Steve Collins, how good was he?

buck65

Stevo definitely beat most of what was put in front of him, Benn, Eubank twice each, but how good was he.
Tough no doubt but awkward looking.
Opinions?

c1979

he was good rough and ready fighter with a superb chin.

Funny I remember he used to try and call out Roy Jones Jr. who beat his own conquerer in Reggie Johnson (Collins lost by MD), he wouldn't have had a chance against Jones, I admire him pity about his recent peronal troubles

death1234567

Decent fighter but never one of the worlds elite at any stage of his career. Didn't really have the techincal skills required to be a top fighter

joker77

Steve Collins was one of our best - his record speaks for itself

I remember his calling out Roy Jones Jr - I would have loved to have seen this fight, I think Steve probably wouldn't have got the decision but I think it would have been a lot closer than people give it credit for. He was never knocked down once in his career!

Some interesting articles recently here and here on Eastside Boxing

The Artist

I enjoyed every minute of Steve Collins in his fighting days.Im glad he beat Eubank(never liked eubank) his style and toughness in the ring was unbeliveable.I admired his courage and skills and i rated him the best boxer in that era.Just wondred did Steve Collins get into the hall of fame?:)

buck65

Benn really seemed washed up and mentally shot in his 2 fights, seemed always to be looking for an excuse to quit. Can't say I blame him after the Mc Clellan fight.

menoscemo

joker77 wrote: »

Steve Collins was one of our best
He was never knocked down once in his career!

davey180 wrote: »

I enjoyed every minute of Steve Collins in his fighting days.Im glad he beat Eubank(never liked eubank) his style and toughness in the ring was unbeliveable.I admired his courage and skills and i rated him the best boxer in that era.Just wondred did Steve Collins get into the hall of fame?:)

Did you never see the first Eubank Fight? Eubank had him flat on his arse in the 10th and when he was up he was on serious queer st. A pre watson Eubank would have knocked him out without a shadow of a doubt IMO.

People really have selective memories or just roamnticise the past, I dunno.

buck65

Actually Eubank had him down in rd 1 in their fight and Collins hopped up shouting "No knockdown" and the ref just looked at him and said fight on!!
Classic

The Artist

menoscemo wrote: »

Did you never see the first Eubank Fight? Eubank had him flat on his arse in the 10th and when he was up he was on serious queer st. A pre watson Eubank would have knocked him out without a shadow of a doubt IMO.

People really have selective memories or just roamnticise the past, I dunno.

yes i know that eubank put collins down on the 10th,At least collins got up and continue and beat eubank.Why didnt eubank try to knock him down again then?Nah coliins was to tough for that!:cool:

cowzerp

To put it into context, i believe Calzaghe is a poor mans Collins, collins was scrappy like Calzaghe but had decent technique with his scrappy style, nobody wanted to fight steve till the end of his career either as he was considered so tough and not worth the risk, Collins in my opinion would of beat calzaghe if they had of fought by matching his work rate but landing more clean punches and would never be at risk of getting stopped, and give a top RJJ a very hard time too..

AMIIAM

It was Tony Quinn who really put Eubanks on the canvas. IE. (self belief)

The Artist

cowzerp wrote: »

To put it into context, i believe Calzaghe is a poor mans Collins, collins was scrappy like Calzaghe but had decent technique with his scrappy style, nobody wanted to fight steve till the end of his career either as he was considered so tough and not worth the risk, Collins in my opinion would of beat calzaghe if they had of fought by matching his work rate but landing more clean punches and would never be at risk of getting stopped, and give a top RJJ a very hard time too..

+1

alanceltic

he really did live up to his alias "celtic warrior" he wasnt the best technically but he sure made up for it with heart and effort, its just a big pity that he couldnt fill the boots as a role model for younger kids in the sport....he always gave full value for money and i have special memories of the eubank fights, one of the few times we had a world champ to shout about

pjbrady1

Personally I think Calzaghe would have beaten Collins on points. Calzaghe is rarely troubled by boxers who lack handspeed. I thought that is what let Kessler down in the finish. Calzaghe has handspeed and a long distance runners type build. When the other guys is all punched out, Calzaghe races home to a decision in the last five rounds. He also keeps pressurising to prevent his opponent resting up. Also if he spots a weakness he has shown the ability to pick up on that during the fight. He did this to Lacy constantly barging into him leading with his shoulder and then ducking slightly letting Lacy's "bombs" crash into thin air. You have to admit Collins lacked handspeed. He was also not a big big puncher. Mediocre handspeed, average power, great chin, Calzaghe by three points.
There is one other point about Calzaghe, he actually must possess good wrestling strength, as he pretty much held his own against the very muscular Lacy, even early on in the fight. So you won't beat him trying to crowd him and frustrate him.
Finally for the ultra crazy out there, buy a copy of Calzaghe - Lacy and slow it down to quarter pace. Tis gas to watch him let the other man move and then punch while his opponent is ever so slightly off balance. What I mean is you can see him punching while both of the other guys feet are off the ground.
Of course I think Roy Jones would have taken care of Calzaghe.

