Music Royalties

David O'Keeffe

Hey Everyone,

I've been DJing privately for some time, and am an avid fan of music, playing various different genres and styles.

However, I'm starting to become public, and will be doing some somewhat "public" parties, eg. in a location that it a public premises, but has a private function in this.

Can someone, or a few of you, please outline the legalities regarding music usage in various situations and locations. Most of my music is downloaded, but if played off a CD/HDD/MP3/ from my equipment would more than likely mean that I have to pay royalties.

Basically, I want to stay entirely above board and not be in trouble! I'm terribly confused with what music agencies I owe, who has appropriate authority, etc. IMRO/ASCAP/ etc. etc. :eek:

I am asking you guys here in the forum as I know there are some highly experienced DJ's who could lend me a few kind pieces of advice, and I know that these words of wisdom would be of great benefit to me and other newbies, for the want of a better word!

I await your reply with interest...

Many Thanks,

Dave.

L1011

Been a long time since I DJed outside of a premises with its own licencing (and one or two without I'd guess, if you remember the court cases in 2004), but you used to at least need a single event PPI licence - about 9 euros a pop - and obviously your music needed to be legal to satisfy IRMA. Can't rememember what IMROs involvement was in it. The PPI site is very, very detailed on their part of things. IMROs isn't...

kensutz

David O'Keeffe wrote: »

Hey Everyone,

I've been DJing privately for some time, and am an avid fan of music, playing various different genres and styles.

However, I'm starting to become public, and will be doing some somewhat "public" parties, eg. in a location that it a public premises, but has a private function in this.

Can someone, or a few of you, please outline the legalities regarding music usage in various situations and locations. Most of my music is downloaded, but if played off a CD/HDD/MP3/ from my equipment would more than likely mean that I have to pay royalties.

Basically, I want to stay entirely above board and not be in trouble! I'm terribly confused with what music agencies I owe, who has appropriate authority, etc. IMRO/ASCAP/ etc. etc. :eek:

I am asking you guys here in the forum as I know there are some highly experienced DJ's who could lend me a few kind pieces of advice, and I know that these words of wisdom would be of great benefit to me and other newbies, for the want of a better word!

I await your reply with interest...

Many Thanks,

Dave.

So you're breaking copyright laws but if you bought a cd and played it you might have to pay royalties? :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

David O'Keeffe

MYOB wrote: »

Been a long time since I DJed outside of a premises with its own licencing (and one or two without I'd guess, if you remember the court cases in 2004), but you used to at least need a single event PPI licence - about 9 euros a pop - and obviously your music needed to be legal to satisfy IRMA. Can't rememember what IMROs involvement was in it. The PPI site is very, very detailed on their part of things. IMROs isn't...

Thank you for your reply.

Now, I've been asked to DJ at an 18th in a Pub in Dublin. It is on the Suburbs, and will more than likely be in a function room above the premises. I will be playing music off my CD and HDD- this wil be covered by the premises' licence with IMRO?

The issue is, with the music satisfying IRMA, I would have to have paid for every single track, yes?

David O'Keeffe

kensutz wrote: »

So you're breaking copyright laws but if you bought a cd and played it you might have to pay royalties? :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

To clarify... If play this material in a public/private party/event setting.

Pardon my phrasing...

kensutz

Your phrasing is still very vague. It doesn't matter where you use the music you downloaded if you obtained it illegally. All my stuff I used before I gave up was from cds I bought in a shop.

David O'Keeffe

kensutz wrote: »

Your phrasing is still very vague. It doesn't matter where you use the music you downloaded if you obtained it illegally. All my stuff I used before I gave up was from cds I bought in a shop.

kensutz, please accept my apologies.

I was just confirming that all my music that will be played or used, must be bought from legitimate locations. I do not use any illegally downloaded music.

Limey

On a totally seperate point, the "music industry" deserves your contempt, not respect, however my point is nothing to do with the legality of playing their "art" or not

David O'Keeffe

Well, Naturally, I would not want to pay royalties or fees to musicians or licensing agencies whatsoever. I am only doing it to keep myself clear and safe in this modern time to music lawsuits, illegal downloading and moany record labels!

L1011

David O'Keeffe wrote: »

Thank you for your reply.

Now, I've been asked to DJ at an 18th in a Pub in Dublin. It is on the Suburbs, and will more than likely be in a function room above the premises. I will be playing music off my CD and HDD- this wil be covered by the premises' licence with IMRO?

The issue is, with the music satisfying IRMA, I would have to have paid for every single track, yes?

