Brother With Heroin Addiction

WorriedSick

Hi All,
I've never posted on a Public Forum before but I really need some help and advice and I've read some advice given on other issues. Here is some background info on the situation that I am in, I am 25 and I am the youngest of 6 Children, when I say Children, we are all grown up. About 5 years ago, we found out my brother who is 28 is addicted to heroin. We knew before this that he had dabbled in drugs but never realised how serious it was. We (the family) confronted him and he admitted it. He broke down and said that he was going to change, things improved and in the meantime he and his girlfriend had a baby and we thought things were fine, however things have gone downhill over the past 12 months and he is now back on heroin, things came to head last week when a scumbag junkie called to my mothers house threatening to break down the door with a hammer because he wanted €100 that he was owed. My mother and my family are well respected in the area and this scumbag was screaming and threatening at the door, my mother ended up giving the money just to get him away. My brothers phone was off and he was hiding somewhere leaving my mother who is 55 in Danger.

We have since found out that it goes deeper and he owes €1500 for drugs, I know the people that he owes this money to and they are scum of the earth. My brother has promised that this is all he owes but how can we be sure? He lies about everything so we never know what the truth is. If we pay this are we enabling him to do it again? If we don't are we throwing him to the wolves? I love my brother and really fear for his safety. People are telling my mother to throw him out but she cant turn her back.. Is it time for tough love and risk him being killed? He doesn't work and currently attends a methodone clinic every day. Any help or advice would be appreciated as I don't think I can go through much more of this.
Sorry about the long post!!

AshTrollyDolly

Hi,

Really sorry to hear about your situation. Its so horrible and worrying to see someone you love do silly things but in my opinion, blood is thicker than water and family should try to stick together.

If your brother admits that he has a problem and really means it when he says he will change...well then, I think I would pay off the €1500, and then take a trip down to your GP with him and get him to talk about getting help to kick the habit and attend rehab....

But I think that if u do pay off the money, somebody should go with him when he is paying it off, because addicts will do anything to get their next fix and he could just spend the money. Get rid of his mobile or just delete all number so that these scum have know way of contacting him....

That is just some ideas that I have, hope it is of some help.

board om

Hey OP,

Sorry to hear about your brother. It sounds pretty serious. I am actually a heroin addict myself and have been for many years. Actually reading your post I was thinking how worried you must be about him to come on here and write about it. It sent a bit of a guilty shiver up my spine that maybe this is how my family feels about me. I am just blessed that I have never got them involved in anything with drug dealers or money or anything like that.

I know you want to help your brother but as you have realized he has turned into a compulsive liar and it is difficult to know if he is telling the truth about anything now. So you can’t take anything he says at face value. Obviously something has happened in the last 12 months for him to resort back to using heroin. Well the truth is once you have had a problem with it I think it is very likely that you will again. It is one of those situations where ignorance is bliss, so you are better off never knowing in the first place.

You are going to have to get to the route of the problem of what set him off again. Clearing debts isn’t going to help him. All that will do is set him up to get back into debt. If you and your family pay off this money there is every chance he is just going to run up the same bill again. And his dealers will have no problem letting him run up the bill because now they know his family is going to pay it off. That is how it works. They see a source of money and they exploit it. That being said, you can’t leave him to be killed either. What you are going to have to do is sit him down and find out exactly how much he owes. If it is only €1500 to one set of dealers I would be very surprised, because for someone to come to your parent’s door demanding money means that he has most likely been borrowing money from other places too. If he isn’t working and he has a habit he is in very dangerous territory, because that means he is doing something illegal to get his gear. So he is either selling for these guys, or carrying it for them, or he is out robbing. I am really sorry to be so blunt but there is no point in me sugar coating it because this is fact of life. That bill was run up somehow or other and no dealer is stupid enough to let an addict with no money get into debt by that much, which would make me think he got a large amount of gear on lay and got caught with it or lost it, or something to that effect. So he could be in quite deep.

You have 2 choices.

