As an aside (dont read unles you have seen the end of S3)

Nuttzz

Now that tyrol has discovered he's a cylon doesnt that make the kid he had with cally the 2nd human cylon hybrid?

Sherifu

Indeed. There may be differences cause he's one of the final 5, guess we'll see.

Khannie

Good point. Unless he's not actually Cylon. I'm still holding out for that possibility.

redbhoy1888

Consider this-the first Human/Cylon war ended 40+ years ago in the series.Tigh was a Viper pilot so should have been in his twenties lets say.This means that the Human type Cylons were among the population BEFORE the war ended?

Sorry but I remain to be convinced Tigh is actually a Cylon.

Khannie

redbhoy1888 wrote: »

Consider this-the first Human/Cylon war ended 40+ years ago in the series.Tigh was a Viper pilot so should have been in his twenties lets say.This means that the Human type Cylons were among the population BEFORE the war ended?

Sorry but I remain to be convinced Tigh is actually a Cylon.

Yeah, I had considered Tigh's age and having served in the original war to be a but of a problem also. Skeptical. Skeptical.

redbhoy1888

Theres no way the XO is a toaster ha ha!

The_Minister

It could be a varient of what Baltar has, - not a cylon, but connected to them somehow.

Rev Hellfire

well perhaps the final 5 actually pre-date the cylons, if that was the case Tigh as a cylon isn't that much of a leap of faith.
Keeping in mind that when adama first meets Tigh it was long after his ship had been 'boarded'.
There's actually noone around who served with him in the early days of the first cylon war.

User45701

I belive that the final 5 are cylon/human hybrids themselves.
Would explain how there are not cylon (they age)

silvine

I down for the hybrid theory too. They will all be playing happy families by the end of it.

tvnutz

Ye I think they are clearly telling us they are definatly Cylons but obviously they have to be a different type of Cylons,as someone mentioned,hybrids. They better explain it properly as well! How Tigh has aged,how Anders was sick etc

Overheal

What says Cylons dont age?

kevmy

Overheal wrote: »

What says Cylons dont age?

Yeah was thinking that myself. It's never being said/shown/proved they don't age. We know they are reborn into ready made adult bodies but these could just have been grown and placed in stasis.

You would probably have to examine them over a period of 5+ years to see any appreciable difference.

lostexpectation

so the baby is 1/4 cyclon?

Reverend Paul

redbhoy1888 wrote: »

Consider this-the first Human/Cylon war ended 40+ years ago in the series.Tigh was a Viper pilot so should have been in his twenties lets say.This means that the Human type Cylons were among the population BEFORE the war ended?

Sorry but I remain to be convinced Tigh is actually a Cylon.

We never actually saw Tigh flying a Viper in the flashback scenes. He could have been "planted" after the war ended, with a ready made cover story.

As far as Cylons' aging goes, the F5 could have been "programmed" to age until they are activated.

Overheal

kevmy wrote: »

Yeah was thinking that myself. It's never being said/shown/proved they don't age. We know they are reborn into ready made adult bodies but these could just have been grown and placed in stasis.

You would probably have to examine them over a period of 5+ years to see any appreciable difference.

Unless all of the models were made in a single large batch.. hence to explain why tricia helfer is allowed to age under contract

User45701

Reverend Paul wrote: »

We never actually saw Tigh flying a Viper in the flashback scenes. He could have been "planted" after the war ended, with a ready made cover story.

As far as Cylons' aging goes, the F5 could have been "programmed" to age until they are activated.

Hmm. Fair enough point but was it not said back in season 2 that the cylon models cant be copies of existing humans? so tigh cant be a plant (from plant i took it you meant that the real one died and the one we know was planted with no knowledge of who/what he is.)

What about Tyroll i think he served with adama for a long time, on the Valkyie as well i think.

I honnestly cant understand the age thing, them being hybrids is my best guess.

