Air Tightness testing

topcatcbr

Hi all I have a few questions about Air Tightness Testing

1) Who is qualified to do this. (is it like ber that a registered course is required)
I note that chevron are running a course

"All new single dwellings will require an air pressure test from 1st July 2008*

There is a substantial lack of air pressure testing consultants in Ireland

Many commercial buildings require an Air Pressure Test to ensure fire safety

The average fee for an Air Pressure Test is €700

Air Pressure Tests can be used to improve energy efficiency of existing buildings

Air Leakage Testing helps identify areas of a building experiencing heat loss

Air Leakage Tests help minimize energy usage in a house.

50,000 houses will be built in Ireland in 2008, with an increase expected in 2009**

Air Leakage Testing plays a vital role in building an A-Rated house

When we say our courses are available to you nationwide, we mean nationwide

We are the largest AIR Pressure Testing Training Company in Ireland

We don't compete with our students - we train them to carry out the tests

Our information lines are open Monday - Sunday from 9.00am - 9.00pm

Get the most comprehensive AIR Pressure Test Training course at a cost of just €1495"

from chevron site

2) How much is the equipment required

3) where can it be bought

4) what is the likleyhood that this will be anymore sucessfull than BER
I dont want to throw more money away on training for this

Help

holdfast

See part L to see how manny test are required. This will give you the exact amount to be test. NB read the bit about small builders and how manny times they need to test. it is not as many as the ad makes out

1 door blower = 7000 euro will test up to 14000m3. take a two storey house has a an air exchange rate of 10 (14000/10=1400m3) area of house 280m2 and internal height 5m vol = 1400m3. thus one fan will be able to just test this house and burn out your fan. more leaky and bigger the house the more fans you need. I would say you want 2 a least to be covered.
total = 14000

jenny to run the fans = 250 euros
anmometer = 350 euros
puffer (not smoke stick, waste of time) 700euros
tape etc = 300 euros (repeat cost)
infra camera 15000 euros for a camera that will cover all bases. anything less than that will be poor resolutions and have a poor detector. Can be used on it own as another service. course for that 1500 euro ( works very well with fan and can show the client the picture so thumbs up well worth. will speed up survey to find faults.)

cannot test all year round as you can only test up to a wind speed of 6m/s
ir camera does not work in summer (unless you go out at night/early morning it requires temp difference)

there is another gang that do the course for 1050 and sell the gear.

topcatcbr

holdfast wrote: »

See part L to see how manny test are required. This will give you the exact amount to be test. NB read the bit about small builders and how manny times they need to test. it is not as many as the ad makes out

tgd part L wrote:

1.5.4.7 For small developments comprising no
more than three dwelling units, specific pressure
testing of these dwellings would not be necessary if it
can be demonstrated with air pressure test reports
that, during the preceding 12 month period, a
dwelling of the same dwelling type constructed by
the same builder had been pressure tested according
to the procedures given in this sub-section and had
satisfied the criterion set in Paragraph 1.3.4.3.
However, if the assumed air change rate in the
calculation of the EPC and CPC using the DEAP
methodology is less than the criterion set in
Paragraph 1.3.4.3, a pressure test to verify this
assumed value should be carried out. The guidance
given in this sub-section would apply in this situation.

I assume this is what you are referring to. This does not exclude one off house designs only builders building from set plan types on small developments (less than 3) where a dwelling of the same plan and construction type has already been tested.
(or have i read this wrong it wouldnt be the first time)

topcatcbr

bump

energyconsult

I have checked the web and there are several air pressure training courses available - so competition is good for the providers !

championc

When testing Air Tightness, do you have to have chimneys and room air vents blocked up and if so, would this be for the test or permanently ?


C

topcatcbr

championc wrote: »

When testing Air Tightness, do you have to have chimneys and room air vents blocked up and if so, would this be for the test or permanently ?


C

I dont know im hoping that someone who has done this will respond

sas

I'm not a construction professional but my understanding of airtightness testing is that it aims to identify unplanned\unknown weaknesses in the envelope.

So you cover the wall vents for the test. You uncover after the test because they are planned and required for the proper ventilation of the house.

Not so sure on the chimney. An open fire is a very significant whole in the building envelope. I believe that if you have an open fire I wouldn't bother with the airtightness test. However, if you are going to use a room sealed stove with a dedicated external air supply then I do believe that the chimney could be sealed for the blower test. This is on the assumption that the stove isn't fitted at the time of the test. The air supply pipe to the stove would also need to be sealed for the test too of course under these circumstances.

save energy

Top Cat,

I'm an Air tighness technician. I did a level 1 accreditation course with the Irish agents for Retrotec Blower door systems, I'm due to do the Level 2 exam at the end of this month. All air tests I do are reviewed by the Infrared Institute as I require peer review for my PI insurance. Registration with BINDT in the UK cost a grand to register and 500 per year, there is a probationery period of 3 months and a restricted period of 9 months afterwards. The NSAI is considering a FETAC course for Ireland as an alternative to BINDT. Calibration of equipment is critical in building physics. this costs money. Evaluation, accreditation and exam Courses cost over a grand a pop. Blower equipment can cost €7k, weather and moisture testing equip, laser measure, dustproof laptop can be another 2k, Thermal imaging camera, smokers, endoscopic camera, can cost a further 30k-40k. Cameras for €15K are not good enough for building investigations.

