Can I Sub teach with My BA

brian crackout

Hi there

I just have a few querys which I hope somebody may be able to clarify for me...

I graduated with my Arts Degree in Geography and history in Sept. last. i Got a 2.1. Ive been spending the past while jobseeking and Ive been considering going on to do a Hdip. The deadline has passed however to get into the course for sept 2008.
My question is: is it possible to teach in a secondary school in a substitute postition/Temporary Post if I do not have a HDip?. I know that some of my colleagues from my degree year have gone on to teach in their local schools where they previously attended, however I wouldnt feel comfortable doing that as I didnt exactly click with my former teachers.Do schools take on BA graduates as Subs and what is the procedure for going about this? Do I just send in a cV and a cover letter to the school or do I have to go through the VEC/Dept of education?

also what are the chances of getting in to the HDip course without prior teaching experience? Would a 2.1 give me enough points to get into a course? I would imagine that having prior experience would be looked upon favourably?

Any feedback would be appreciated,

Cheers

extra-ordinary_

Yes you can sub with just a degree. Just go into your local school. Try and meet the principal rather than just ring or leave a CV, they may have something available for you. Teaching experience can boost your points if you get enough!

born2bwild

yes you can. I did it for a year and there are one or two heads in my school at the minute doing it. Don't know where you are but your best bet is to go to the schools in the dodgiest areas - more teachers out sick due to stress etc more sub hours. Stress your availability, flexibility and above all your bullet - proofed constitution; your academic credentials will speak for themselves but if you're subbing, a principal will be more interested in your strength of character than your 2.1

cacamilis

born2bwild wrote: »

yes you can. I did it for a year and there are one or two heads in my school at the minute doing it. Don't know where you are but your best bet is to go to the schools in the dodgiest areas - more teachers out sick due to stress etc more sub hours. Stress your availability, flexibility and above all your bullet - proofed constitution; your academic credentials will speak for themselves but if you're subbing, a principal will be more interested in your strength of character than your 2.1

Hi, you said you did a yr of subbing? Im interested in doing same, but would you get enough hours to keep you going for the year? i.e pay etc?

born2bwild

How much do you need? In my school there are one or two people on subbing all the time.

As a low estimate I'd say they're getting maybe three or four periods a day. That translates into 160 minutes.

160 by 5 is 800 minutes, which is 13 hours, which at 50 eu per hour is 650 before tax

At this very moment I'm talking to another teacher who last year subbed and got full hours almost every week. 22 hours at 50 eu per hour - that's a lot of cash.

She's just said however, 'The thing is, it's extremely demoralising' Subbing all the time will wreck your head. You'll get such abuse you may well run screaming out the door at the end of your first day.

BUT - if you choose a posh or even normal lower middle class school you won't get those hours. But if you think you're up to it, call out to tough schools in 'disadvantaged' areas and you might well be succesful.

Be careful what you wish for....

valz_walsh

Is it possible to sub in as a primary school teacher, with out higher level irish?

How hard is it to get a job in a primary school these days. :oI want to go back and re-do my irish leaving cert again, and then maybe go on to do the Hibernia course. I have already got a degree in marketing, so there be no problem there.

Thanks

cacamilis

born2bwild wrote: »

How much do you need? In my school there are one or two people on subbing all the time.

As a low estimate I'd say they're getting maybe three or four periods a day. That translates into 160 minutes.

160 by 5 is 800 minutes, which is 13 hours, which at 50 eu per hour is 650 before tax

At this very moment I'm talking to another teacher who last year subbed and got full hours almost every week. 22 hours at 50 eu per hour - that's a lot of cash.

She's just said however, 'The thing is, it's extremely demoralising' Subbing all the time will wreck your head. You'll get such abuse you may well run screaming out the door at the end of your first day.

BUT - if you choose a posh or even normal lower middle class school you won't get those hours. But if you think you're up to it, call out to tough schools in 'disadvantaged' areas and you might well be succesful.

Be careful what you wish for....

Im not worrying too much about building up credits-obvioulsy thats important, but im more concerned about getting alot of experience! ie how to handle a class of students!! Originally i was keen on secondary school teaching but after hearing alot of stories im questionning it. So im going to try sub in both primary and secondary schools, to help make up my mind!