Reverend Paul

User45701 wrote: »

Hmm. Fair enough point but was it not said back in season 2 that the cylon models cant be copies of existing humans? so tigh cant be a plant (from plant i took it you meant that the real one died and the one we know was planted with no knowledge of who/what he is.)

What about Tyroll i think he served with adama for a long time, on the Valkyie as well i think.

I honnestly cant understand the age thing, them being hybrids is my best guess.

No, I didn't mean that Tigh replaced an existing human, I meant that he assumed an identity. His "first ship" was lost, so he might even have been planted after that incident. Not many witnesses left to contradict his cover story then.

As far as Tyrol goes, he would have served after the first war, so I don't see your point.

I think the F5 are unique models (as opposed to multiple copies.) I think they're of a higher "rank" than the seven. To make them hybrids would be a little too obvious for this show!

User45701

Reverend Paul wrote: »

No, I didn't mean that Tigh replaced an existing human, I meant that he assumed an identity. His "first ship" was lost, so he might even have been planted after that incident. Not many witnesses left to contradict his cover story then.

As far as Tyrol goes, he would have served after the first war, so I don't see your point.

I think the F5 are unique models (as opposed to multiple copies.) I think they're of a higher "rank" than the seven. To make them hybrids would be a little too obvious for this show!

I do see your points but it makes no sence for the cylons to be failing at human models at the end of the war if they already had some in service so either the 5 where made by man or else its something else...

Sharon talked about the hybid, how it was the first step twards there evolutation from mechines from them (old centurians) to him (hybid) to us (the seven) So why would the first step twards being human have been invented/created after the 5?

You know the way the cylons left for a world to call their own after the peace treaty? what if the cylons disagreed on where to go? what is the majority went one way and the 5 went another? i VERY much doubt the the 4 we know are the only copies of the 5 there has to be more and they have to ressurect to somewhere (this is based on what you said that they are 100% cylon and not hybids)

Reverend Paul

User45701 wrote: »

I do see your points but it makes no sence for the cylons to be failing at human models at the end of the war if they already had some in service so either the 5 where made by man or else its something else...

Sharon talked about the hybid, how it was the first step twards there evolutation from mechines from them (old centurians) to him (hybid) to us (the seven) So why would the first step twards being human have been invented/created after the 5?

You know the way the cylons left for a world to call their own after the peace treaty? what if the cylons disagreed on where to go? what is the majority went one way and the 5 went another? i VERY much doubt the the 4 we know are the only copies of the 5 there has to be more and they have to ressurect to somewhere (this is based on what you said that they are 100% cylon and not hybids)

No, the humanoid Cylon models only appeared (as far as I know) either just before, or just after the war. The "Toasters" were experimenting with cybernetics for quite a while at that point.

As to why the five were separated from the other seven, that remains to be seen.

I think having only one unique F5 is a good idea. Without the safety net of a download, these models would be much more like humans than the other seven.

DeVore

I think its pretty conclusive from the start of the 4th series that

they are cylons, and recognised by some cylons at least

DeV.

Overheal

I agree DeV. But there is also a lot of evidence indicative the Final 5

were not recognized also.

such as the loss of Tigh's left eye, and Tyroll's counselling sessions with Brother Cavill.

Unless Cavill knew.

Which may or not be true, as a direct result of Dianna searching for and seeing the faces of the Final Five. In fact, this may be an ulterior motive for Cavill to take Dianna's model completely offline: he may know more than the others.

On Overheal's infamous intuition scale this scores a modest 59%.

User45701

You know the one thing we havent tried to figure out is that fracking viper?
i mean either its "magic" or it came off an assemby line at earth meaning that earth even though they didnt have any contact with the colonies had simmilar ships or...

Season 3 episode... 8?
Baltar: *on the basestar bridge* : Surly the war has furbished you with some colonial ships?
Sharron: Yes he is right, we could program one of our raptors to aproach on auto pilot.

Maybe the cylons have vipers as well? I would not be that hard to give one a paint job but why they wouldent add dammage to it to make it more real?

