whos best??

bright star

i want to get my fortune told, which is better? cards, palm, etc.
any numbers of anyone good in Dublin please let me know... also i would like to go and see a medium any advice?

Kelly O'Malley

IMO it's not so much the type of reading but the person doing the reading that gets the results.If someone is good it doesn't matter whether they read cards,palms,teacups or ink in a saucer,you'll get the result you're looking for.

Whispered

Kelly O'Malley wrote: »

IMO it's not so much the type of reading but the person doing the reading that gets the results.If someone is good it doesn't matter whether they read cards,palms,teacups or ink in a saucer,you'll get the result you're looking for.

+1

ghosthunter73

Yes I see it now it's coming in clearer now ....yes the fog is lifting....someone is going to ........take your money ......and give you false peace of mind. Keep your money, go out on town or treat yourself to something nice instead charity starts at home.:D

stevenmu

ghosthunter73 please read the forum charter and try to keep your posts within the spirit of the forum here

hiorta

In these matters, the ability and experience of the Medium or Healer is a major factor in the result, but another often-overlooked factor is the sitter.

Spiritual status always kicks in, and those kindly disposed to selflessly helping as they can, seem to gain more in return.

There are other factors always in play - need, karmic, motive and so on.

Basically, it is likely that the outcome is the right one for that individual at that time.
Whether or not it is welcome or desired doesn't really matter.

???

hiorta wrote: »

In these matters, the ability and experience of the Medium or Healer is a major factor in the result, but another often-overlooked factor is the sitter.

Spiritual status always kicks in, and those kindly disposed to selflessly helping as they can, seem to gain more in return.

There are other factors always in play - need, karmic, motive and so on.

Basically, it is likely that the outcome is the right one for that individual at that time.
Whether or not it is welcome or desired doesn't really matter.

So to sum up, what your saying is that if you tell the medium the answer they're are more likely to get it right?

Kelly O'Malley

??? wrote: »

So to sum up, what your saying is that if you tell the medium the answer they're are more likely to get it right?

Well it does make it easier for the reader to be given the answer along with the question:D:D:D but that's not a fair summation.

IF the reader is a good one they will be able to give the answers that are needed.

Sad though it is, there are plenty of charlatans out there preying on the gullible - I was at a psychic fair last summer, not reading just looking, and of the 12 readers in the room only two were genuine.It was easy to tell them apart from the glib moneymakers.

Looks as if ??? has run across those sort of readers - or is it just an innate cynicism???

I'd never buy another used car if I were THAT bitter...:D:D;)

PS Anyone want a 'well used' Rover?Very low mileage,the engine seized after just 600 miles and the gearbox started making strange noises after just 200 miles but it's a very pretty car - only a few marks on the leather seats from my tears...

???

Nope just have a very good knowledge of cold reading and use it regularly (never to deceive in a psychic context). No matter what you say about 'psychically receptive states' and the like it all comes down to telling the person without knowing your telling them. Barnam statements and good chance guesses can only get you so far.

Out of interest what set the two who weren't charlatons appart?

Kelly O'Malley

Out of interest what set the two who weren't charlatons apart?[/quote]

1] No 'stage dressing' - shawls,mystical symbols,hoop earrings etc
2]No deep penetrating staring at the client to gauge reactions
3]What they were saying,ie less questions,less vague generalities that could be taken to mean anything.

???

But why does that make them psychic? Surely the logical assumption is they're just better charlatons?

Kelly O'Malley

Why is that the 'logical assumption'?

As a reader myself I know it works as a medium (unintentional pun)

In a real reading things come out that can not be faked.Highly specific things (people's names,situations that can't be 'cold read') When you listen to a good reader (eavesdrop to be brutally honest - I don't allow others to sit in on my readings as too much comes out that is so highly personal to the client I'M embarressed to hear it!) you can spot the specifics that he/she could not have come up with any other way than through the medium of the reading.

Oryx

I agree with Kelly. You know the difference when you've had both types of reading, or if you give readings. The real thing has the wow factor, where the sitter wonders how in the hell the reader knew the information that comes up. It very specific stuff, not random waffle.

Kelly O'Malley

SPECIFIC is the operative word.

???

Kelly O'Malley wrote: »

Why is that the 'logical assumption'?

Now surely if you see a wall thrown together badly you think bad builder and if the wall is put together very well you think good builder not magic. This is the same situation, the logical follow up to bad coldreading is... good coldreading, not magic.