The Building regs call for 'competent persons' to undertake air tests using Attma TS1 or EN-13829. Attma TS-1 is merely a procedure for measuring envelopes. EN-13829 method B is used to prepare the building for test. (method A is to test a building in use). Open fires are cleaned out and sealed. room sealed stoves should be out of use with vents sealed. Vents in heated rooms sealed. Water traps filled. Raised timber floor vents should be closed only if the void space is counted as part of the heated space. Only services penetrations should be permanently sealed, by builder not by tester. (unsealed pipe openings not services access panels).

To date House of Tomorrow houses have required air testing. Generally approx a third to half the units are tested in small schemes. Auditing existing houses is useless without performing +- pressure tests. Air leakage can amount to on average €300-400 per annum in heating costs for a 80's build when comfort levels of 18 degrees bedrooms 21 degrees living areas are applied. The best time to air test when your client is the builder is after first fix electrical, when problems can be rectified without damaging fittings and finishes.

An air test for a one off takes about 2 hours to measure and test. Put in travel say 2 hours, report writing and sending it for validation add another 2 hours. With the above capital costs you'll find that without economies of scale the payback is quite a few years. Companies would really need an exposure to testing commercial buildings such as air con systems and clean rooms to be viable enterprises. This requires multiple fans and a more complex methodology for testing. Like building energy rating, air tighness testing is no licence to print money. I could do without Pre dawn site visits and Hardass builders who don't like being told they can't build, but when you start to build up a database of info it can be very interesting. At that stage its not the air leakage that becomes the biggest building defect but the fabric and vent systems ability to handle moisture and condensation.

Hope this helps, if you want any further info, you can PM me.

championc

You can't get any more comprehensive an answer than that. Well done.

I have a 3-bed semi from early 1970's. It is obvious that I need to reduce or eliminate any silly gaps as it's clear that they all add up. I know I have simple gaps like where the radiator pipes feed down through the floorboards (a 70's house so floorboards downstairs). So I guess a can of expanding foam is first on the shopping list.

However, is there some form of smoke in a spray can that I could spray around windows, skirting boards etc. etc to see where my draughts are coming from ?


C

save energy

First Deal with the rising air, super-insulate the attic and deal with the trapdoor. Blower test replicates storm pressures in both negative and positive pressures, wait until there is a gale force 8 outside and check the leaks with a cigarette or else buy chemical smoke from Reg Farrel engineering off the Naas Road.

RKQ

Air tightness course in Switzerland, two day course cira €300 including flights and accommodation. Lots of Timber frame manufacturers in Ireland have done this course!
Booked out till October... PM for contact details!

save energy

A few clarifications on my earlier post.

I have a company which performs building investigations/audits, air tighness data is just one of about 50 inputs into a building modelling software package which makes assumptions similar to DEAP. The data is used to profile a stock of buildings, such as local authority estates. I use a high capacity fan which will test up to 3,000m2 floor area.

The air tightness testing accreditation course has a practical exam on day 3, the level 1 and 2 courses are for infrared thermography. I see both couses as two sides of the same coin.

No6

RKQ wrote: »

Air tightness course in Switzerland, two day course cira €300 including flights and accommodation. Lots of Timber frame manufacturers in Ireland have done this course!
Booked out till October... PM for contact details!

I'm booked for December, no point going to Switzerland unless there's some snow!!! PM me too and I'll send you the brochure & contact details!! Its only 230 RKQ + 1000 for drink ( personally I'm doing some liquid tightness & stability testing too!!!):D

topcatcbr

No6 wrote: »

I'm booked for December, no point going to Switzerland unless there's some snow!!! PM me too and I'll send you the brochure & contact details!! Its only 230 RKQ + 1000 for drink ( personally I'm doing some liquid tightness & stability testing too!!!):D

Mind if i tag along

No6

No bother topcatcbr, pm me your email and I'll send you the brochure

RKQ

I always hoped that a good forum would allow us to communicate and swap ideas, information and news.

I'm glad you found it useful and sure maybe I'll go myself!
Its a great price considering the cost of a course in Ireland.:)

mickdw

championc wrote: »

So I guess a can of expanding foam is first on the shopping list.

