Dublin City Traffic Ban

vincenzo1975

From RTE.... what do you think??

I wonder what the car parks affected will do. I personnally think it is a bad move and will score the gov major negative publicity. I wonder is this story just being floated to guage public reaction.
Dublin centre roads could be closed to cars

[URL="javascript:showPlayer('dublin_av.html')"] [/URL]Monday, 5 May 2008 11:43
A plan that would close off large sections of Dublin city centre to all private traffic is being considered.
Recommendations include the creation of a 'bus gate' area around College Green that would close off O'Connell Street, Westmoreland Street and Dame Street to all traffic except buses and taxis.
Chairman of the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Transport Frank Fahey told RTÉ's Morning Ireland about a confidential draft report outlining the plan.
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Mr Fahey said closing city centre roads to private traffic would make way for a reliable, high-frequency bus service. He said this is the best way to ease city centre traffic congestion in the short term.
The plan envisages 350 extra buses, with services running at 10 minute intervals off-peak and three minute intervals at peak times.
The closure could be implemented in April 2009.
The proposal includes a plan for private traffic flow around the city, involving the construction of two new bridges across the Liffey.
There would be a temporary bridge at Macken Street, and another at either Hawkins Street or Marlborough Street, to keep traffic from the car-free zone.
Dublin Chamber of Commerce says it is in favour of the plan, but with the construction of Dublin's metro imminent, planning for the construction and implemention phase will be key.
Transport Minister Noel Dempsey will get the draft report in the next ten days. After that, the Transport Committee will look at improving congenstion in Cork, Galway, Limerick and Waterford by making their city centres car-free.

Malteaser!

vincenzo1975 wrote: »

From RTE.... what do you think??

I wonder what the car parks affected will do. I personnally think it is a bad move and will score the gov major negative publicity. I wonder is this story just being floated to guage public reaction.
Dublin centre roads could be closed to cars

[URL="javascript:showPlayer('dublin_av.html')"] [/URL]Monday, 5 May 2008 11:43
A plan that would close off large sections of Dublin city centre to all private traffic is being considered.
Recommendations include the creation of a 'bus gate' area around College Green that would close off O'Connell Street, Westmoreland Street and Dame Street to all traffic except buses and taxis.
Chairman of the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Transport Frank Fahey told RTÉ's Morning Ireland about a confidential draft report outlining the plan.
Advertisement

Mr Fahey said closing city centre roads to private traffic would make way for a reliable, high-frequency bus service. He said this is the best way to ease city centre traffic congestion in the short term.
The plan envisages 350 extra buses, with services running at 10 minute intervals off-peak and three minute intervals at peak times.
The closure could be implemented in April 2009.
The proposal includes a plan for private traffic flow around the city, involving the construction of two new bridges across the Liffey.
There would be a temporary bridge at Macken Street, and another at either Hawkins Street or Marlborough Street, to keep traffic from the car-free zone.
Dublin Chamber of Commerce says it is in favour of the plan, but with the construction of Dublin's metro imminent, planning for the construction and implemention phase will be key.
Transport Minister Noel Dempsey will get the draft report in the next ten days. After that, the Transport Committee will look at improving congenstion in Cork, Galway, Limerick and Waterford by making their city centres car-free.

That was my first thought when I heard about this earlier!!

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Brilliant! About bloody time! Way too much unnesscary trafiic in there anyway. And tough **** if you have to get a Luas in from Sandyford or a 46A in from foxrock.

lost marbles

if it is for real and they do go ahead with it .simple way around it is, as everyone else in dublin is doing
buy a taxi plate

humberklog

It such a pity that measures taken to ease congestion are punitive to the general public not rewarding to the considerate. A bit more thinking outside the box instead of going down the usual route of taking the cane out and whacking ourselves across the knuckles. Good, respected bike lanes, joined up public transport and an idea I've had for a while is 'green parking'. Cars of a certain physical size and pollution out-put can only park in certain areas. An example is lay green tarmac down at all the street parking bays around Merrion sq.(for e.g)and only certain cars of a certain size can park there. This wouldn't just hold for new low-emission cars but also older,physically smaller cars. Reward the conscienscious.