Check the premises *has* licences for the function room with the managment. They almost certainly will, and these will cover you.

The once off licences are more for doing weddings in non permanent marquees, teenage discos in parish halls (although you'd be surprised how many of these have dance licences including liquor sales and also full music rights licencing!) and other non-traditional venues that don't have regular DJs or bands playing.

And for IRMA every track must be legally acquired - thats all. I've tonnes of promos I never paid for - all EMI, proper pressed CDs. Also downloads for which I can show transaction receipts, both free (legal) and paid (legal - allofmp3 and clones aren't actually legal, its claimed by IRMA et al.)

Run_to_da_hills

I have been djing off laptops for over 8 years now and was never once quizzed about loyalties or licenses. Most of the gigs I would play at would have their license covered by IMRO. I carry hard copies I.E. legitimate copies of much of my collection on CD for two reasons, i.e. PC failure and secondly to keep IMRO & PPI and any other copyright coffers happy if they wish to inspect originals of my collection.

Technically you must have a hard copy or proof of purchase (Download receipt) of music played. In Holland it’s a e10,000 fine for not complying, I believe laptops used by DJs and digital jute boxes must be inspected and registered. Fortunitally in Ireland we are back in the dark ages when it comes to music licensing and there is no legislation yet for digital music. I will play along with this game until such time as they bring in the law which will be inevitable. Technically it is illegal to play any CD in a public event unless the venue has an IMRO license to cover a disco. I have often played in places where the bar manager has told me to remove any pa equipment immediatly after the event I can understand why.

Luke! Broughan

declare earnings.....thats all you gotta be concerned about as regards stuff

David O'Keeffe

So just to clarify, playing illegally downloaded music is a no-no, and if you are in a licensed IMRO venue, you're pretty safe regarding royalty payment...?

Run_to_da_hills

David O'Keeffe wrote: »

So just to clarify, playing illegally downloaded music is a no-no, and if you are in a licensed IMRO venue, you're pretty safe regarding royalty payment...?

Thats more or less the case. The chance of an IMRO or PPI raid is extremely slim unless you are operating from a well known profitable club or pub in the city. I have heard of inspectors requesting a search through a cd collection and also juteboxes to see if there is any bootleg copies. We could expect to see european based legislation soon and I would not be surprised that in the future DJs will have to be licensed. (for tax reasons).

David O'Keeffe

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Thats more or less the case. The chance of an IMRO or PPI raid is extremely slim unless you are operating from a well known profitable club or pub in the city. I have heard of inspectors requesting a search through a cd collection and also juteboxes to see if there is any bootleg copies. We could expect to see european based legislation soon and I would not be surprised that in the future DJs will have to be licensed. (for tax reasons).

Whoa, so things will tighten up soon. That's pretty bad. There is no way you can refuse them looking at your CD's etc.?

You could just say you burned the CD at home for convenience, but sure, then it would be an illegal copy!

L1011

as far as I know, no.

My entire CD wallets are copies of the originals these days - theres no way I'm bringing originals which could be stolen from me or the car while I'm loading/unloading... if it was your sole job (its not for me) - no music = bye bye income.

Run_to_da_hills

MYOB wrote: »

as far as I know, no.

My entire CD wallets are copies of the originals these days - theres no way I'm bringing originals which could be stolen from me or the car while I'm loading/unloading... if it was your sole job (its not for me) - no music = bye bye income.

Many of my original cds are scratched or damaged over the years and cannot be played without skipping and this one reason why I don’t play originals. When CDs came out in the 1980ies we were led to believe that this was the ultimate medium, they could last a lifetime with superb sound quality, maybe so in a clean room laboratory but they were another disaster just like cassette tapes. Vinyl and MP3 are the only way to go these days and Final Scratch offers a mixture of both and realy throws off these PPI inspectors when they come looking for bootleg cds.

David O'Keeffe

Yeah, we all were told that it was the best thing in the world (CD's), but realistically they aren't great. I would be for MP3 a lot myself.

L1011

cdparanoia - don't know if theres a Windows version of this but I'm Mac/BeOS for music so... - will usually rescue even heavily skipping CDs. Also with proper care they do last, my father has CDs from 1984 onwards and me from the early 90s that play fine.

Only CD I've had that failed fully was a 'best of the 90s' style compilation that succumbed to "laser rot". Badly manufactured disc (was a cheapo compilation) and overuse (had most of the 90s commercial classics on it) combine to make the disc rust basically.

djfitzerjnr

is it not taken out of the tax you pay??

i know you also have pay if you play a radio in a public premises such as shops....not as strict though!

L1011

No, its not.