Specific information is easy enough to fake. First one into my head:

"Kelly, I'm getting a name coming to me... Dave? David? I think. I feel it's maybe from a social setting more so than a work one. I feel that you don't see him as much as you'd like to but sometimes these things just happen"

Did I hit? Please be honest!

That wasn't 'random waffle' but a good chance guess!

Oryx

??? wrote: »

Now surely if you see a wall thrown together badly you think bad builder and if the wall is put together very well you think good builder not magic. This is the same situation, the logical follow up to bad coldreading is... good coldreading, not magic.

Specific information is easy enough to fake. First one into my head:

"Kelly, I'm getting a name coming to me... Dave? David? I think. I feel it's maybe from a social setting more so than a work one. I feel that you don't see him as much as you'd like to but sometimes these things just happen"

Did I hit? Please be honest!

That wasn't 'random waffle' but a good chance guess!

Actually, ??? that was random waffle with a name thrown in. You'll have to do better.:) And yes, some readings may come across that way, but you would have to work a lot harder to impress if you were giving information like that. I dont disagree that it can be done by cold reading, and a good reader needs to get past any perception of that, to something a lot more rigid and specific.

Whispered

??? wrote: »

"Kelly, I'm getting a name coming to me... Dave? David? I think. I feel it's maybe from a social setting more so than a work one. I feel that you don't see him as much as you'd like to but sometimes these things just happen"

Did I hit? Please be honest!

That wasn't 'random waffle' but a good chance guess!

OMG thats not Kelly, you're reading for!! It's me - wow you're amazing please tell me more

People can cold read, thats very true. But you can't tar everyone with the same brush. I personally know two very talented card readers who would not even have heard the term cold reading. Also neither of them do it for money - please tell me why if they are all charlatans would these two people not charge for their skill - whether the skill is genuine or as you believe cold reading?

hiorta

""Originally Posted by ???

So to sum up, what your saying is that if you tell the medium the answer they're are more likely to get it right?""

Please show me where I said that?

A Natural Law is that you can only receive as you have given. This applies especially to Spiritual matters.

Now, if you want to discuss genuine / fake/ inexperienced Mediums, then that is another discussion. Remember another Natural Law - 'you will attract what you are'.

???

hiorta wrote: »

""Originally Posted by ???

So to sum up, what your saying is that if you tell the medium the answer they're are more likely to get it right?""

Please show me where I said that?

The post I quoted says quite clearly that if the sitter "selflessly helps" you get a better reading.

A Natural Law is that you can only receive as you have given. This applies especially to Spiritual matters.

Now, if you want to discuss genuine / fake/ inexperienced Mediums, then that is another discussion. Remember another Natural Law - 'you will attract what you are'.

Sorry what the hell are you talking about? Natural Laws? Gravity is a natural law. "you can only receive as you have given" is mubo jumbo.

helena.ryan wrote: »

OMG thats not Kelly, you're reading for!! It's me - wow you're amazing please tell me more

People can cold read, thats very true. But you can't tar everyone with the same brush. I personally know two very talented card readers who would not even have heard the term cold reading. Also neither of them do it for money - please tell me why if they are all charlatans would these two people not charge for their skill - whether the skill is genuine or as you believe cold reading?

They are true believers. A lot of people believe and use tarot cards and the like on themselves. They're not charlatons, they just believe the stuff. I am focusing on the people who take money.

KtK wrote: »

Actually, ??? that was random waffle with a name thrown in. You'll have to do better.:) And yes, some readings may come across that way, but you would have to work a lot harder to impress if you were giving information like that. I dont disagree that it can be done by cold reading, and a good reader needs to get past any perception of that, to something a lot more rigid and specific.

I'll admit it is a single piece of information given entirely out of context. If however you were being read and the 'psychic' was giving numerous statements like this you would not jump on it as viciously.

Kelly O'Malley

So you think it's not ok to (sometimes) charge for a reading?

I'd be unable to continue with reading if I didn't get paid - at least some of the time.

It's hard work and time consuming!

???

I think to read someone while claiming to use Psychic Powers for anyother purpose than novelty is unethical. I have no major problem with people who provide readings for people who are just going 'for the craic' but if anyone is genuinly looking for advice and a psychic provides it, it is immoral. This is especially clear where surgeries and the like are concerned. Asking a psychic should you get chemotherapy or try some diet and the psychic answering is just sick. The psychic should direct them straight to a doctor.