dubtom

I can see it now,the already heavily congested routes into the city will be doubly so.Where the hell do they expect the traffic to go? It might surprise them to know that even with O'connell st being a partially bus/taxi street now,it can still take 20/30 minutes to get to the bridge from nt fred st of a morning,and that's just with buses and taxi's. Cars tend not to use it because it can't be accesed from dorset st. The macken st bridge will just be a bottle neck into pearse st, which in turn just leads to congestion into ballsbridge or up the canal. Going northside will lead into the equally bad eastwall which is chocka from the eastlink anyway. I can't for the life of me think where a bridge at malborough or hawkins will help,they will both be at the same spot on the quays which are congested anyway.
A ring round through the bay is the only way to keep traffic out of the city,from blackrock to the coast road at the baldoyle junction,easy access to most north and south side suberbs and the m50 northside.Oh yes...

seraphimvc

woho!
http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0505/dublin.html?rss

then my bus will never be late again??as a poor student who never understand why on earth people driving in city centre,jamming the traffic forcing me late to class!good news indeed

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

dubtom wrote: »

I can see it now,the already heavily congested routes into the city will be doubly so.Where the hell do they expect the traffic to go? ..

...hopefully not show up in the first place. Apparenlty, the plan allows for 350 new buses running at one every three minutes in peak time.

Of course, you're right - IF the public transport side of things DOESN'T get implemented, the whole exercise is a waste of time, but if Dubliners were a but more selective about when they drive into the city, then the need for such a law wouldnt be there in the first place.

Victor

humberklog wrote: »

It such a pity that measures taken to ease congestion are punitive to the general public not rewarding to the considerate.

It will reward the considerate - those who use public transport.

mikemac

vincenzo1975 wrote: »

Recommendations include the creation of a 'bus gate' area around College Green that would close off O'Connell Street, Westmoreland Street and Dame Street to all traffic except buses and taxis.

I'm going to assume motorbikes are allowed too
Just like that street north of O'Connell St and Georges St onto Dame St.
There are few other examples too.

It's good news, it was always going to happen at some stage but I was expecting it to be a few years yet

is_that_so

Victor wrote: »

It will reward the considerate - those who use public transport.

Some of the inconsiderate come from areas the powers that be have not been considerate enough to provide with an acceptable level of public transport.
Welcome in its own right, a given in some other European cities but IMO more aimed at PR. Given the other issues to be resolved, a couple of temporary bridges will make Dempsey look like a genius just as long as he doesn't have to fix the real problems of access to the city - a serious lack of integrated and reliable public transport.

humberklog

Victor wrote: »

It will reward the considerate - those who use public transport.

As a public transport and bike user i welcome any positive in roads to reduce congestion. But smaller cars should be encouraged more than big cars discouraged. If someone spends 85k on a chelsea tractor financial punary will have little affect. If however they can't get said tractor near little tommy's montissori or within throwing distance of their work then large car drivers in the city may think twice on using a small car.
I'd also put forward the painting of double red parking lines outside of schools for 200metre either side of entrance.
Ok last bit sounds a bit mad,however during kids school hols there is a huge drop off in traffic. Delays don't just occur in city centre and the school run needs serious addressing. And yes i have a car(small)and a little girl about to start school.

Hanley

Malteaser! wrote: »

That was my first thought when I heard about this earlier!!

Same page.

I think it's a terrible fcuking idea.

berliner

they brought in congestion charges in london thus driving out working people in micras and freed up the city centre for the horray henrys in their rollers.Nice one socalist ken.any bets dublin will follow as it always follows the "mainland"?

doctor evil

Don't like the plan at all. What if you need the car/van for your work?, such as if you are doing a job or transporting heavy tools. It looks like it could affect people more from the north side than the south side when driving into town.

spurious

If you need the car for work then presumably you will drive one of the alternate routes and not up/down O'Connell Street.

arse..biscuits

I've been spouting this idea for ages. I know so many people who drive into town every day from places like Templeogue and give out about the traffic, I tell them "You are the traffic". Alot of people wont even try public transport out of stubburnness. Ban the cars, put loads of buses on. The centre of Dublin will be a much nicer place too without all that traffic.

