What is wrong?

Peyton Manning

So I was at a concert the other night in Belfast - went on my own because one of my mates had to pull out at the last minute. Had a great time. I live about 40 minutes walk from the venue so I decided to walk home. Im only a student, so I dont live there permanently - just in student accomodation. Since I had a 40 minute walk ahead of me, I decided to ring home, and then ring my girlfriend. Yet as soon as they found out I was walking home alone, both were immediately worried and begged me to get a taxi instead, and that it was too dangerous. Two seperate instances have happened since. Last night, one of my friends was attacked in a smoking area because he wouldn't give a guy a spare cigarette. And tonight, as Im home for the weekend, I only found out about the murders of the 2 polish men by teenagers. The more I think about it, maybe I was being a bit naive to walk home by myself?

But then I must ask myself, how has this country allowed itself to be in a position where people, even myself as a 20 year old at 6ft 2 and well able to defend myself, be afraid to walk somewhere at night by myself? Why do I always have a worry in my head when my girlfriend, or brothers, or anyone close to me goes out for a night? Am I just being overly paranoid or are things really out of control? I usually tend to avoid these conversations and debates as I was always of the opinion 'ah sure Im careful and always mind my own business' but this isnt really keeping anyone out of trouble anymore, and now that I find myself going out a lot more (living the college life as you do), it troubles me even more.

Shit, now I forget what question I was gonna ask. But I suppose it was along the lines of when things went wrong? And why or how did they go wrong and can it be fixed?

Sherifu

I wouldn't be afraid of walking home at night tbh. Was it ur mum/sis you were talking to at home too? Wimmens tend to live in phear. Attacked over a ciggie - nicotine ftl. So in summation, there is no spoon.

AlmightyCushion

When I lived in Dublin I always walked home. Way too cheap to pay for a taxi.

flanum

i dont understand was it in belfast or dublin? it doesnt matter .. actually it does maybe if it was belfast and you were walkin down the wrong street or something...

anyway.. where did it all go wrong??

listen mate, its not just the cities, recently in cavan (you can slag me about this in another thread) a small feckin town, there was a spate of attacks on people, some of the lads that were attacked were big feckers... basically it was big gang of 16yr old skanger kids pickin single people walkin alone off on the street, they werent even robbing them, just random violence, it got so bad that my dad and his bunch of auld mates wouldnt go out for a pint after 9 oclock!!!

so where did it all go wrong???????
well see in a year or two when we hit the slump!!!

basically the current generation of 15yr old up have never seen a bad day, they are the result of our generations celtic tiger, giving the kids everything we didnt have... playstations, tvs ****ing you name it!!
"da can i have a tenner, im meetin the lads later... etc"

its all our generations fault ,, the feckin celtic tigers fault. these kids never had to do without (god im turning into my dad), but **** it, we suddenly had money and we let the good times roll(as a nation)!

no cure... its going to have to skip a generation, it always does!

wait till the slump, and the KIDS NOW THAT HAVE EVERYTHING, THE ONES DOING ALL THE DAMAGE, WHEN THEY SUDDENLY FIND THEMSELVES SANS WORK/MONEY, AND THEIR KIDS ARE RUNNING RIOT!!!!...... oooohhh

its gonna take a while to mend itself!!

Sherifu

Cavan people giving their kids tenners, ya right. Pull the other one.

Yeah, I walked home when I stayed in Belfast before although everyone was thinking I was insane for doing so the next day. Perhaps it's people's perception about Belfast moreso than the idea of walking home?

*shrugs*

flanum

Myth wrote: »

Yeah, I walked home when I stayed in Belfast before although everyone was thinking I was insane for doing so the next day. Perhaps it's people's perception about Belfast moreso than the idea of walking home?

*shrugs*

so was the op in dub or belfast when he got attacked?? i dont follow?

flanum

get it now,, just re-read it!!
sorry

doesnt matter anyway, no matter where ye are!

Rb

flanum wrote: »

so was the op in dub or belfast when he got attacked?? i dont follow?

Op didn't say he was attacked, he said he walked home from a gig in Belfast to his rented place there and people thought he was insane for doing so.

On the one hand, it's peoples perception of Belfast being dangerous. On the other, I got the same kind of response when I told my folks I walked home from Dublin City Centre to my house after a night out before, that it was dangerous and I should have gotten a taxi etc, when I know full well that nothing would happen me, so I guess it's not just Belfast that has this perception about it.