First choice is turn your back on him, tell him he is big enough and bad enough to look after himself. He is 28 now and well beyond the care of your parents so for their safety and the safety of your family it is time he moved out and sorted his own life out. If he decides he wants to get clean in the future then the family will help him in anyway they can, but he will not be coming back to live in the family home until he is clean and he can prove that he is staying clean. Make him take daily drug tests if need be, but he is not coming back to live in the home until he is 100% clean. And while he lives there he either works, or does a FAS course, or does something. Because lying around all day isn’t going to help him. Now, after you give him this option see what he does. He will either tell you all to fcuk off and storm out, which means he is basically picking a life of drugs over his family and there is nothing you can do for him. Or he will break down in tears and beg forgiveness at which point you all offer support and start talking to him about how you are all going to deal with this as a family and ask him what is he willing to do to get his life back on track. This will most likely depend on your family finances where you go from here. If you can all pitch in some money then there is private treatment you can get him in to next to instantly. It is expensive but they usually take someone within a few days or weeks. I myself will hopefully be going for one of these private treatments soon over in the UK. It involves getting implants in your stomach and they stop you from being able to use heroin. It is expensive but very effective. There are other private in-house treatment centres here in Ireland, so as I said depending on your financial situation there are options. Now, there are free options as well, but you are talking waiting lists and a lot of messing around. I have been down both roads and the free road is very difficult, but it is still possible. It all depends on how hard he is willing to try.

Your second option is to just pay the money and see what happens. You can tell him you are only going to be paying it if he promises to go into treatment and to get clean. But tbh this is a bit of a cop out and he wont have learnt any lesson. If anything he will be most likely getting away too easily and he won’t have learn from his mistakes. So he will probably be back using and back in debt in no time. After all, he isn’t working and he can’t work while he is strung out, so where is he going to get the money from. I would just think about this wisely because with the other option you are being quite drastic and you getting him to realize that this is it, he is losing his home and his family all for the sake if drugs, so you are forcing him to make a decision. With this option you are basically saying that what he is doing is ok. In fact not only are you saying it is ok, you are giving him €1500 prize for doing it; all you are short of doing is giving him a pat on the back as well. Basically what I am saying is that paying the money off for him unconditionally will just have you back to square one in no time. Nothing will be fixed and nothing will be different. I know it sounds mean but you need to use this money as a bartering tool, he gets it as long as he does A, B, and C. And for God sake make sure you do not give it to him to pay off, because it will never make it to the dealers. You organise to meet the dealers on your terms. If they want their money they will meet you. And you make sure they know that this is the only time this will be happening.

I hope this helps. If you want to know the names of a few of the treatment centres just let me know. The place in the UK I am hopefully going to seems pretty good. It is very drastic measures getting implants but at this stage I know there isn’t really any other option for me. There is nothing you could say to me that would stop me using, I have already had every speech, I have family and friends who don’t talk to me anymore, i have had financially difficulty, and I’ve had serious health issues, and none of them have stopped me. So I decided recently that I was sick of lying to everyone, including myself, and I got on to this place about the implants. So with a bit of luck I will be back writing here soon about how great the clean life is.

All the best and good luck.

secman

Best of luck board om, really hope it works out for you and you can get on with your life. When you think of it, life is short, very short , so don't blow it.

Worried sick, your family is caught between a rock and a hard place, but at the end of the day its out of your hands, its in your brothers hands, and its his call at the end of the day despite what ye as a family want. Harsh but true. Tough love is the hardest of all. Please god he will come around some day.

Secman

I am pie

Sit him down, make him read Ricey's post "Heroin" - check a few pages back. Pay particular attention to some of Boards OMs posts and maybe get hold of Ricey's podcast where he talks on the radio. Make him realised how fked he is and then take it from there. I don't know much about addiction but it appears that someone needs to hit rock bottom before they have the inclination to get themselves sorted.

You will need professional help with it tho, you won't be able to be your brothers counsel on this one, nor will your mother. He needs proper treatment and above all else he needs the motivation and desire to want to change.

Good luck to your family OP and also to you Boards OM.

Hermy

+1

board om

the above posters are spot on.

what Secman said about it being out of your hands is correct. it is entirely up to your brother i am afraid. i know you would probably give anything to be able to help him but unfortunatly it just isnt possible. the only person who can help your brother is your brother. and he needs to want to be helped, and not just financially. NA / AA and methadone clinics are full of addicts who dont want to be there and are only there because someone made them go. and they are the ones who will never benefit from it becuase they are there for the wrong reasons. you need to want to be there.

and I Am Pie's idea of sitting him down to read the previous posts on drug addiction might be a good idea. but i think your own post might be the most effective one, because as i said, when i read it, i got a guilty shiver up my spine because i was thinking of it as if it was written by my younger brother, and all i could think was "what am i doing to my family". it wasnt a nice feeling. i know if i came on to boards some day and found a post which i knew was about me and it was written by one of my family or friends, it would hit me pretty hard. so hopefully it will have the same effect on your brother. he is human after all. and I Am Pie's other point about addicts having to hit rock bottom before they do anything is correct. that is what i meant when i said if you bail your brother out now then he wont have learnt his lesson. he will have gotten away with it too easily and he will think that all he has to do when the going gets tough, is go running to the family for help and they will bail him out. so you really need to think about what you are doing if you are too pay off his debts becuase you might not be doing him any favours in the long term.

i know it is a lot to think about, but nobody said these things were easy.