Jip

I'm can only assume that everyone here that is saying this is a great idea live in one of the few areas of Dublin that are on the Dart, Luas or decent bus lane stretching all the way from where they live into the city centre.
Until I can get into the city centre in less time on a bus than I currently do by car I'll continue driving every morning and evening. 40 minutes from door to O'Connell Street by car, just over an hour the same route by bus. No contest really.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Jip wrote: »

I'm can only assume that everyone here that is saying this is a great idea live in one of the few areas of Dublin that are on the Dart, Luas or decent bus lane stretching all the way from where they live into the city centre.
Until I can get into the city centre in less time on a bus than I currently do by car I'll continue driving every morning and evening. 40 minutes from door to O'Connell Street by car, just over an hour the same route by bus. No contest really.

Once again, someone has chosen to ignore the point about the extra busses being laid on.

Jay D

anyone know what the heck was happening round the phoenix pk yesterday?? ****ing joke for traffic so twas.

is_that_so

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Once again, someone has chosen to ignore the point about the extra busses being laid on.

I think the point here is not about the centre of the city, which I think is a good idea but a PR stunt at the same time, it's actually getting to the city itself. There are an awful lot of people who don't have a decent service and end up using the car.

Jip

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Once again, someone has chosen to ignore the point about the extra busses being laid on.

And someone here assumes that all buses throughout Dublin use the streets in question. Do you want a hint if my one does or not ? It doesn't and therefore will have no impact on me whatsoever.

They need to concentrate on getting the people into the city centre first in a time that's faster than private car and then they should think about the city centre itself. There's no point in having buses getting from Trinity to Parnell Square for example in 2 minutes if it then takes another hour to get somewhere like Dublin 15.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Jip wrote: »

And someone here assumes that all buses throughout Dublin use the streets in question. Do you want a hint if my one does or not ? It doesn't and therefore will have no impact on me whatsoever. [\QUOTE]

Neither does mine. But it gets me close and I'm not so lazy to mind a little walking.

They need to concentrate on getting the people into the city centre first in a time that's faster than private car and then they should think about the city centre itself. There's no point in having buses getting from Trinity to Parnell Square for example in 2 minutes if it then takes another hour to get somewhere like Dublin 15.

Catch 22 situation: it's the excessive pubilc transport that delays people from getting into the city quickly in the first place. How do you expect anyone to get you from A to B faster than private car without reducing the number of said cars in the first place...?

Jip

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Neither does mine. But it gets me close and I'm not so lazy to mind a little walking.

Stupid point, how will closing off these roads to private vehicles have any affect on your, or my ability to walk anywhere ? For the record when I use the bus I walk from Parnell Square to Grand Canal Dock both ways each day.

Your original snide comment about me missing the point of extra buses was blown out of the water as it will have no beneficial affect for huge porportion of the population.

Ikky Poo2 wrote:

Catch 22 situation: it's the excessive pubilc transport that delays people from getting into the city quickly in the first place. How do you expect anyone to get you from A to B faster than private car without reducing the number of said cars in the first place...?

I'm assuming you mean excessiv private transport.
Not really as there's no proper bus lane across large swathes of the city and the affects of the ones that are there are negated by some of the questionable routes some buses take. If I and many others leave our cars at home the bus sill still get caught in bottle necks around the city centre, coming onto O'Connell Street is a prime example considering there's already a an on private vehicles.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Jip wrote: »

Stupid point, how will closing off these roads to private vehicles have any affect on your, or my ability to walk anywhere ? For the record when I use the bus I walk from Parnell Square to Grand Canal Dock both ways each day.

Your original snide comment about me missing the point of extra buses was blown out of the water as it will have no beneficial affect for huge porportion of the population.



I'm assuming you mean excessiv private transport.
Not really as there's no proper bus lane across large swathes of the city and the affects of the ones that are there are negated by some of the questionable routes some buses take. If I and many others leave our cars at home the bus sill still get caught in bottle necks around the city centre, coming onto O'Connell Street is a prime example considering there's already a an on private vehicles.

If you and many others leve your cars at home, there'll be more space for the buses in the first place. In theory, anyway. Not sure about the o'connell st situation - I always though that was caused by drivers trying to negotaiate another route, rather than actually finding alternative means (open to correction here).

There is no getting around the fact: private vehicles are the problem here. You can't improve public transport until you solve that problem - how do you put more buses on before you take the cars out?