Now it is still unethical for a psychic to do that for free but it is okay for a psychic to charge for novelty readings. However, most psychics doing it for free are just doing it for fun.

Whispered

Kelly, was the q about not charging aimed at me or ???

If it was at me then to answer I would say that if you make your living from it then by all means charge - the people I'm talking about don't do this as a business so don't see fit to charge, but I'm sure if that was their "job" then they would. I sometimes charge for my services, and sometimes I don't, it really depends on the situation. I totally get what you are saying about hard work - people seem to think you walk in, shuffle the cards, read the cards and thats it. Most people know nothing of the hours of meditation, years of learning etc.

Kelly, can you PM me with where you are based and a bit about what type of readings you do please?

Whispered

??? wrote: »

. This is especially clear where surgeries and the like are concerned. Asking a psychic should you get chemotherapy or try some diet and the psychic answering is just sick. The psychic should direct them straight to a doctor.

This has been discussed a lot here and in the spirituality forum. Any psychic, healer, shaman etc who has any morals what so ever will NOT answer a question like that.

Oryx

??? wrote: »

I think to read someone while claiming to use Psychic Powers for anyother purpose than novelty is unethical. I have no major problem with people who provide readings for people who are just going 'for the craic' but if anyone is genuinly looking for advice and a psychic provides it, it is immoral. This is especially clear where surgeries and the like are concerned. Asking a psychic should you get chemotherapy or try some diet and the psychic answering is just sick. The psychic should direct them straight to a doctor.

Now it is still unethical for a psychic to do that for free but it is okay for a psychic to charge for novelty readings. However, most psychics doing it for free are just doing it for fun.

Some of the things you say illustrate a lack of knowledge about the ethical readers that are out there, and your assumption that readers are only interested in money and dont have the best interests of the client at heart. Yes, there are readers with morals, who would immediately direct a client to a doctor, if it was required. As has been said earlier, just because there are charlatans and chancers out there, dont assume all readers behave that way.

Kelly O'Malley

helena.ryan wrote: »

This has been discussed a lot here and in the spirituality forum. Any psychic, healer, shaman etc who has any morals what so ever will NOT answer a question like that.

+ 1000000 !

Aimed at ??? Helena.

mattfender

Had a Tarot Card reading in town the other day...lets just say I hope she's right and not a moneygrabber cos my future..its lookin good:D

???

KtK wrote: »

Some of the things you say illustrate a lack of knowledge about the ethical readers that are out there, and your assumption that readers are only interested in money and dont have the best interests of the client at heart. Yes, there are readers with morals, who would immediately direct a client to a doctor, if it was required. As has been said earlier, just because there are charlatans and chancers out there, dont assume all readers behave that way.

That was merely an example. It holds through from career to family advice as well. A psychic reading should be a novelty and should not be presented as the cards/stars/goat poo telling you what to do.

mattfender wrote: »

Had a Tarot Card reading in town the other day...lets just say I hope she's right and not a moneygrabber cos my future..its lookin good:D

I hate to burst your bubble mate (and if past experience serves me well I doubt I will) but surely it is just makes sense from a business point of view. Your more likely to come back if they comforted you. Also people are more willing to acept good news than bad. Telling someone they'll come into money is much easier to accept than telling them their dog will be hit by a bus!!!

hiorta wrote: »

""Originally Posted by ???

A Natural Law is that you can only receive as you have given. This applies especially to Spiritual matters.

Now, if you want to discuss genuine / fake/ inexperienced Mediums, then that is another discussion. Remember another Natural Law - 'you will attract what you are'.

Can someone please explain what the hell he's talking about! Is this a fringe fringe belief or generally accepted. I've just never heard it.

Also before the next round of sceptic bashing can someone also explain why the logical assumption is bad coldreader to psychic rather than bad coldreader to good coldreader. Cheers!


Further also... I am willing to receive psychic readings as well as they're cheap or preferably free from your reccommended psychics so that I will have first hand experience and can't be accused of being cynical and closed minded.

stevenmu

??? please read the forum charter and try to keep your posts within the spirit of the forum here.

Havermeyer

IMO it's not so much the type of reading but the person doing the reading that gets the results.If someone is good it doesn't matter whether they read cards,palms,teacups or ink in a saucer,you'll get the result you're looking for.

And where does the proof that one person is better than the other come from? I wouldn't waste my money OP. Put it towards something worthwhile like a holiday or a deposit on a house, if you haven't already got one.

???

Anyone gonna respond to me?

DANNY22XX