joepenguin

To his credit Collins beat Eubank and benn twice.
Only lost 3 times:
once for the European title, and twice for world honours against Johnson and McAllum.
Called out RJJ: a fighter eubank openly admits to have avoided
Reigned as WBO world champion for 3 years... A prestigious title as it was hotly contested this part of the world and many of the fights very memorable


However if the glass is half empty:
eubank and Benns best days were behind them when Collins beat them.
Collins fell short when challenging for world titles in the states.
Challenged for the European title with no success.
Wasn't a big enough draw to share a ring with RJJ.
Retired instead of fighting Calzaghe.


I think he was a very good fighter. Would have lost to Jones but gave other top fighters a hard nights work at worst.

megadodge

I have a very high opinion of Collins as a boxer and get slightly annoyed when I hear people trying to put him down.

The whole "Eubank was past his best" argument is complete rubbish. Eubank was undefeated when Collins fought him. His previous defense against Henry Wharton was regarded by many at the time as possibly his best ever 'boxing' performance.

Quite simply Collins had the perfect style to defeat Eubank and the first bet I ever put on in a bookies was that fight as none of my betting friends believed me when I told them that Collins would win on points due to his style (great chin and very busy vs Eubank's tendency to pose and coast for 2/3s of any given round).

The same couldn't exactly be said of Benn as he definitely was past his best, but I maintain that Collins would always have beaten him because again his chin could take anything Benn would throw and he would simply outwork him and also have enough pop to hurt the always slightly vulnerable Benn.

When Collins faced the excellent Mike mcCallum for a world title he only had 16 fights !! He gave McCallum such a tough fight that when Mike was asked if the Watson fight (McCallum won by KO11 in a tough battle) was his toughest ever he replied with "no, that man over there gave me my hardest fight" pointing at Collins !

His loss to Reggie Johnson was a very close disputed decision against a very slick, fast skilful opponent who went on years later to win a title at light heavy.

I don't think Collins would have beaten Roy Jones and it wouldn't have been close, but he would have gone the distance.

I don't think he would have beaten Calzaghe either. His normal tactic of outworking his opponent would have been matched and then some. The serious gulf in speed and Calzaghe's better punch variety would have seen a straightforward points victory for the Welshman.

He was never knocked down once in his career!

From what I remember he was down 3 times (Watts, Eubank and Cummings) although never in massive trouble.

akindoc

megadodge wrote: »

I have a very high opinion of Collins as a boxer and get slightly annoyed when I hear people trying to put him down.

The whole "Eubank was past his best" argument is complete rubbish. Eubank was undefeated when Collins fought him. His previous defense against Henry Wharton was regarded by many at the time as possibly his best ever 'boxing' performance.

Quite simply Collins had the perfect style to defeat Eubank and the first bet I ever put on in a bookies was that fight as none of my betting friends believed me when I told them that Collins would win on points due to his style (great chin and very busy vs Eubank's tendency to pose and coast for 2/3s of any given round).

The same couldn't exactly be said of Benn as he definitely was past his best, but I maintain that Collins would always have beaten him because again his chin could take anything Benn would throw and he would simply outwork him and also have enough pop to hurt the always slightly vulnerable Benn.

When Collins faced the excellent Mike mcCallum for a world title he only had 16 fights !! He gave McCallum such a tough fight that when Mike was asked if the Watson fight (McCallum won by KO11 in a tough battle) was his toughest ever he replied with "no, that man over there gave me my hardest fight" pointing at Collins !

His loss to Reggie Johnson was a very close disputed decision against a very slick, fast skilful opponent who went on years later to win a title at light heavy.

I don't think Collins would have beaten Roy Jones and it wouldn't have been close, but he would have gone the distance.

I don't think he would have beaten Calzaghe either. His normal tactic of outworking his opponent would have been matched and then some. The serious gulf in speed and Calzaghe's better punch variety would have seen a straightforward points victory for the Welshman.



From what I remember he was down 3 times (Watts, Eubank and Cummings) although never in massive trouble.

I think RJJ would have beaten him handily. He wouldn't have stopped him, but if he wanted to he would have. RJJ at that time was just more interested in beating opponents, not spectacularly KOing them.

As regards Eubank, Eubank was certainly on the slide IMO. You could tell by that performance and his subsequent performances. Eubank that fought Benn 1, would have cleaned Collins out IMO.

Collins was lucky to come along at the time he did. A few years earlier and he wouldn't have won those fights he did.

Calzaghe would have beaten him too if that fight had been made.