Jip

It's easy to put more buses on, there's still plenty of roadspace for them. How many quality bus corridors are out there that are anything bus quality and how many areas are ill served by buses outside of rush hour ? Take for example the one from the end of the M50 towards Clarehall, no buses use it apart from a handful of private operators. There's a fine one on a road between Cabra and Finglas that isn't even served by a bus route, who the hell planned that ? So every evening you have traffic backed over a thousand metres coming to a set of lights while an unused buslane is idle alongside it? Granted there's no sign with the hours of operation so alot of people ignore it but it still creates a backlog of traffic. There's so many ill planned bus lanes and routes around that private vehicles can't be blamed for most of the problems with traffic in the city centre, there's simply no alternative for many people.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Jip wrote: »

It's easy to put more buses on, there's still plenty of roadspace for them. How many quality bus corridors are out there that are anything bus quality and how many areas are ill served by buses outside of rush hour ? Take for example the one from the end of the M50 towards Clarehall, no buses use it apart from a handful of private operators. There's a fine one on a road between Cabra and Finglas that isn't even served by a bus route, who the hell planned that ? So every evening you have traffic backed over a thousand metres coming to a set of lights while an unused buslane is idle alongside it? Granted there's no sign with the hours of operation so alot of people ignore it but it still creates a backlog of traffic. There's so many ill planned bus lanes and routes around that private vehicles can't be blamed for most of the problems with traffic in the city centre, there's simply no alternative for many people.

Don't know the area you mentioned, I'm waaaay over the other side. Again, I'm open to correction here, but I though tthe problem on the northside was when they bottlenecked into the city centre, rather than the outer suburban areas, because of the amount of private cars?

Jip

Partly bottle necked because of private cars but alot down to poor planning of routes. For example I think it's the 39 that leaves from Ongar which is just near the N3, for years this bus done a tour of Dublin 15 which could take over 30 minutes just to get to the Blanchardstown Centre and surrounding areas on a busy day rather than the more direct route down the buslane on the N3 as far as Cabra. It was only recently that Dublin Bus announced some of the buses will now be taking the more direct route.
Another I know of is the 40D which for some reason takes a ridiculous loop of a business park when the lazy gits can walk 5 minutes out onto the main road and get it from there and then goes on another through parts of Finglas that are already well serviced by the other various 40 routes before joining the N2 buslane rather than join this buslane as soon as it gets to Finglas, there's no logic to many of the routes in the city.

Victor

Jip wrote: »

the lazy gits can walk 5 minutes out onto the main road

Not everyone can walk easily.

congo_90

lost marbles wrote: »

if it is for real and they do go ahead with it .simple way around it is, as everyone else in dublin is doing
buy a taxi plate

+1 *applies for plate*

humberklog wrote: »

transport and an idea I've had for a while is 'green parking'. Cars of a certain physical size and pollution out-put can only park in certain areas. An example is lay green tarmac down at all the street parking bays around Merrion sq.(for e.g)and only certain cars of a certain size can park there. This wouldn't just hold for new low-emission cars but also older,physically smaller cars. Reward the conscienscious.

no offence but thats b*llocks it would never work. Green cars aren't as 'green' as you would believe (not debating this).

What about all the people who commute from say meath, kildare etc. People who live in areas of poor public transport. yes they're gonna roll out 350 new buses but take a guess as to what routes. I think people who work in town should be given passes.

Jip

Victor wrote: »

Not everyone can walk easily.

So your solution isto put a bus stop outside everyones front door, afterall, as you say not everyone can walk easily so we must cater for all such circumstances.

zenno

frank fahey has got to be braindead and not living in the real world to think this will work. so the large sections of the capital will be closed off to all private traffic "except" td's and hundreads of civil servants that will have special exemptions allowing them to drive into the city centre. well thats a case of discrimination isn't it. well then it's about time we do something about it instead of taking it any more.
I don't care what sort of top government job they have. they should all have to get the bus or train to their job just like everyone else. unless they cant walk or have other disabilities thats another story.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

zenno wrote: »

frank fahey has got to be braindead and not living in the real world to think this will work. so the large sections of the capital will be closed off to all private traffic "except" td's and hundreads of civil servants that will have special exemptions allowing them to drive into the city centre. well thats a case of discrimination isn't it. well then it's about time we do something about it instead of taking it any more.
I don't care what sort of top government job they have. they should all have to get the bus or train to their job just like everyone else. unless they cant walk or have other disabilities thats another story.

Wow... do I detect a hint of jealousy? Or someone who, perrish the thought, might not be able to selfishly contribute to the traffic chaos any more...? The times the are a-changing!