relationship councelling

heavyheart

Hi everyone
some of you might remember a previous post where i stated that myself and my partner were having a few issues arguing and as a result have commenced relationship councelling .
but ... lately ive been thinking of a time when after a heated argument ( a long time ago ) i told him to pack his bags even though at the time i really didnt want him to but both of us are just so stubborn... anyway , just as he had everything packed up i asked him not to go and we ended up falling into each others arms crying saying that we love each etc ... the thing i cant get out of my head is ... if i hadnt asked him to stay , i think he actually would have gone .. so why do i bother organizing the councelling and date nights etc ??
yes im venting but im really on the brink of tears , actually too late they have arrived ...
im dont no whether im just hormonal or what but this is really upsetting me ...and i dont no what to do ...

Zulu

You told him to pack his stuff.
He did.

What did you want? Him to capitulate? Would that have made you happier? Are you upset because he's not a walk over?

In your post you come across as being hormonal. If you were a friend of mine and a bloke, I tell you to cop on and grow up, however you are neither, so perhaps someone more in touch with their emotions might proved council more suited to you.

Kudos for going to counciling though.

heavyheart

everyone says some things they dont mean in the heat of the moment , your right he did what i asked but would i have done the same so quickly and tried to run away or would i have stayed to try and sort things out ? the later for me .

Curvy Vixen

Why don't you bring this up in the 'safety' of the next counselling session? That way it shouldn't turn into another row and it can be explored properly.

heavyheart

Curvy Vixen wrote: »

Why don't you bring this up in the 'safety' of the next counselling session? That way it shouldn't turn into another row and it can be explored properly.

i plan to thanks ...just wanted to get it out of my system here so i can be more composed when i do bring it up .. needed to vent ...sorry ...

Zulu

heavyheart wrote: »

everyone says some things they dont mean in the heat of the moment , your right he did what i asked but would i have done the same so quickly and tried to run away or would i have stayed to try and sort things out ? the later for me .

Well there's a lesson there isn't there?
Personally I don't tolerate that behaviour in my relationships. (I'm not saying I'm right here, I'm just saying it's outside the behaviour I look for) I personally consider it immature and melodramatic - if I want something worked out, I work it out. If someone says "well we need to break up so", I say "fair enough so"; if someone says "pack your bags" I pack them. Why? Because if they say it once, you can expect them to say it in every argument, and you can rest assured that every argument will be a storm in a teacup. I don't look for high maintence, for me it's very unattractive.
On the flip side, I don't expect my partner to be able to mind read. I also don't make false threats, for the very reason: what would I do if they followed them out? Talk about a monumental backfire! It's also unfair to impose "what you would do" on to him. He is not you. Fair enough, we have expectations and considerations for our partners, but healthy relationships do not include the behaviour you have just described, hence maybe, part of the reason there is now a councillor.

And while we all get mad and say stupid things, I don't buy into the whole "in the heat of the moment". It doesn't wash. I bite my tounge. Besides, it's all too often used to excuse abusive behaviour (I'm not suggesting you are abusive - just making an observation here), so I avoid it.
Sure I get really really pissed off, and sure I get angry, but I never expect my partner to mind read as it's not fair.

Look I get the impression this post isn't going to be the advice you are looking for, and perhaps it'll offend you more than help you. For that I apologise in advance and reiterate, I am discussing what I tolerate, what I find unattractive, and what I understand. It's only my opinion. The councillor will help you more than anyone here.

heavyheart

Zulu wrote: »

Well there's a lesson there isn't there?
Personally I don't tolerate that behaviour in my relationships. (I'm not saying I'm right here, I'm just saying it's outside the behaviour I look for) I personally consider it immature and melodramatic - if I want something worked out, I work it out. If someone says "well we need to break up so", I say "fair enough so"; if someone says "pack your bags" I pack them. Why? Because if they say it once, you can expect them to say it in every argument, and you can rest assured that every argument will be a storm in a teacup. I don't look for high maintence, for me it's very unattractive.
On the flip side, I don't expect my partner to be able to mind read. I also don't make false threats, for the very reason: what would I do if they followed them out? Talk about a monumental backfire! It's also unfair to impose "what you would do" on to him. He is not you. Fair enough, we have expectations and considerations for our partners, but healthy relationships do not include the behaviour you have just described, hence maybe, part of the reason there is now a councillor.