Thanks so much for all the info!!

spurious

In my school, most of the staff have signed up for the supervision and substitution scheme so we have at least two people ready to sub for each class period (ours are an hour long). Where we would need paid subs we go to them only after other options have been fleeced (such as learning support). In unusual circumstances, with over 5 or 6 teachers out, we would have work for paid subs.

Yesterday, I had two six hour stints of subbing to give to someone and couldn't get anyone because substitute teachers were not answering their phones. We were let down badly and to be honest, I will think twice about ringing those particular subs again.

snickerpuss

Perhaps they were subbing somewhere else. It's a bit harsh to never call them again for not answering their phones one day!

RealJohn

I think (and I could be wrong) that because of the teaching council's new stance on things, unqualified teachers are not allowed to sub. That means you do need a H.Dip (and a degree in the subject you're subbing in. Subjects you did in non-degree years in college no longer count, from what I'm told).

I should probably actually read that stuff they sent me.

Rosita

RealJohn wrote: »

I think (and I could be wrong) that because of the teaching council's new stance on things, unqualified teachers are not allowed to sub. That means you do need a H.Dip (and a degree in the subject you're subbing in. Subjects you did in non-degree years in college no longer count, from what I'm told).

I should probably actually read that stuff they sent me.

Considering that (one presumes anyway) schools would not by choice take an unqualified teacher in for subbing if a qualified substitute was available, you'd wonder if the whole school system wil not grind to a halt altogether next year if this is the case.

What the teaching council is saying (assuming this is correct) is that if a Geography and English teacher is out sick, his/her Geography class can be presided over only by a person with a H.Dip and Geography to degree level, and his/her English class can be presided over only by a person with a H.Dip and English to degree level.

And assuming that the school doesn't hit the jackpot (which seems unlikely on a regular basis) and find a teacher with a H.Dip and both subjects to degree level it means that a school will require two substitutes. This raises the question as to what will happen these classes when (inevitably) a suitably qualified teacher cannot be located at short notice. If no suitably qualified (with the specific subject to degree level) teacher is available and only a suitably qualified teacher can work as substitute, it seems to me that this policy will have enormous repercussions if it is used in practice.

It would be astonishing if the teaching council was so far removed from reality as to sponsor such an anti-school policy. Though one presumes that decisions relating to employment of teachers and/or substitutes ultimately rests with the Department of Education and not the Teaching Council?

RealJohn

I agree but the council seem to think that they're the ones in charge here from what I've read.

I completely agree that it will throw the system into chaos if things actually are the way I've been told they are (which is how I described them). There won't be teachers to fill the full-time posts, not to mind the subbing ones.

gaeilgegrinds

I don't agree with theway the Council operate but I do think more regulations should exist. At a recent conference I attended there were 'Irish' teachers asking for it to be in English. I was appalled. Same thing happened recently when a friend of mine was doing the French orals in a school, the teacher there didn't understand her. Therefore I think it is right that they regulate but I just think a slower, more gradual approach might actually work. This won't.

Rosita

gaeilgegrinds wrote: »

I don't agree with theway the Council operate but I do think more regulations should exist. At a recent conference I attended there were 'Irish' teachers asking for it to be in English. I was appalled. Same thing happened recently when a friend of mine was doing the French orals in a school, the teacher there didn't understand her. Therefore I think it is right that they regulate but I just think a slower, more gradual approach might actually work. This won't.

It goes without saying that teachers should have a good level of knowledge with their subjects. It also goes without saying that there are quite a few out there who don't. Especially so in the case of languages.

However, trying to create a set of rules which will leave many classes in many schools all around the country not capable of being supervised within those rules is a different matter. I can understand to a point what they are trying to do but it is out of sync with reality, and reality is always a good starting point in bringing in rules and regulations which demand credibility.

When there is an unlimited supply of fully qualified substitute teachers of all subjects available then the teaching council ideas might make sense. But that utopia is a long way away I imagine.

gaeilgegrinds

That's what I mean, fill the jobs properly first. Unqualified teachers should not take precedence over those qualified though & we all know this is happening. I understand unqualifieds come in though. Step by step, little by little but not a blanket ban like they're inforcing!