BJJDUB

akindoc wrote: »

I think RJJ would have beaten him handily. He wouldn't have stopped him, but if he wanted to he would have. RJJ at that time was just more interested in beating opponents, not spectacularly KOing them.

Lets not forget Steve had the belt and RJJ wouldn't take Steve on!!

joepenguin

Collins didnt have THE belt at the time, but there was alot of great fights for that belt at the time. Jones had the IBF at the same time Collins had the WBO. Fair play to him for calling Jones out though.
maybe someone can tell us who the linear champ was at the time?
I doubt Collins dodged Calzaghe as such, i do think Joe would have won though.

HollowMan

I admire him pity about his recent peronal troubles

Can you expand on this?

mccaffertyt

does anyone know what songs steve used for his entrances

eagle eye

I write this from memory no stats but if I am right Steve Collins has three losses over his career.
The first one was to Mark McCallum who beat him over the distance and stated after the fight that he would never fight him again as it was the hardest fight he had in his career.
I remember the Reggie Johnson fight and I personally think he won that one but I would not disagree with a draw as it was a really close fight but he did not deserve to lose that fight.
Then there was the robbery in Italy when Salambay Kalambay or some name like that got a decision over him which was daylight robbery, it was for the european title I think.

I have no doubt that Collins would have went the distance with Roy Jones jnr. but I don't think he would have beaten him although Jones liked to bully opponents and he would not have been able to fight like that against Collins.
I think he is the greatest Irish boxer ever, well at least that I have seen. I cannot comment on the guys from 50/60 years ago as I have never seen them fight.

Big Ears

eagle eye wrote: »

I write this from memory no stats but if I am right Steve Collins has three losses over his career.
The first one was to Mark McCallum who beat him over the distance and stated after the fight that he would never fight him again as it was the hardest fight he had in his career.
I remember the Reggie Johnson fight and I personally think he won that one but I would not disagree with a draw as it was a really close fight but he did not deserve to lose that fight.
Then there was the robbery in Italy when Salambay Kalambay or some name like that got a decision over him which was daylight robbery, it was for the european title I think.

I have no doubt that Collins would have went the distance with Roy Jones jnr. but I don't think he would have beaten him although Jones liked to bully opponents and he would not have been able to fight like that against Collins.
I think he is the greatest Irish boxer ever, well at least that I have seen. I cannot comment on the guys from 50/60 years ago as I have never seen them fight.

Mike McCallum and Sumbu Kalambay but other than that you've got things right .

Ruu_Old

mccaffertyt wrote: »

does anyone know what songs steve used for his entrances

I only remember him using the Rocky theme for the Eubank fights but I'm sure it was something else before then.

eagle eye

Big Ears wrote: »

Mike McCallum and Sumbu Kalambay but other than that you've got things right .

I don't know how I put down Mark instead of Mike, but Sumbu, lol, didn't know that one. ty.
Just so you know, I personally think Mike McCallum was underrated, he came along just after the the Duran/Leonard/Hagler/Hearns golden era of middleweight boxing and he was never going to be rated highly while people got over their hangover from the previous era.
Also he beat two Irishmen, firstly Sean Mannion to win his first world title and then Steve Collins.
For anyone interested, I met Sean Mannion about ten years ago, he was working as a labourer in Boston on the Union, its not a bad job and he was still involved in boxing doing some coaching.
Just shows the importance of having good people around you who you can trust with to look after the financial end of things.
Meanwhile his former manager owned two bars and a factory and is no longer involved in boxing.

siochain

alanceltic wrote: »

he really did live up to his alias "celtic warrior" he wasnt the best technically but he sure made up for it with heart and effort, its just a big pity that he couldnt fill the boots as a role model for younger kids in the sport....he always gave full value for money and i have special memories of the eubank fights, one of the few times we had a world champ to shout about

fully agree, really enjoyed his fights.

King of Kings

mccaffertyt wrote: »

does anyone know what songs steve used for his entrances

i rem house of pain was his entrance tune -


i thought steve was brilliant and reckon he would have taken RJJ - but we can't judge - you only can fight the lad on front of you and rjj never took the offer and steve was wbo champ - had to be more pedigree in fighting collins than some others he took on.


"don't believe in the hype, believe in the man, steve collins" is what he said after eubank

The Artist

eubanks was "Simply the best" by tina turner, my arse he was!

I knew Steve and the family, i can remember his mother telling me that she had a son who was a boxer in America. One of his matches (which he lost) was not on TV and the result was announced on Pat Kenny.
After that it just got better and better for him . I can remember him telling me and my dad that he wanted to fight Eubank. When he left i can remember us laughing saying he will never beat him.
Same thing happened when he said he wants to fight Benn. Again he went out and he won.

I can remember his fight with Eubank were the camera was in Eubank's corner . Eubank was shocked telling his trainer "he keeps coming for me"

Class fighter in the end .