And while we all get mad and say stupid things, I don't buy into the whole "in the heat of the moment". It doesn't wash. I bite my tounge. Besides, it's all too often used to excuse abusive behaviour (I'm not suggesting you are abusive - just making an observation here), so I avoid it.
Sure I get really really pissed off, and sure I get angry, but I never expect my partner to mind read as it's not fair.

Look I get the impression this post isn't going to be the advice you are looking for, and perhaps it'll offend you more than help you. For that I apologise in advance and reiterate, I am discussing what I tolerate, what I find unattractive, and what I understand. It's only my opinion. The councillor will help you more than anyone here.

No need to apologise , no offense taken . I take your point , i used an empty threat and it backfired and yes it is part of the reason why we are in counseling , the main part being lack of communication. When ever my partner doesnt want to hear something he doesnt like ,he runs a mile or gets angry at me for pushing him into trying to try and talk it out.. so i keep trying my best to change my approach or hold my tongue when im angry and wait until things are calm...only to get the same hotheaded reaction from him every time ... ii find it very disheartening ..

togster

Oh ffs. You asked him to leave! What did you expect him to do? Beg you to stay? Fix your own issues and then maybe your relationship might stand a chance. Creating drama for the sake of it is childish.

heavyheart

togster wrote: »

Oh ffs. You asked him to leave! What did you expect him to do? Beg you to stay? Fix your own issues and then maybe your relationship might stand a chance. Creating drama for the sake of it is childish.

Ah seriously ?? Are you for real ? Have you never ever said something you regretted ?Im not perfect , ok i made a mistake, I am at least trying to put it right .

Zulu

heavyheart wrote: »

the main part being lack of communication. When ever my partner doesnt want to hear something he doesnt like ,he runs a mile or gets angry at me for pushing him into trying to try and talk it out.. so i keep trying my best to change my approach or hold my tongue when im angry and wait until things are calm...only to get the same hotheaded reaction from him every time ... ii find it very disheartening ..

Thats fair enough, and not uncommon in Ireland (amongst Irish men - is he Irish?)
You've done the right thing to start counciling, but you do need to recognise him for who he is, and decide if that is what you want. For him, the biggest concession (in monumental terms) might have been to agree to see a counsellor! While for you that may have been nothing - people are crazy
Anyway, you're dead right to vent here first. Only your ego can be hurt here!
I hope it works out for you.

heavyheart

Zulu wrote: »

Thats fair enough, and not uncommon in Ireland (amongst Irish men - is he Irish?)
You've done the right thing to start counciling, but you do need to recognise him for who he is, and decide if that is what you want. For him, the biggest concession (in monumental terms) might have been to agree to see a counsellor! While for you that may have been nothing - people are crazy
Anyway, you're dead right to vent here first. Only your ego can be hurt here!
I hope it works out for you.

Oh if theres anything ive learned from posting here its expect to hear the worst and try not to take it personally ! sometimes you need the see the harsh truth in words in order to take it in and for it to make sense .
I feel i cam accept who he is. its just in order to accept him fully i need is to understand why he act they way he does... and yes only counseling i feel will help with that ...

Zulu

well if he's irish, he act like that because his father, and all male role models acted like that while he was growing up. And his mother and all his female role models told him "big boys don't cry" and "oh don't be such a little girl"

...probably has something to do with it

heavyheart

He is irish , i forgot to mention..
i do think he is like his father in some respects ..walks away from trouble doesnt get angry unless pushed ... but in respect of the female roles ..this is where my concern comes from.. I think he was spoilt growing up , comes across as the mammys boy and thats where i think he gets his selfishness from .. everyone has always protected him cause he's supposed to be " the quiet one " ...

togster

heavyheart wrote: »

Ah seriously ?? Are you for real ? Have you never ever said something you regretted ?Im not perfect , ok i made a mistake, I am at least trying to put it right .

Yeah i am for real. What age are you? I don't understand how you cannot see how ridiculous this seems. You told him to leave and when he did you got pissed How does that make sense? And yes i have made mistakes very similar to what you did to your OH but when i was 17/18

Wibbs

heavyheart wrote: »

i do think he is like his father in some respects ..walks away from trouble doesnt get angry unless pushed ...

That's a good thing. He's in control of his emotions. You from what you're saying appear less so. At least from a male(me) perspective. There are differences in a lot of these cases. It's rare you hear a guy complain that his partner doesn't talk enough and you hear women complain a lot the guys talk too little. When a woman does find a guy that matches her for talk and emotion it's usually a complaint ironically enough. The joke is being too sensitive as a man will lose a woman's interest far more quickly than being stoneyfaced. Almost as if some of them expect and indeed want you to attenuate the emotions in them.

