Nikon advice

K!LL!@N

Some of you will probably remember me asking for advice on a new camera purchase before Christmas.

I went for the D40 in the end and was very happy with it.
I was just home in Ireland for most of March and my brother took a shine to the D40 and ended up buying it from me.

So now I've got cash again and no camera.
I'm 100% sure I want to stay with Nikon but now I'm unsure if I should just buy another D40 or if I should lay out a little more cash for something else.

The D40x is out, from my research before the D40 is the better option for the money.

The D60 is out now but I've been hearing mixed reports that it's not that big an improvement over the D40.

That leads me on to the D80.
It would only be a few hundred dollars more than the D40 package.

Thoughts?
Advice?

Cheers!

Killian

RoryW

I have the D80 and love it.

My brother just bought the D60 and looking at it, I prefer my D80 !

Nikon DSLR Comparison Guide
http://www.nikonusa.com/Assets/Common-Assets/PDF/DSLR_Compare2008.pdf

quilmore

I'd narrow your look for a camera to the great D40 (save the difference to the D40x and get a better lens or a flash gun) or the even greater D300
I'd pass on everything in between
I know camera alone is at least 3 or 4 times more expensive to get the D300 than the D40, that alone will make me say: get a D40 and great lenses for the same money (but I haven't done that, I've splashed out on a D300)

shop around, a D40 with lens shouldn't be much more than €400, you'll have to shop very hard to find such a value on any other camera

melekalikimaka

quilmore wrote: »

I'd narrow your look for a camera to the great D40 (save the difference to the D40x and get a better lens or a flash gun) or the even greater D300
I'd pass on everything in between
I know camera alone is at least 3 or 4 times more expensive to get the D300 than the D40, that alone will make me say: get a D40 and great lenses for the same money (but I haven't done that, I've splashed out on a D300)

shop around, a D40 with lens shouldn't be much more than €400, you'll have to shop very hard to find such a value on any other camera

good advice

run_Forrest_run

I also have a D80 and I love it. It's packed with features to ensure you won't be bored with it for years to come.

Thirdfox

Nor would you be bored with a D40

D40 is "old" technology but the D60 isn't that significant an upgrade (dynamic range has improved a bit, some ADR thrown in, an electronic rangefinder in manual mode and anti-dust device). I'd still take a D40 with some lenses over anything else available right now.

...but the D90 may be announced very soon - leading to price drops on the D80 - you may want to wait just a few more days for that...

Stephen

One thing to consider with the D80 is that it has a proper in-camera AF motor so that means you can pair it up with tons of older lenses that won't autofocus on the D40/x/D60.

I'm holding off on upgrading my elderly D50 until Nikon bring out the D80's replacement. If They remove the AF motor from it I will be quite pissed off.

Thirdfox

Actually I'm hoping that the D90 doesn't have the AF motor either (not likely I know) - the reason is that I have really old Nikkor lenses that will only mount on the D40/60 (the pre-AI lenses) - I don't know of anywhere in Ireland where you can convert pre-AI to AI/AIS lenses so I won't be able to use this on a D90 if it has a built in motor...

DaireQuinlan

Thirdfox wrote: »

Actually I'm hoping that the D90 doesn't have the AF motor either (not likely I know) - the reason is that I have really old Nikkor lenses that will only mount on the D40/60 (the pre-AI lenses) - I don't know of anywhere in Ireland where you can convert pre-AI to AI/AIS lenses so I won't be able to use this on a D90 if it has a built in motor...

?? The built in motor doesn't make any difference to that. I have an F4 onto which I can mount MF/AF lenses, the little screwdriver that gets driven by the internal motor is spring mounted, just moves inside the body if an MF lens is mounted. I think what allows these lenses to be mounted on the D40 is the lack of mechanical aperture coupling on the D40/D60. I'd say the D90 should be the same in that regard, but AFAIK the D80 is aswell ? Certainly doesn't meter with AIS/AI lenses.

Thirdfox

From Thom Hogan's site:
"The original F-mount appeared in 1959, and lenses that were produced from then until about 1979 are usually referred to as Pre-AI. These lenses are dangerous on current Nikon bodies. With the exception of a modified F5 and the D40/D40x, mounting one of these lenses on your new Nikon will result in damage, so don't even try it. If you find that you have one of these lenses and want to use it on a current camera, you must have the lens converted to AI first."
see here:
http://www.bythom.com/lensacronyms.htm

Only the D40/60 can use Pre-AI lenses (nothing else can without modification). I can only assume this is due to something about the lack of a built in motor e.g. D50/70/80/100/200/300/1/2/3 can't mount these lenses.

DaireQuinlan

Thirdfox wrote: »

From Thom Hogan's site:
"The original F-mount appeared in 1959, and lenses that were produced from then until about 1979 are usually referred to as Pre-AI. These lenses are dangerous on current Nikon bodies. With the exception of a modified F5 and the D40/D40x, mounting one of these lenses on your new Nikon will result in damage, so don't even try it. If you find that you have one of these lenses and want to use it on a current camera, you must have the lens converted to AI first."
see here:
http://www.bythom.com/lensacronyms.htm

Only the D40/60 can use Pre-AI lenses (nothing else can without modification). I can only assume this is due to something about the lack of a built in motor e.g. D50/70/80/100/200/300/1/2/3 can't mount these lenses.

