private healthcare it lets the govt off the hook, and it means they can underfund it, as it's primarily used by the poor.

Others argue that people on private plans free up waiting list places for those who can't afford/choose not to have private healthcare.

I certainly won't be giving up mine in a hurry. I think it's a good deal. It costs a bit, but the difference in access to healthcare is huge.

Speedy access to healthcare is said to be one of the biggest determinents of health outcomes, so I'm hanging onto mine for now.

Chunky Monkey

Cuba baby! Though I suppose the fuel shortage could be a bit of a pain.

wheresthebeef wrote: »

It sickens me to think that our most vulnerable people who do not have the means to pay for health insurance such as the elderly or the socially disadvantaged would be neglected at the expense of private patients sitting in public hospital beds. Private patients have no place in a public hospital.

What do you mean? I thought that sometimes patients even with VHI plan E don't have a choice on whether they go public or private if for example, they have to go to A+E (tis funny the amount of people with insurance who ring in thinking they can get admitted straight to a private hospital cos they don't want to wait in casualty) or they have to have a heart transplant in the Mater or be treated after a stroke in Beaumont.

There are a lot of public (NTPF) patients in the private hospitals. By the care assistants, nurses, doctors, catering staff etc they aren't treated any differently. Well I've never seen it otherwise anyway.

I ordered a consult for a post heart op NTPF patient with incontinence trouble once. I was told in future, to always check if a patient is NTPF first as the consultants who come don't get paid but he came anyway, he didn't care.

Health care should not be a commodity, its a human right to which we are all entitled on a basis of need not ability to pay.

Of course, that's kinda obvious. We should emigrate to France.

Private Health Care is a dog eat dog situation that is being driven by the government by scaremongering and inadequate resources.

I did feel a little annoyed the other day when I saw shiny new bus stop signs being put up around the city when the old ones looked absolutely fine and of course 'the money for that would be better spent put towards a state of the art public hospital being built in the West' was the first thing that came to mind.

Private Health Care is selfish, and basically people don't care about the old woman down the road who needs a hip replacement if it means they can get their tonsillectomy a little bit quicker.

How does one affect the other though? Unless your point is going right over my head I don't see how it's selfish for one to pay to get their tonsils out in a private hospital or how it will hinder the care of an elderly lady in a public hospital.

tallaght01 wrote: »

and the nursing ratios were much better than you will ever get in an irish hospital.

Ha not always. Businesses looking to attract prospective buyers may cut corners by not hiring required agency staff (leaving front line staff rather angry).

In most countries, private healthcare does entitle you to a bed in a private room. But not in ireland.

Many's the time I've been given abuse for that when working as a hostess.

Others argue that people on private plans free up waiting list places for those who can't afford/choose not to have private healthcare.

In theory that sounds like a great idea but then you've got the 'healthcare shouldn't be a commodity', 'creating a bigger social divide' and 'public hospitals will become very neglected' counter arguments there.

The idea of someone not getting the care they need because they don't have money does send a horrible shiver up the spine.

Let's go throw rotten fish at BIFFO.

whatawaster

Hi,

My GP is referring me to a neurologist, and, as i don't have Insurance she reckons my wait will be several months. What i was wondering was, can i sign up for VHI now and make myself a quicker appointment, or is there a period before it can be used?

Traumadoc

Its funny how in a country were there is supposed to be universal free healthcare nearly 60% of the population feel the need to pay for private care.
In fact it is probably in the governments interest to have more people paying for private healthcare.

taram

I've only used my VHI to cover things like GP visits and dental visits (which I need a lot of) and as sort of 'what if' policy.

Oh, one thing health insurance is good for is covering is things like ingrown toenails being done at your GPs!

Personally I'd like to rely on public health service, but terrified I'd get something not life threatening but that would affect my study/work/life such as chronic tonsillitis or weird migraines I'd want checked out and that I'd have to wait months. It's not a very nice system, and screws over people who can't fork out each month, but I'm still going to subscribe to it.

CathyMoran

whatawaster wrote: »

Hi,

My GP is referring me to a neurologist, and, as i don't have Insurance she reckons my wait will be several months. What i was wondering was, can i sign up for VHI now and make myself a quicker appointment, or is there a period before it can be used?

You have a waiting period for preexisting medical conditions (which yours would be considered to be).

I would not be without private health care, but then again I have diabetes and had cancer. My experience of the private health care system was very good when I was ill. It took 6 weeks to see a consultant but then I was tested within 3 days and when I had chemo I was in very nice surroundings and when I was recovering from surgery after ICU I was again in the best surroundings for my recovery (a private hospital). I would not be without it. You never know when you or your loved one might get ill.

PaddyofNine

wheresthebeef wrote: »

I do not have private health care because i do not agree with it on principle. Private Health Care is selfish,

That's a bit much now isn't it. Private health care is selfish? How is wanting the best for you and your family selfish? Does that mean that if I'm going to buy my children food I shouldn't until I make sure all the kids down the road have food too?

wheresthebeef wrote: »

and basically people don't care about the old woman down the road who needs a hip replacement if it means they can get their tonsillectomy a little bit quicker.

In fairness, if I was the old woman down the road I'd be more worried that an ENT surgeon was having a go at my hip op!

wheresthebeef wrote: »

Health care should not be a commodity, its a human right to which we are all entitled on a basis of need not ability to pay.

I agree with you to an extent but many diseases are at least to a certain extent a product of the patients self neglect - it's hard to argue this when you see patients claiming they can't afford to pay for an operation and then going home and buying the cigarettes and making sure Sky Multichannel is connected! At some point people need to start taking care of themselves and their children.

Fulton Crown

Private Health Insurance is a matter of choice !
It pisses me off to see how those with PHI portrayed as "rich" or "selfish" the vast majority are "ordinary" people who choose to spend a portion of their income on an item - Health Insurance - rather than on pints and other consumer **** like SKY etc etc

wheresthebeef

PaddyofNine wrote: »

In fairness, if I was the old woman down the road I'd be more worried that an ENT surgeon was having a go at my hip op!

You got me there LOL