WorriedSick

Thanks for all your advice and suggestions, I agree with what people are saying about him hitting rock bottom before he can start to get better. The problem is we never know when he is telling the truth or just "Buying Time" with us. He has a 3 year old boy who for obvious reasons, he hasn't been able to see lately and I have been trying to get him to focus on that and nothing else. I know he thinks the world of his son but the addiction has overcome him and he is now a different person.

I think Riceys account can help, so I am going to get him to read that and hopefully that will help. The family pretty much locked him in a room earlier today and tried to break him down, we all told him what it was doing to each of us individually and it seemed to hit home (hopefully). His attitude today is a bit better and he is saying "I am going to get better, no matter what" My only problem is we have heard this before so many times.

I really think it is a viscous circle, he has to go to a methadone clinic every day where he meets other scumbags who are selling heroin outside the door. He even refers to these scumbags as his "friends" some of the time, when 6 years ago, he would have refered to them as sumbags. Heroin is the dirtiest, filthiest thing I have ever come across and it destoys not only the addicts life but everyone around them. It's funny that I actually feel a little bit better when I get this out of my system..Even just typing it!

littlefriend

Hi there
sorry that you have to go through this - not the easiest thing in the world to cope with. Unfortunately, I don't really have any advice to give you but I would urge you to read up and learn as much as you can about how to cope when someone close to you has an addiction. I have been through something kind of similar a couple of times and my knee jerk reaction was to fix everything. I didn't know anything about 'enabling' and I had no idea whatsoever how much I was being lied to.
People say that al-anon is great. I never went because, by the time I found out about it, I had already moved on from my 'situation'. Maybe think about going to something like that.
Anyway, I wish you the best of luck, stay strong and make sure to look after yourself before you look after anyone else.
lisa

ps pay attention to board om - he gives great, practical and honest advice. Also, consider getting your brother to read all of his posts rather than ricey's - some of them are quite brutal but really worth reading. I don't mean to take anything at all from Riceys story but he seems to still up and down so I don't know if that would help your bro.


Board om - moving stuff once again - start writing !!!

board om

WorriedSick wrote: »

The problem is we never know when he is telling the truth or just "Buying Time" with us. He has a 3 year old boy who for obvious reasons, he hasn't been able to see lately and I have been trying to get him to focus on that and nothing else. I know he thinks the world of his son but the addiction has overcome him and he is now a different person.

It is good that he has something tying him to reality. a lot of addicts have nothing to keep them anchored to the 'real world' so they just drift off into their own little world of getting money, scoring drugs, then taking the drugs, then getting money again, getting drugs, then taking the drugs, and so on and so forth. The fact that he will lose his child if he keeps this up must be nagging in his mind. so even if he doesn’t give 2 fcuks what he is doing to everyone else, hopefully he feels different about his son and he wont want to lose him, and that is you glimmer of hope that your brother is still in there.

You are right about what you said about him being a different person. I know myself that up until a few years ago I couldn’t lie to someone without filling with guilt, and sure nobody believed me when I did lie because I was so bad at it. Since I have bee strung out I spend my days lying. It is non stop. My whole life is a lie, and I carry it off perfectly. I am an honest person by nature and it kills me to permanently lie about where I am, what I am doing, where my money has disappeared to, why I do things, etc. you have to understand that he is going to lie, and lie, and lie. Essentially he is a different person, but that isn’t to say he is always going to be a different person. You can still get your brother back.

WorriedSick wrote: »

His attitude today is a bit better and he is saying "I am going to get better, no matter what" My only problem is we have heard this before so many times.

If you have heard this from him before then it is time to up the anti. You need to try something new. If you need to stick him in the back of a car and drive him down the country and keep him locked up in a cottage for a few weeks, then do it. Or bring him over to England and make him get implants. Or make him think he has hit rock bottom. At least if it is controlled by his family then it won’t be as severe as when he really does hit rock bottom. Do what I said earlier about telling him he is out of the house, and not a month or a weeks notice, pack his bag and tell him he is going now. That will scare the siht out of him and you will see some real emotions then. You don’t have to follow through on it, just make him think it is serious. You need to get inside his head and see what he is thinking. At the moment you are only seeing what he wants you to see. You need to play him at his own game and start calling the shots. Then you will see what way he is thinking and you can go about helping him. Sorry if this sounds drastic, but it is a drastic situation. Probably the worst your family will ever face. And better to do this now than to lose him forever.