I hate to disagree with Thom Hogan ... but I -can- mount pre-ai lenses on my F4, The aperture tab on the F4 folds up out of the way so pre-ai lenses can be mounted. They won't meter properly, you have to use stop-down metering, but they'll definately mount. This is what makes me think its the Aperture coupling, not the AF connection that actually makes the difference.

-edit-
Yeah, he actually contradicts himself later on, in the little table below the text, where he states that the F4 and F6 can mount pre-ai lenses
-/edit-

quilmore

it's not the motor, is the position of the mirror (wrong, see posts below) that's different from D40/x to the rest

Thirdfox

In which case I just hope that the D90 will be able to mount pre-AI lenses (whatever about having a focus motor or not)

DaireQuinlan

ahHa.
After a bit of investigation, the difference between the D80 and D40 mount that allows pre-ai to be mounted to the D40 and not the D80 despite their similarity otherwise is the minimum aperture switch:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1034&message=27309193&changemode=1

This gets damaged by the plastic surround on the mount of a pre-AI lens. AI and upward lenses have this ring mostly cut out, part of it engages with the aperture lug on the mount (that the D40 -and- D80 both lack), and another bit must engage this at some position.

Funnily enough I've never noticed this on my F4 either, I'll have to take a look when I get home.

K!LL!@N

I hadn't heard anything about a D90 coming soon.
You reckon there'll be news in the next week?

Killian

DaireQuinlan

Thirdfox wrote: »

In which case I just hope that the D90 will be able to mount pre-AI lenses (whatever about having a focus motor or not)

Welllll , having come round to this in a roundabout way, probably not, if it has that same minimum aperture switch thing :rolleyes:

Honestly, I often defend Nikon by going on about how they've kept the same lens mount since 1977 or thereabouts but the devil is really in the details sometimes :-)

melekalikimaka

d40 - d90 not really anything special tbh, same old just a few small things making any differencve cept the af motor. from d200 upthings get alot better, i'd go with a d70/d80/d50... or else d200/d300 depending on how serious i wanted to take it up

Thirdfox

that's a bit unfair mele - the D90 hasn't even been announced yet!

melekalikimaka

Thirdfox wrote: »

that's a bit unfair mele - the D90 hasn't even been announced yet!

i'm gonna assume its not gonna be much over the d80...nice but...mneh

Thirdfox

As I understand it - the D80 is a stripped down D200. So if the D90 is like a D300 with unnecessary bells and whistles then I'll be tempted.

Although not when 33% of all my lenses might not mount on the D90! And people were complaining about D40 and legacy lens support!

quilmore

Nikon D40 Black + AF-S DX 18-55mm Lens
http://www.jessops.com/Products/ProductDetail.aspx?SkuId=47076&cm_mmc=Jessops_Email-_-eflyer_010408-_-discount_accessories-_-d40_HTML

You pay £299.99 and claim £30 cashback from Nikon.
Final cost to you £269.99

that is €350

PopeBuckfastXVI

I haven't played with a D40, just read reviews. I have played with the pentax k100d equivalent though (looks pretty much the same functionality, from d40 pictures), and I wouldn't dream of swapping the d80 for that.

I found the interface waaaay awkward, going through the menus on the rear viewing screen to do simple things like adjusting iso or white balance would drive me crazy to be honest.

I'd definitely consider the d80 if I was you.

Thirdfox

You can set either ISO or white balance to the fn button... but personally I mostly use auto-ISO (the smart kind - found in the D80 too right?) and shoot either auto WB or for important shots shooting in RAW.

Different requirements for different people I suppose (although if I was offered a D80 at the price of a D40 I wouldn't say no )

quilmore

yes, absolutely, a D80 is twice the camera of a D40 (it cost more than double too)
also, a D300 is much more camera than a D80 (and cost double again)
and a D3 is the step up from a D300 at 2.5-3 times its price
and surely will be something upwards (mamiyas, etc)

In this case it's a matter of what money on a budget can buy

if you have under €400 get a D40 with kit lens
if you have €800 get a second hand D80 kit or €1100 for a new one
and with €1650 you can get a body only D300

or, with 800 you can have a D40 with kit lens and a 70-300 VR, or a sigma 10-20 and an 8 gb card
with what a D300 cost you can have a D40 and a 17-55 2.8 or if you shop well even a 70-200 vr 2.8

markconor

If you decide on a D80 and you're interested I'm selling my one -
Nikon D80 with Nikon 18-55 and 55-200 lens, also with 9gb of sd cards.

The camera is one year old and in excellent condition, I'm asking €750 for the lot.

email is markcurtin at yahoo dot com if you have any questions on it.

K!LL!@N

I should have mentioned that I live in the US.

Killian

PopeBuckfastXVI

markconor wrote: »

The camera is one year old and in excellent condition, I'm asking €750 for the lot.

K!LL!@N wrote: »

I should have mentioned that I live in the US.

Killian

In that case €750 is about... One Million Dollars ¬