C

expanding foam from my experience doesnt stop air flow. I worked on some large building projects where pressure testing was required as part of the fire safety aspect of the design. Days were spent sealing gaps with expanding / fire foam only for smoke tests to reveal no improvement. When redone with silicone type materials, major improvements were made.

No6

Hi all just to make sure there is no confusion the SIGA air tightness training in switzerland does not train you to use a blower door (as far as I know anyways) it teaches you how to improve airtightness (using SIGA products of course!!) in a building. If you want a free airtightness test try reg farrell engineering, only drawback is you have to buy the blower door set from them to get it at about 5000.

Anyone for skiing!!

sinnerboy

mickdw wrote: »

expanding foam from my experience doesnt stop air flow. I worked on some large building projects where pressure testing was required as part of the fire safety aspect of the design. Days were spent sealing gaps with expanding / fire foam only for smoke tests to reveal no improvement. When redone with silicone type materials, major improvements were made.

expanding foam is great for sealing to hard fabrics - waste pipe pentetration of blockwork wall for example

in light industrial buildings its make things worse - suppose you have a pressed metal flasing with a 300mm strip requiring to be sealed - so you inject expanding foam in there . return 1 hour later to find - 2 x 300mm strips either side of your "seal" !


.

topcatcbr

Still worth the money

holdfast

beware of all you read in those ads from chevron. estimated cost of test 800 euros i would like to meet anyone that is getting half of that.

RKQ

Maybe I'm missing something.

Air-tightness is welcomed but it is not the Holy Grail or some huge secrete.
It follows very sensible rules of taping and sealing, prior to slabbing / plastering.

Why won't SEI recognise Courses?

A manufacturer is offer a course in Switzerland for €300 inc flights and accommodation! They know what they are talking about as they have been doing it for years! No rip off fee

Most of the Timberframe Companies have done the course in Switzerland.

I had airtight membrane installed in 2002. I'm no expert but the principles are simple to understand.

The equipment for the blow door test is expensive but thats not the point.
Air tightness is a process not a "snobbery" certificate. What am I missing?

Its like a whole industry has grown up to provide expensive courses to follow/ teach very simple process/principle.

SEI and the EPA shouldn't make money out of their expertise. They should be their to protect the public.

Chimpster

Lads, there are 2 distinct disiplines being discussed here.

1. Air Tightness Detailing :

This where consultacy companies give advice on getting the building air tight. Siga would specialise in this but they are not independent as they supply the membranes tapes etc. As you RKQ, there is no hidden secret here, alot of it is common sense and its a culture change thats needed on site more than anything. This culture change will take time.

2. Air Tightness Testing :

This is the actual practice of doing the provisional and final air tightness testing. You need proper training for this. This training should cover the equipment, the methodology for testing and the preperation for testing. I attended a 2 day intensive course on this and I was still not totally happy that I had eveything covered. There was a steep learning curve on the first few jobs but we used a dutch consultancy company to help us along the way.

As for price of tests, well chevrons €800 is well off the mark.

The costs are quite high in this business as you need a dealth of accessories to do a test properly, anometers, thermocouples, smoke pencils, grill mask, the list goes on. Then you may need to consider getting a 3 fans kit to do small commercial buildings, another 30K.

NSAI will be introducing a standard for air tightness testing and rightly so. There is a right and wrong way of doing it. Its also important that equipment is calibrated and certified over time.

topcatcbr

RKQ wrote: »

Maybe I'm missing something.

Air-tightness is welcomed but it is not the Holy Grail or some huge secrete.
It follows very sensible rules of taping and sealing, prior to slabbing / plastering.

Why won't SEI recognise Courses?

A manufacturer is offer a course in Switzerland for €300 inc flights and accommodation! They know what they are talking about as they have been doing it for years! No rip off fee

Most of the Timberframe Companies have done the course in Switzerland.

I had airtight membrane installed in 2002. I'm no expert but the principles are simple to understand.

The equipment for the blow door test is expensive but thats not the point.
Air tightness is a process not a "snobbery" certificate. What am I missing?

Its like a whole industry has grown up to provide expensive courses to follow/ teach very simple process/principle.

SEI and the EPA shouldn't make money out of their expertise. They should be their to protect the public.

This course is now being offered in mountrath co laois for €50 including lunch

No6

topcatcbr wrote: »

This course is now being offered in mountrath co laois for €50 including lunch

No offence to Laois but Switzerland is a bit nicer!!

topcatcbr

No6 wrote: »

No offence to Laois but Switzerland is a bit nicer!!

Id rather go to Switzerland but the convenience of doing it so close will swing it for me.

jamesoshea1

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they do an airtightness test for <snip> they also seal leaks as well as part of the service

sinnerboy

Please don't grave dig and spam . Thread locked