Is the Top 14 better than the Guinness Premiership?

Peter B

Just like the previous ML vs GP poll a few weeks back, which is better?

The Top 14 vs the Guinness Premiership.

A lot of english teams go on how the Premiership is the worlds best league. Is it better than the Top 14 in France?

Stev_o

God this is a hard one to call on. The way i look at them is whats the quality like behind them ie Division 2. So in France we have top clubs like Agen, Touloun, Racing Metro all who are basically professionally and have their own stadiums now compare to National Division 2 in Engerland and they are miles apart, most of the clubs have no stadiums and its pretty much what you would see in the AIL.

As for the teams in GP and Top 14 well its close to say the least. On the one hand the English teams thrashed the Frenched teams in the Challenge Cup and its now a all England affair. Then in the HC we saw that it was pretty much 50/50.

toomevara

I really don't get to see enough french Top 14 action to make an informed decision. From personal observation of french teams playing in the Challenge and Heineken cup I'd have to say that there's a huge gulf in quality between the top Championnat teams and those lower down the rung, and they don't tend to do well in the challenge cup..but how much of that is down to french indifference to international club competition I don't know...

The ERC rankings paint an interesting picture...the top ten clubs comprise 4 french teams and 4 Engiish, remaining two Irish. Bottom 10 composed of 5 french teams and only two English...As to what tells us about the relative strengths of French club rugby vs English, I'm not sure....

Interestingly, and surprisingly (for me at least) the bottom 2 ERC ranked teams are french, being outdone by the so-called minnows of the Italian super-10....

john concannon

I would say the top 14 is just about better.

Zico

I'd say it's relative to the quality of the national teams at any given time, despite the number of imports in both leagues. To my mind France have had a better quality of squad to chose from in the last 4 years at least, so I would therefore consider the Top 14 to be a stronger competition.

Stev_o

Zico wrote: »

I'd say it's relative to the quality of the national teams at any given time, despite the number of imports in both leagues. To my mind France have had a better quality of squad to chose from in the last 4 years at least, so I would therefore consider the Top 14 to be a stronger competition.

Considering this

Games played: 90 14.78%
Games won by England: 48 53.33%
Games lost by England: 35 38.89%
Games drawn: 7 7.78%

Seems fairly even over on the years

13 Oct 2007 France 9 - 14 England
18 Aug 2007 France 22 - 9 England
11 Aug 2007 England 15 - 21 France
11 Mar 2007 England 26 - 18 France
12 Mar 2006 France 31 - 6 England
13 Feb 2005 England 17 - 18 France
27 Mar 2004 France 24 - 21 England
16 Nov 2003 England 24 - 7 France
06 Sep 2003 England 45 - 14 France
30 Aug 2003 France 17 - 16 England
15 Feb 2003 England 25 - 17 France
02 Mar 2002 France 20 - 15 England
07 Apr 2001 England 48 - 19 France
19 Feb 2000 France 9 - 15 England
20 Mar 1999 England 21 - 10 France

Shan75

I'd say there isn't a whole lot in it.If you look at the top clubs(which are mainly the ones we get to see) the quality of players and depth of squad would be similar.There are of course exceptions as in the case of Toulouse and possibly Clermont who, on paper on least, have better teams/squads than say Gloucester, Bath and Wasps.I wouldn't see much of the T14 teams from further down the league but if the Challenge cup is anything to go by you'd say their English counterparts are a little bit better.

Diamondmaker

Well based on the best measure you can get Id say.....head to heads, between the leagues its 8 all for this season!!

Stade Francais 37 - 17 Harlequins
Biarritz Olympique 22 - 21 Saracens
Bristol Rugby 17 - 0 Stade Francais
Bourgoin 7 - 31 Gloucester Rugby
ASM Clermont Auvergne 37 - 27 London Wasps
Leicester Tigers 14 - 9 Toulouse
London Irish 24 - 16 Perpignan
Gloucester Rugby 51 - 27 Bourgoin
Perpignan 23 - 6 London Irish
London Wasps 25 - 24 ASM Clermont Auvergne
Toulouse 22 - 11 Leicester Tigers
Stade Francais 19 - 11 Bristol Rugby
Saracens 45 - 16 Biarritz Olympique
Harlequins 10 - 31 Stade Francais
London Irish 20 - 9 Perpignan
London Irish 15 - 21 Toulouse

toomevara

Diamondmaker wrote: »

Well based on the best measure you can get Id say.....head to heads, between the leagues its 8 all for this season!!

Stade Francais 37 - 17 Harlequins
Biarritz Olympique 22 - 21 Saracens
Bristol Rugby 17 - 0 Stade Francais
Bourgoin 7 - 31 Gloucester Rugby
ASM Clermont Auvergne 37 - 27 London Wasps
Leicester Tigers 14 - 9 Toulouse
London Irish 24 - 16 Perpignan
Gloucester Rugby 51 - 27 Bourgoin
Perpignan 23 - 6 London Irish
London Wasps 25 - 24 ASM Clermont Auvergne
Toulouse 22 - 11 Leicester Tigers
Stade Francais 19 - 11 Bristol Rugby
Saracens 45 - 16 Biarritz Olympique
Harlequins 10 - 31 Stade Francais
London Irish 20 - 9 Perpignan
London Irish 15 - 21 Toulouse

End of discussion I guess, pretty conclusive post...i