WorriedSick wrote: »

I really think it is a viscous circle, he has to go to a methadone clinic every day where he meets other scumbags who are selling heroin outside the door. He even refers to these scumbags as his "friends" some of the time, when 6 years ago, he would have refered to them as sumbags.

I have always said this about methadone clinics and it is the same problem I have with NA. They are full of addicts who don’t want to be there. Granted some of them do, but a lot of them don’t. And when you are one of the addicts that is trying to get clean and you are stuck hanging around with addicts who don’t want to get clean it is a disaster. You are trying to give up a drug that everyone around you is talking about and half them are selling. It is impossible. Methadone clinics are the one place that you can always guarantee to score. It’s a joke. When I was trying to get clean years ago and I was actually clean for a while, I still had to go to the clinic and I would have lads trying to get me to with them to score gear and crack. And no matter how much you say no they just keep wrecking your head to go. It’s a nightmare. But he should never consider them his friends because that is one thing they are not. There is a fact amongst junkies, no matter how well you know the addicts you are with if you overdose on heroin nobody will wait with you until the ambulance comes. Because none of them want to get the blame for you overdosing. So if you start to overdose, they will all leg it and leave you on your own. And if you are in someone’s house or flat and you overdose, they will carry you out to the side of the road, call an ambulance, and leave you there, because they don’t want police sniffing around their house. And that is fact. When I first started injecting a few years back I used to do it with a lad I used to score from, just like your brother it was someone who a few years ago I wouldn’t have acknowledged on the street but because I was strung out he was a 'friend'. I had only started injecting so I wasn’t able to inject myself that well so he used to help me with it. But he always did his own first and then did mine. And I asked him once why he just didn’t do mine first so he could relax and do his own then. And his answer was because if I started to overdose, he wanted to be able to carry me on to the street so he could call the ambulance, and he wanted to get his turn on done first. In other words he wasn’t worried about me dying or anything like that; his only worry was whether he got his turn on. And that was my 'friend'.

I hope you can find some way to get through to him and as I said, if the old techniques aren’t working then it is time to try new techniques. As Littlefriend said start reading up on addiction and get yourself up to speed on everything. Knowledge is power in this situation. He is very lucky to have a family who care about him as much as you do, and I hope he is aware of that.

WorriedSick

I really hope that we can get through to him too.. I don't know how much more of this that I can handle tbh. Things have gotten worse since I posted the original message. I accessed my brothers voice messages (I know that I probably shouldn't have) and there were about 10 messages from people saying that he was a dead man if he didn't up today. It made me physically sick to listen to them but we needed to know how deep he was in. We found out who he owed the money to and we went and paid off his debts.

It was one of the most sickening things that I've ever had to do and will never ever forget it. I was so angry with my brother for involving me in this scummy horrible world. We decided that my brother had to leave as this was destroying my whole family. I know people will say that I was wrong to pay his debts but no matter what he has done, he is still my brother and I dont want anything to happen to him. I really want him to get better but I cant help but feel that now we have kicked him out that he will get even worse or even end up dead. If this happens I know that I will blame myself.

Am I being too hard on myself and do you think that its the right thing to do? Maybe, when he is all alone with nowhere to go that he might cop on and try and sort out his life.

board om

WorriedSick wrote: »

I really hope that we can get through to him too.. I don't know how much more of this that I can handle tbh. Things have gotten worse since I posted the original message. I accessed my brothers voice messages (I know that I probably shouldn't have) and there were about 10 messages from people saying that he was a dead man if he didn't up today. It made me physically sick to listen to them but we needed to know how deep he was in. We found out who he owed the money to and we went and paid off his debts.

It was one of the most sickening things that I've ever had to do and will never ever forget it. I was so angry with my brother for involving me in this scummy horrible world. We decided that my brother had to leave as this was destroying my whole family. I know people will say that I was wrong to pay his debts but no matter what he has done, he is still my brother and I dont want anything to happen to him. I really want him to get better but I cant help but feel that now we have kicked him out that he will get even worse or even end up dead. If this happens I know that I will blame myself.

Am I being too hard on myself and do you think that its the right thing to do? Maybe, when he is all alone with nowhere to go that he might cop on and try and sort out his life.