I'm not one for this men are from mars BS, but I have found that aspect of relationships fairly consistent. In general the women I've known and gone out with are less emotionally consistent than men. Or you can say that they're more emotionally complex than men(though I personally don't believe that).

This is more obvious in a sexual relationship. Women I have as friends are far less all over the place with me as just a friend, than they are with their partners. To a degree sometimes surprising. It's as if they're testing the partners ability to deal with and often ignore their emotional outbursts. This seems to be a good thing in fact in a partner. To the extent that one of my closest friends, went off on some tangent with me one day getting all upset for little reason as I saw it(and she admitted later). When I pointed out to her that I wasn't boning her, so talk to me as she usually would, she laughed, saw the joke and normal service was restored and the issue ironed out in seconds. Knowing her nearly 15 yrs and that was our only argument. Discussions aplenty, but arguments no. She would have an argument with whichever partner she has been with at least once a month. The further joke is her various partners have accused her of being "hormonal", yet I think she is one of the most level headed human beings of either sex I know. Go figure.

but in respect of the female roles ..this is where my concern comes from.. I think he was spoilt growing up , comes across as the mammys boy and thats where i think he gets his selfishness from .. everyone has always protected him cause he's supposed to be " the quiet one " ...

If that is the case and he's a mammies boy then that may never change as far as his relationship to you goes. Indeed as I said if he went too far the other way you wouldn't like it at all. There's a part of you respects his non confrontational responses. For the record I would be like Zulu if you asked me to leave, you wouldn't have to ask me twice. Even if not more so, if I saw it for what it was, game playing.

While you accuse him of being spoiled and maybe he is, there's part of that in you too. You're looking for attention when you act like that. That's cool, when we have an issue we require the attention of our partner to try and deal with it, but if you go too far, they will disregard anything you say and wait until you've calmed down. The problem with that is when you have calmed down, the issue is not raised again and he may think that it's not an issue anymore, until the next time. Rinse and repeat. This is how couples break up. When that does happen the guy is often convinced that it happened "out of the blue". The above sequence of events is why they think that. The lack of direct communication on both sides makes it look to him like it's been solved or solved enough that it can be ignored.

Fair play to you for going for counseling. As Zulu wrote the sessions there should help you work through this. I wish you luck.

Beruthiel

heavyheart wrote: »

just as he had everything packed up i asked him not to go and we ended up falling into each others arms crying saying that we love each etc ... the thing i cant get out of my head is ... if i hadnt asked him to stay , i think he actually would have gone .. so why do i bother organizing the councelling and date nights etc ??

I don't know.
Why did you?

I have to agree with other comments.
You lost the rag and decided to see what would happen if you told him to pack his bags.
You expected him to get on his knees and beg you to change your mind. Now you're miffed cos due to his pride,he didn't. Now you've decided in your head, the reason he didn't is cos he doesn't care enough.
If someone said something as cruel as that to me, I wouldn't take it.
Never say what you don't mean, it'll come back and bite you in the ass.

Good luck with the counselling.

Marksie

Well the reason you are going into counselling is so that you can both explore your behaviour towards each other. Where it stems from, the effect it has, and what you can do about it.

To say why are you bothering to go to counselling because you behaved like that..its truer to say that because you behaved like that you need counselling.

It provides a framework through which this can be explored. to not do so because of your behaviour is getting it arseways.

Its important to realise that you are responsible for your own behaviour and ever action has its consequences

I am not going to delve into why you did what you did, thats for you to ndetremine, whether it was button pushing, testing limits or sheer contrariness.

But in answer to your question: you are trying to salavge your relationship. You are beginning to recognise that your behaviour..and of course his, is a major factor in the whole situation. So stick with it

heavyheart

yea i said it for attention , i no i did ... sometimes you get frustrated when you think your not being listened to then you opt for a more dramatic approach and then voila youve said leave and he goes to leave but yet you really dont want to him to , really, what you really really want is for the angriness to go away and feel like you OH is actually taking in what your saying ...
it so easy to say , never say anything you regret but in real life it happens ...
we've both incurred tactics that maybe we've seen our parents use growing up and applied them to our relationship and thats the wrong thing to do cause we've taken the negative ones ...
but im confident we will change our approach ... thanks for all the posts...