Overheal

Leave the Viper alone: its mine! DIBS.

I don't see the Cylons doing something like that. They certainly would add damage to it I think. And no nav data? Weird. I grant you it could be a wonderful ruse but.. I don't know. theres not nearly enough information about the Viper just yet. At the moment, its simply magick'd.

Unless it was an F5 cylon attack and those Cylons were stationed on earth: they may very well have taken her from the gas giant to earth and given her a superfresh Viper, and then let her go during the attack. But I doubt it; because thats the first thing we're expected to expect. When has BSG ever let us do that?

Sherifu

User45701 wrote: »

Maybe the cylons have vipers as well? I would not be that hard to give one a paint job but why they wouldent add dammage to it to make it more real?

That's a reasonable theory.

User45701

Overheal wrote: »

Leave the Viper alone: its mine! DIBS.

I don't see the Cylons doing something like that. They certainly would add damage to it I think. And no nav data? Weird. I grant you it could be a wonderful ruse but.. I don't know. theres not nearly enough information about the Viper just yet. At the moment, its simply magick'd.

Unless it was an F5 cylon attack and those Cylons were stationed on earth: they may very well have taken her from the gas giant to earth and given her a superfresh Viper, and then let her go during the attack. But I doubt it; because thats the first thing we're expected to expect. When has BSG ever let us do that?

I spent the last year convinced that the gas giant had a wormhole in its athmosphere, how else would she get to earth - also she had been paiting her death since she was a child? makes more sense she would be painting the course she must take...

Also it looked like a roatating vortex... i still think it was a wormhole but i cant explain the destruction of her viper or her new one

Reverend Paul

It just occurred to me: if Tigh really did fly a Viper during the first war, that would make it a "Tigh Fighter."

User45701

oh oh thats bad but its good because i know someone who will hate it more. lol

The_Minister

Urgh.

Hmmmm, I seem to have thrown up my liver.

Frak.

kevmy

Cavill cleared some things up in the last episode.

Millions of each type of model.
Raptors were from the 7 not the 5 but are able to recognise the 5. The must be programmed not to hurt them.

User45701

kevmy wrote: »

Cavill cleared some things up in the last episode.

Millions of each type of model.
Raptors were from the 7 not the 5 but are able to recognise the 5. The must be programmed not to hurt them.

I understood that it was the hybird that told the raiders/recongised the 5/4?

kevmy

User45701 wrote: »

I understood that it was the hybird that told the raiders/recongised the 5/4?

Well ok but it came out in the conversation the 6 had with Cavill

Stark

Overheal wrote: »

I agree DeV. But there is also a lot of evidence indicative the Final 5

were not recognized also.

such as the loss of Tigh's left eye, and Tyroll's counselling sessions with Brother Cavill.

Unless Cavill knew.

Which may or not be true, as a direct result of Dianna searching for and seeing the faces of the Final Five. In fact, this may be an ulterior motive for Cavill to take Dianna's model completely offline: he may know more than the others.

On Overheal's infamous intuition scale this scores a modest 59%.

The Final Five are definitely not recognised by 6 of the "Significant Seven". The raiders only recognised them after their activation and Anders responding with the glowing red eye signal. Cavil may well know something though.

Stark

Well anyway, my theory is that in the future, the cylons build a machine to send a humanoid cylon back in time to kill Adama as a child. Adama wins, thanks to reprogrammed Tighe model sent back in time to help him. Unfortunately, human scientists use the cylon technology to make advances in the fields of robotics and AI, leading to the inevitable war with the machines, I mean cylons. "All this has happened before and all this will happen again"

Reverend Paul

Did anyone notice how "Imaginary Baltar" knew about the music which activated the Final Five? I wonder what that's all about?

Whoever/whatever returned Starbuck obviously made no attempt to cover their tracks, as they provided her with a spanking new Viper. Was this intentional or not?

Most tellingly, Starbuck said that she felt that she "had never left" Earth? Could she be an Earthling to begin with?