Mate, tbh I don’t really know. You haven’t done the wrong thing anyway. And you have nothing to feel guilty about. This is his own doing and no matter what you and your family do to help him, it is up to him at the end of the day. I would hope that knowing that he is no longer welcome in the family home will help him figure out what he wants, but you just don’t know. That is the honest truth. When someone is that far gone in their addiction it is hard to know what they think anymore. I couldn’t even tell you a definite answer on what I think half the time. When you are like that your mind is constantly clouded and no matter how down you get about something, using gear blocks it out. So he probably hasn’t even realised the severity of what has happened yet. but in a few days when his 'friends' get pi**ed off with him sleeping on their couch, or when he runs out of people to get gear on lay off, he is going to realise the mess he is in. unfortunately you will have to wait for that to happen because nothing you can say is going to change his mind at the moment. You have done everything you can; it is up to him now.

All I can say for definite and that I am 100% sure on is this is not your fault. None of it is. You have to protect your family. What happens if the next time instead of threatening to knock the door down with a hammer, they decide to shoot up the house with your parents inside? It’s just gotten out of hand and there is nothing you can do about it. Please understand that. You have already done a lot for him by paying off his debts, and that is all you can do. The family have offered help and support and he hasn’t taken it. You can’t make him.

All you can do now is wait and hope to God that he cops on. I wish the best anyway.

LegacyUser

I relate to your posts very strongly. My brother is also a heroin addict and we are both the same ages as you and your brother. The difference in our situations is that my brother, though shooting 3 grams or more a day, is totally funtional, somewhat. He has a job, a girlfriend, tremendous talent. The rest of my family has no idea.

But all the guilt that you are feeling, I feel as well. You are not alone. Unfortunately, I am not completely free of blame because, though my brother introduced me to it, I have snorted heroin for months. I can't remember a time when we actually have even been around each other lately when it wasn't involved. But a strange turn of events, which I won't get into (with this drug I think they are always bound to happen) has recently caused me to wake up and go straight. My brother as well. Though my problem has been painful but manageable to taper off and come clean, as the worst I ever got was 1 or 2 bags a day for a month or so, my brother is in for an almost impossible withdrawal. And I can't honestly say I'm done either, as stupid as that sounds. I just take it a day at a time. once the physical pain goes away, you are almost more prone to making a stupid choice and with this drug it's so easy to fall back into. And worst, it doesn't even take 4 days to get back to withdrawing. It's ****ing unbelievable.

So I'm full of guilt and sadness for my brother's situation. While helping him recover is my top priority, I can't help but feel like a hypocrite when we're around each other and I'm telling him how I really feel about wanting him sober, not a slave to this drug. He is amazing and of course. Like all family, I love him to pieces. I just want the problem to stop before it takes away the great things in his life. He can still salvage the amazing life he has built.

But I think the best thing you can do is not judge him and try to get in his head. I think you can't tell your brother, or anyone for that matter, to NOT do what they WANT to do. If he is ready to make the right choice for his family, and grow up and get a job and work and get clean, support him. If you think people will kill him for his debts, and you are able to pay them, I say do it. It's hard to tell someone there brother might not be worth saving, but if he doesn't work and his family knows of his addiction and is willing to help him pay for treatment of some sort and he is putting you and your family in danger, he IS NOT ready to get better. Like the posts above said, sit him down and find out what he REALLY wants. Also, it seems as though he has no job he'll be missing when he detoxes. Like I said, your family knows, he seems in a place to be able to get help and not really negatively affect any thing that he has going on. I can't imagine the problems involved if my family found out about our problems. How could my brother pay rent if he didn't work. But he can't miss work so it's hard for him to get off the stuff.

But lying to people is a huge burden. At least you seem to be honest with your loved ones, and that is really good. Find strength in their support and don't give up on your brother. I won't either.

Best,
Mike

Sugar Drunk

you poor thing <hug>. All I can say is theres so much great advice on this post.
To add my own two cents I had a very close friend who was a coke addict. As tempting as it is to pay off the junkies to save him from harm as he will just have the opportunity to wrack up more debt with them and next tim ethey want paying they will come looking to you.

Board Om I just wanted to say best of luck with everything. Reading your posts was an eye opener and really drummed home how awful heroin is and how it sucks people in and changes them. best of luck in england.