Zulu

Great post Wibbs!

Zulu

OP, just a point: you've repeated a few times that people say things "in the heat of the moment", and I believe you truly mean this. The thing is, a lot of people don't.
A lot of people don't say what they don't mean to their partner in order to get a reaction - particularly in a fight.

I don't. Wibbs and Beruthiel have also admitted they don't. I'd imagine Marksie doesn't - but I'll let him confirm. Eitherway, thats 3 of the 7 posters here who've made a point of saying they don't (I can't remember if togster siad it or not).

heavyheart

Zulu wrote: »

OP, just a point: you've repeated a few times that people say things "in the heat of the moment", and I believe you truly mean this. The thing is, a lot of people don't.
A lot of people don't say what they don't mean to their partner in order to get a reaction - particularly in a fight.

I don't. Wibbs and Beruthiel have also admitted they don't. I'd imagine Marksie doesn't - but I'll let him confirm. Eitherway, thats 3 of the 7 posters here who've made a point of saying they don't (I can't remember if togster siad it or not).

Ok i take your point but im a person i do/did it , im pretty sure im not alone.. there are more than 7 people in the world
and my partner has certainly said things to me in the heat of the moment we're both guilty of it.. we obviously havent learned how to bit our tongues.. but as i said , we are trying to fix that .

Zulu

Ah no fair enough, I was just pointing it out.

Wibbs

heavyheart wrote: »

yea i said it for attention , i no i did ... sometimes you get frustrated when you think your not being listened to then you opt for a more dramatic approach

And as you've spotted it doesn't work too well. For both genders I reckon. If the woman kicks off the guy usually just goes "oh right we're in over emotional territory" and switches off. If the man kicks off, the woman usually goes "oh oh this guy is not in control of his emotions and I'm losing respect for him".

and then voila youve said leave and he goes to leave but yet you really dont want to him to , really, what you really really want is for the angriness to go away and feel like you OH is actually taking in what your saying ...

Funny enough I get that. Having very close female friends I can speak a dialect of "woman"(albeit with an accent) and it has been patiently explained to me when a GF at the time was coming out with stuff I didn't get. The listening thing seems to be the biggy(duh makes sense. took me a while tho). No trying to solve anything while this is going on, no interruptions beyond letting her know I'm listening. When she's finished then and only then chime in. This sounds patronising to both genders but it's not as it's only a few situations when this comes up.

I will say what I've said to those mates of mine when their partners do the same as yours. When guys describe this as nagging, it means they heard you the first time and don't want to know, don't want to do it or want to do it in their own time. The more you push them and not back it up the more they'll retreat or not take you seriously. Again in general, but blokes are more direct when dealing with each other. They may only say it once and if it falls on deaf ears then that's that and they act accordingly.

it so easy to say , never say anything you regret but in real life it happens ...

True enough. I've had my foot in my mouth so many times I've laces on my lips.

we've both incurred tactics that maybe we've seen our parents use growing up and applied them to our relationship and thats the wrong thing to do cause we've taken the negative ones ...

Yea and you're not your parents and their possible foibles which a lot of people think they can't escape, but you can.

heavyheart

You no before i went to counselling i thought that the whole " blame it on the parents thing" was cliche ... bet seriously you have no idea how much they influence you and your relationship.. ok well i didnt until the counselor asked us a serious of questions on what we expect and fear in a relationship and when we both answered our answers god it became so clear that i dont want to end up like my parents so i fight for closeness ... its crazy but im diggin the counselling its really helping ...so anyone reading this and considering counseling for anything Go !! they really help..

JuliusCaesar

Zulu wrote: »

OP, just a point: you've repeated a few times that people say things "in the heat of the moment", and I believe you truly mean this. The thing is, a lot of people don't.
A lot of people don't say what they don't mean to their partner in order to get a reaction - particularly in a fight.

I don't. Wibbs and Beruthiel have also admitted they don't. I'd imagine Marksie doesn't - but I'll let him confirm. Eitherway, thats 3 of the 7 posters here who've made a point of saying they don't (I can't remember if togster siad it or not).

Me neither. Learnt that lesson a long time ago!
The other lesson I learnt the hard way? Criticise the behaviour, not the person.
Oh, and I try very hard not to swear in arguments either.

heavyheart

JuliusCaesar wrote: »

Criticise the behaviour, not the person.

Good Advice , thanks