Renewing Expired Provisional B and want to add A & M

Asok

I have an expired provisional B license and want to renew it and add on the A and M categories. I have gone ahead and passed the theory test for the bike categories but am a bit clueless as to where I go from here

Do I just follow the normal renewal process and include the new categories with the theory test cert or is there something else I need to do?

Thanks,
Danny

Del2005

Yes, just bring your current provisional and theory test cert. Depending on how long your provisional is out you may need to do the theory for that also. Why do you want M if you are getting A?

seamus

Yeah, standard renewal process, but include your theory test cert in the application. As Del says, there's no need to add M if you're getting A as the A category covers all vehicles in category M.

Unfortunately the licence you receive will be your second provisional (even though you've never held an A one before), so you'll have to do a driving test within two years, otherwise you won't be able to renew your licence.

Asok

Ahhh cool, I intend to sit the full test as soon as I can after the 6 months are up so two years should be plenty for me . I didnt know that about the A and M stuff so thanks!


Now to decide on a bike......

Wishbone Ash

seamus wrote: »

As Del says, there's no need to add M if you're getting A as the A category covers all vehicles in category M

Re Full Licences:

Just to clarify lads - the legislation was altered in 2004(?) regarding full licences. Prior to then, a person with a full B licence was covered to drive a moped or tractor on a public road but since the change, they must actually have the stamp on their licence, i.e. the licence must have a B, M and W stamp. These are only given if requested.

seamus

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Re Full Licences:

Just to clarify lads - the legislation was altered in 2004(?) regarding full licences. Prior to then, a person with a full B licence was covered to drive a moped or tractor on a public road but since the change, they must actually have the stamp on their licence, i.e. the licence must have a B, M and W stamp. These are only given if requested.

But if you have a full A licence, you do not need an M stamp

SeanW

seamus wrote:

Unfortunately the licence you receive will be your second provisional (even though you've never held an A one before), so you'll have to do a driving test within two years, otherwise you won't be able to renew your licence.

I don't think that's right, Seamus, each category on a provisional license/learner permit has its own 99X code (where X indicates the increment of the permit). The OP should be able to get a Learner Permit Category B 992, Category A and M Category 991. (In simple terms, 2nd Car Permit, 1st Bike and Moped Permit).

I should also point out to the OP that a Category A license or permit covers all motorcycles but you can only do a test for Category A with a motorcycle 150cc or greater. If you intend to do that, don't bother with a Category M Permit.

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Re Full Licences:

Just to clarify lads - the legislation was altered in 2004(?) regarding full licences. Prior to then, a person with a full B licence was covered to drive a moped or tractor on a public road but since the change, they must actually have the stamp on their licence, i.e. the licence must have a B, M and W stamp. These are only given if requested.

Wish, perhaps you can clear something up for me. I got my pinky (full about a month and a half ago, and the white explanitory sheet that came with it said 103 no entitlement to Category M and 104 no entitlement to Category W.

My license does not carry any restrictions at all. So, what exactly has to be done (for me) to obtain either category, and under what circumstances would ones full B license carry 103 and 104 restrictions?

Wishbone Ash

seamus wrote: »

But if you have a full A licence, you do not need an M stamp

Are you sure Seamus? One isn't permitted to ride a moped on a B licence unless the M is stamped on the licence. I'm not disputing what you say, just a bit doubtful.

Wishbone Ash

SeanW wrote: »

I don't think that's right, Seamus, each category on a provisional license/learner permit has its own 99X code (where X indicates the increment of the permit). The OP should be able to get a Learner Permit Category B 992, Category A and M Category 991. (In simple terms, 2nd Car Permit, 1st Bike and Moped Permit).

Yes, that is correct. It is possible to have several different provisional categories of different duration on the one licence.

For example, a person could have a 3rd provisional for a truck, a 2nd provisional for a bus and a 1st provisional for a motorcycle all on the same Provisional Licence. As SeanW has said, the different periods are indicated by codes on the licence.

SeanW wrote:

Wish, perhaps you can clear something up for me. I got my pinky (full about a month and a half ago, and the white explanitory sheet that came with it said 103 no entitlement to Category M and 104 no entitlement to Category W.

My license does not carry any restrictions at all. So, what exactly has to be done (for me) to obtain either category, and under what circumstances would ones full B license carry 103 and 104 restrictions?

AFAIK, you can go into your local MTO and have those categories added to your licence.

(If I get time I'll dig out the 2004 legislation and post the relevant bits).

seamus

SeanW wrote: »

I don't think that's right, Seamus, each category on a provisional license/learner permit has its own 99X code (where X indicates the increment of the permit). The OP should be able to get a Learner Permit Category B 992, Category A and M Category 991. (In simple terms, 2nd Car Permit, 1st Bike and Moped Permit).

Perhaps things have changed. I pass my car test in Oct 2001 having gotten my first car provisional licence in November 2000. I then applied for an A provisional in August 2002, but because I still technically had 3 months left on my initial car provisional, they basically "renewed" my provisional, added the A category to it (and removed the and about 3 months left before it expired :rolleyes:

So maybe the 2004 legislation changed something.

Are you sure Seamus? One isn't permitted to ride a moped on a B licence unless the M is stamped on the licence.

Well the A category covers "Motorcycles with or without sidecar". So unless there's something in legislation which says that mopeds are not "motorcycles", I'm going to assume otherwise.

Dar

seamus wrote: »

Well the A category covers "Motorcycles with or without sidecar". So unless there's something in legislation which says that mopeds are not "motorcycles", I'm going to assume otherwise.

Road Traffic Act wrote:

“moped” means a mechanically propelled bicycle fitted with an engine having a cylinder capacity not exceeding 50 cubic centimetres, if of the internal combustion type, and/or having a maximum design speed of not more than 45 kilometres per hour;

“motorcycle” means a mechanically propelled bicycle, with or without a sidecar, fitted with an engine having a cylinder capacity of more than 50 cubic centimetres, if of the internal combustion type, and/or having a maximum design speed of more than 45 kilometres per hour;

Technically, in the eyes of the law, mopeds are not motorcycles so catagory A/A1 does not apply... which is bloody silly .

macplaxton

Mopeds aren't motorcycles currently. That's why they have a separate national category. This will change when the 3DLD is implemented and it will be called EU sub-category "AM"

I'm just filling in my application for the full license.
Am I going to also have to get a learners permit just to keep a W?
Someone told me they did a W test recently and I thought they were pulling the proverbial.

Wishbone Ash

Moonbaby wrote: »

I'm just filling in my application for the full license.
Am I going to also have to get a learners permit just to keep a W?

You have an automatic entitlement to a 'W'.

Moonbaby wrote:

Someone told me they did a W test recently and I thought they were pulling the proverbial.

A tractor or 'works' vehicle may be driven on a public road by a 16 year old whereas one must be 17 to drive a category 'B' vehicle (which gives an automatic entitlement to a 'W').

'W' tests are quite rare and are usually done by persons under 17 year old who are not yet eligible for a 'B' licence.

(Although, I'd imagine that 99% of those with a 'W' licence also have a 'B' licence).