The G Child

Can I ask something to Board OM, this implant that you get to stop the heroin cravings or makes you violently ill if you do take it (sorry, I'm not too familiar with the process), Is this just for Heroin or does it work for most drugs. Just wondering, because an addict is an addict and if they cant take heroin, they could move onto something like Coke, Crack or Crystal Meth (which I hear is gonna creep in here sooner or later) All of these are highly addictive and destructive and could just be used as alternatives to the gear.

board om

The G Child wrote: »

Can I ask something to Board OM, this implant that you get to stop the heroin cravings or makes you violently ill if you do take it (sorry, I'm not too familiar with the process), Is this just for Heroin or does it work for most drugs. Just wondering, because an addict is an addict and if they cant take heroin, they could move onto something like Coke, Crack or Crystal Meth (which I hear is gonna creep in here sooner or later) All of these are highly addictive and destructive and could just be used as alternatives to the gear.

The implants would only really work for heroin. I think it may work for alcohol as well; I am not 100% on that. I'm not too bothered on the alcohol side of things as I am not much of a drinker these days. My main problems would be heroin, which would be a 24/7 problem, and crack, which is more of a binging problem (as in I would go on a few days binge and then stop, but then start again maybe a week later). Then when I am out of cash and have no money for gear or crack I resort to a mix of methadone, valium and sleeping tablets. So the implants will only help me with heroin and methadone. But tbh they are what I have most problems with. I believe if I can get them under control I have more of a chance of sorting everything else out. Heroin is the one drug that has always held me back. Don’t get me wrong though, I am not thinking of this as some magical cure that is going to fix everything, I am thinking it more as an aide to help me in the my long term goal of getting clean altogether. It is sort of like a cheat as such. I have proven time and time again that I haven’t got the will power to stay off it myself. With the implants I don’t have any choice but to stay off it, so basically I am taking the decision out of my own hands. You see before they put in the implants they will detox me off heroin and methadone, so that will be those out of the way. I would never be able to do crack without having heroin to bring me back down so if I cant take heroin then the chances are I wont do crack. So that just leaves me with the tablets to sort out, and tbh they are the least of my worries. I would like to be free of them as well but the other drugs are my priority.

I know this probably sounds a bit simplified, and maybe I am being a bit unrealistic. But at this stage I have to start putting my faith in something. From injecting gear my health has really taken a bashing in the last couple of years, so I really can’t stand the thought of spending the rest of my life like this. Years ago when this mess first started if you had told me that I would be like this when I was 30 years of age, I would have laughed in disbelief. I just want a bit of normality again.

The G Child

To Boards OM, Best of luck with the implants and I hope it all works out for you. I understand what your saying regarding the other drugs, sort out the big one first and go from there.

To OP, I have family members who are/were 1st generation heroin addicts from the early 80's. Most are dead now and the 1 thats alive, while not injecting anymore, is in such a state from the years of abuse, that I wouldn't say he has long left. I dont know how bad your brother is (or yourself Boards OM), but there can come a point were your so far gone that any chance of a normal life is gone. I'm just speaking from the point of my family member, who, when he got off the smack everyone thought he had a chance, but then it was the methadone, which was harder to get off and as far as I know he's still on. You want the best for your brother, but if he doesnt want to be helped there is nothing you can do and as people have said, maybe he'll have to hit rock bottom before he realises that the life he has is sh1t and that he's not only killing himself, but his family too.

I wouldnt bail him out with the money because he will promise the world if you do that but will be only thinking of getting another fix. You and youre family will then spend the rest of his life supporting his habit, and in some ways, adding to his death. Maybe thats a bit harsh, but I think its true. Tough love is the hardest love of all, but maybe its needed for your brother.

I hope he comes through this, because it is hard on your whole family and its never nice to see someone you love slowly killing themselves. Good luck.

utick

board om wrote: »

The implants would only really work for heroin. I think it may work for alcohol as well; I am not 100% on that. I'm not too bothered on the alcohol side of things as I am not much of a drinker these days. My main problems would be heroin, which would be a 24/7 problem, and crack, which is more of a binging problem (as in I would go on a few days binge and then stop, but then start again maybe a week later). Then when I am out of cash and have no money for gear or crack I resort to a mix of methadone, valium and sleeping tablets. So the implants will only help me with heroin and methadone. But tbh they are what I have most problems with. I believe if I can get them under control I have more of a chance of sorting everything else out. Heroin is the one drug that has always held me back. Don’t get me wrong though, I am not thinking of this as some magical cure that is going to fix everything, I am thinking it more as an aide to help me in the my long term goal of getting clean altogether. It is sort of like a cheat as such. I have proven time and time again that I haven’t got the will power to stay off it myself. With the implants I don’t have any choice but to stay off it, so basically I am taking the decision out of my own hands. You see before they put in the implants they will detox me off heroin and methadone, so that will be those out of the way. I would never be able to do crack without having heroin to bring me back down so if I cant take heroin then the chances are I wont do crack. So that just leaves me with the tablets to sort out, and tbh they are the least of my worries. I would like to be free of them as well but the other drugs are my priority.

I know this probably sounds a bit simplified, and maybe I am being a bit unrealistic. But at this stage I have to start putting my faith in something. From injecting gear my health has really taken a bashing in the last couple of years, so I really can’t stand the thought of spending the rest of my life like this. Years ago when this mess first started if you had told me that I would be like this when I was 30 years of age, I would have laughed in disbelief. I just want a bit of normality again.

is there much crack in ireland now? never really here of gardai seizing any in the news unless they just call it cocaine either way im surprised crack is available

WorriedSick

Thanks guys for all your help and advice. The situation has improved slightly (I Hope!) since I last posted. I have now got more involved with my brother. We sat him down as a family and told him that we weren't going to keep doing this and that it was destroying not just his life but our lives too. We set down rules that he must stick to and we basically told him that the family home is no longer his home, it is now somewhere he can stay on a daily basis on condition that he makes an effort to get better. We did some research and we came across a place in Thailand called the Wat Tham Krabok detox program. It is a fairly drastic detox programme. Is anyone familiar with it??

We told him that we would help him no matter how much it cost. I could see the fear in his eyes when we told him that we think it might be the answer for him. The detox takes 4-6 weeks but its an opportunity for him to get clean. We know that there is no easy way out and that there are no guarantees that it might work but I think its worth a shot. The doctors in the methadone clinic are advising against it as they dont think its the answer. He was supposed to go on May 12th but we found out that he has to be on 50mls of methadone at most before the detox will be effective. I have attended the methadone clinic with him every week hoping that he will give clean urine samples but each time they come back opiat positive.

I know he is still taking heroin so I think he needs to give this detox a go. I think deep down he is trying, he is now coming down 5mls of methadone per week, he was on 100mls and needs to be on 50mls so we rebooked his flights for July 9th. My fear though is as the amount of methadone decreases the amount of heroin will increase. I hope we're doing the right thing.. Really I dont know what else we can do. Thanks again for your advice and I will keep you posted.

P.S BoardsOM, I want to especially thank you for the advice you gave.

The G Child

Worriedsick, I hope it all works out for your brother. Is this the detox programme where you go and stay with Buddhist Monks? I heard Christy Dignam talking about something similar on the Late Late Show a couple of years ago. He seemed to think it worked for him, saying it was pretty extreme and that it frightened him off Heroin. Could be an option, but only if your brother wants to come off it. If he feels like he's been forced into doing it he could relapse quite easily. Sorry for being negative about it when you and your family are desperate for him to get clean. It will set you back a lot of money and could be wasted unless your brother is ready to get himself sorted out. Best of luck with it, and hopefully it has a positive ending for yous.

board om

WorriedSick wrote: »

Thanks guys for all your help and advice. The situation has improved slightly (I Hope!) since I last posted. I have now got more involved with my brother. We sat him down as a family and told him that we weren't going to keep doing this and that it was destroying not just his life but our lives too. We set down rules that he must stick to and we basically told him that the family home is no longer his home, it is now somewhere he can stay on a daily basis on condition that he makes an effort to get better. We did some research and we came across a place in Thailand called the Wat Tham Krabok detox program. It is a fairly drastic detox programme. Is anyone familiar with it??

We told him that we would help him no matter how much it cost. I could see the fear in his eyes when we told him that we think it might be the answer for him. The detox takes 4-6 weeks but its an opportunity for him to get clean. We know that there is no easy way out and that there are no guarantees that it might work but I think its worth a shot. The doctors in the methadone clinic are advising against it as they dont think its the answer. He was supposed to go on May 12th but we found out that he has to be on 50mls of methadone at most before the detox will be effective. I have attended the methadone clinic with him every week hoping that he will give clean urine samples but each time they come back opiat positive.

I know he is still taking heroin so I think he needs to give this detox a go. I think deep down he is trying, he is now coming down 5mls of methadone per week, he was on 100mls and needs to be on 50mls so we rebooked his flights for July 9th. My fear though is as the amount of methadone decreases the amount of heroin will increase. I hope we're doing the right thing.. Really I dont know what else we can do. Thanks again for your advice and I will keep you posted.

P.S BoardsOM, I want to especially thank you for the advice you gave.

Hey OP,

I am glad to hear things are a bit more positive. And getting him to communicate is a start.

Regarding the drug treatment in Thailand, I have to say it is something I would love to do. It is an excellent treatment, but very, very severe. It is done in monasteries and you have to follow strict guidelines. Every morning you have to drink a bucket full of liquid, which is like a concoction of different herbs and stuff. You then have to vomit into a kind of stream that runs through the monastery. There is some crazy stuff with bamboo canes etc, but at the end of the day it supposedly works. And in fact it is the only method I have heard of that does definitely work. But it is hardcore and a lot of people don’t make it through it. The problem is that Thailand is probably one of the easiest places in the world to get heroin, and it costs next to nothing. So sending a heroin addict to Thailand is like sending an alcoholic to the Guinness brewery. Over there you could buy enough heroin to do you a life time for the same amount you would spend in a week here. So that is the danger and the main reason I haven’t been there. If I went over there and couldn’t stick out the treatment, I would then be the worst place possible and that could only lead to trouble. It would either end up with me staying there and living out my years and as junky, or it would end up like the film Midnight Express. And neither of those options are how i want my life to finish up. So you do have to think about that before sending him there. Also look into the law for transporting methadone into Thailand, because presumably he will have to bring some with him until he is taken into treatment. Methadone is an opiate as well, and the last thing you want is him getting stopped at the airport for that. You see, these are the kind of things that worry the hell out of me and have stopped me from going over there. And if I am honest it would worry my family as well because they know the dangers of me going there too. In fact a few years ago when I told my mother I was thinking of going over there for treatment, she laughed because she thought I was taking the p1ss. The same when I told my brother, he just looked at me like I was being funny. So I kind of read between the lines on that.

There is another method worth looking at and you could get him into it next to immediately. And the benefit is that he definitely will not be able to take heroin. He will have no choice in the matter. It is the implants I was talking about getting. Basically he would go to the UK and they will take him into a private detox hospital, he would have his own room and everything. They will start detoxing him immediately whether he is on heroin or methadone. They basically give you some kind of anti-psychotics that leave you pretty much knocked out for the first 2-3 days, and then after that it is a mixture of different tablets to get all the drugs out of your system. The detox takes 5-7 days but you are knocked out for most of it. After the detox you are ready to go home. Then the second part of the treatment there are 2 options for. The first option is they can send you home with tablets to take that are opiate blockers. They will give them to a member of your family who is supposed to make you take them every day. If you take heroin or methadone while on these tablets it can cause very serious sickness and in some cases it can cause you to be hospitalized. So you can not take any opiates. The only problem is if you miss a tablet you could go and score, so you really need to make sure that someone responsible is giving you the tablets. The second option is the implants. Instead of giving you tablets to take orally, they do a small operation where they will put 2 opiate blockers in your stomach, just above your hips on either side. This has the same affect as the tablets, but unlike the tablets you can’t get away with not taking them because they are inside you. The implants last 6-12 months at a time and you can get them redone when they start to wear off. For someone like myself who really know they cant trust themselves, this is perfect because it is taking the choice out of my hands. I would have no option but to stay clean. Tbh this is worth looking at before going to Thailand because as I said, Thailand could end up being more dangerous than helpful.

Check out www.detox5.co.uk and see what you think. I called them a while ago and they were really helpful. I had a good chat to them and they sent me out all the information I needed. They actually had it out within 24 hours which was good from the UK. They could have him admitted within a week or so. If he wants the implants then they will ask him to wait about a month because there is some supply shortage of the opiate blockers at the moment so there is a bit of a waiting list, but no longer than 6 or 7 weeks is what they said to me. He could basically fly over and go straight there, and he would be home within 7 days, and that is with implants and everything. No more methadone or anything else needed. You are looking at a cost of about €8k if he goes for detox and implants. Tbh it’s not that bad when you think about.

I am hoping to go with the implants myself. The problem is considering my habit costs me €100+ a day, even though I have a very good job it is nearly impossible to get €8k saved becuase every bit of money that i get goes staright back out on drugs. And I don’t want to borrow it from anyone because if the treatment didnt work for me i wouldnt be able to live with the guilt. So it is a bit of a catch 22 for me.

Have a look at the link I put up there. I have a link for the place in Thailand as well but I will have to find it. I will send it to you when I do. Funny though, I never actually realized what effect being a drug addict had on my family until I read your posts. I now kind of know what it must be like for my brothers and parents knowing about me. I could never understand why they made such a bit deal about it and caused so much trouble for me, but reading you posts it kind of makes sense now. They are just worried. So thank you for that, it has opened my eyes.

all the best and keep me posted.