People see the news, hear about some guy being attacked walking home some night (even though he could well have provoked someone) and it's suddenly labelled "dangerous" or the area is labelled "dangerous". A culture of fear creeping in, like it has in the US.

flanum

man its a ****ed up land we live in.
i used to live on the north circular rd in county dublin right across from mountjoy, few yards from mather, and i used to walk everywhere, i half remember walking several times, 3 steps sideways 2 steps forwards and eventually making one forward step the whole way from the ferryman, after a savage class sesiun usually, and never even gettin a bit of bother, i remember several times sittin down with lads to share their bottle of buckie and giv them fags on me way home, in fact in five years in dublin city, i dont have one bad thing to report, yet id be scared to walk alone down main st in cavan!! or any other small town for that matter!

god be with the days!

am i the only one that thinks it was a bit better when the ra were kneecappin skangers?

Mass media plays a part, in the olden days *insert timeslot here* news of a mugging rarely got further than a couple of streets from where the incident took place.
Then the story is forgotton a few weeks later.
Today it could be read by a boardsie in Australia before the victims family know about it!.
Also it is cached on the internet indefinately.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

When I lived in Dublin I always walked home. Way too cheap to pay for a taxi.

Seconded. I don't think Dublin's gotten any worse, to be honest, but then I don't read the Sunday World.

flanum

Deleted User wrote: »

Also it is cached on the internet indefinately.

eh?

google dublin mugging and see what I mean

Results 1 - 10 of about 26,600 for dublin mugging. (0.24 seconds)

flanum

Deleted User wrote: »

google dublin mugging and see what I mean

absolutelty, as i was sayin i lived 5 yrs in dub and never had such a peaceful time. but what do you reckon on my reason fior the op for where it all went wrong?

flanum

flanum wrote: »

i dont understand was it in belfast or dublin? it doesnt matter .. actually it does maybe if it was belfast and you were walkin down the wrong street or something...

anyway.. where did it all go wrong??

listen mate, its not just the cities, recently in cavan (you can slag me about this in another thread) a small feckin town, there was a spate of attacks on people, some of the lads that were attacked were big feckers... basically it was big gang of 16yr old skanger kids pickin single people walkin alone off on the street, they werent even robbing them, just random violence, it got so bad that my dad and his bunch of auld mates wouldnt go out for a pint after 9 oclock!!!

so where did it all go wrong???????
well see in a year or two when we hit the slump!!!

basically the current generation of 15yr old up have never seen a bad day, they are the result of our generations celtic tiger, giving the kids everything we didnt have... playstations, tvs ****ing you name it!!
"da can i have a tenner, im meetin the lads later... etc"

its all our generations fault ,, the feckin celtic tigers fault. these kids never had to do without (god im turning into my dad), but **** it, we suddenly had money and we let the good times roll(as a nation)!

no cure... its going to have to skip a generation, it always does!

wait till the slump, and the KIDS NOW THAT HAVE EVERYTHING, THE ONES DOING ALL THE DAMAGE, WHEN THEY SUDDENLY FIND THEMSELVES SANS WORK/MONEY, AND THEIR KIDS ARE RUNNING RIOT!!!!...... oooohhh

its gonna take a while to mend itself!!

well?

flanum

Put simply the apparant increase in danger on the streets is down to knowledge of the frequency of attacks, irrespective of relative location of the OP to where these incidents took place.

flanum wrote:

well?

There are more druggies around who don't even care if they are caught.
As for the teenage scumbags, they have no fear of authority! even their parents are nearly as bad (1st generation scumbags) would not dicipline their kids if informed that they were up to no good! More likely to turn on the police.

jahalpin

Belfast (along with the rest of Northern Ireland) is probably one of the most dangerous places to be walking around at night.

I have walked long distances at night, for example once I waslked from Feltham, Middlesex to Kingston Hill, Surrey as I had missed the last bus and was only a poor student and from Pier 39 to the "dodgy" end of Market Street in San Francisco, however I felt safe on these, unlike the time I had to walk from the Europa Hotel to the Holiday Inn in Belfast (very short walk)

nlgbbbblth

I walked from the city centre to Harolds Cross at 3.00am this morning. Nobody attacked me.

Simple rule: crappier the weather, lower your chances of being attacked! - unless they want your coat!

SW81

The little sh1ts don't have a fear of anything anymore.

tampopo

jahalpin wrote: »

and from Pier 39 to the "dodgy" end of Market Street in San Francisco,

This is a very safe walk, except for the last bit at the tenderloin, and which could be bypassed, depending on the route.
I usedta live at Larkin and Sutter when the Motherlode was in full swing early '90's !!!!

I agree with dolanbaker though. Flanum, if you were a non-smoker like meself and (had to) refuse, would I have been as welcomed so friendly?

I also agree to a certain degree with the op, when the **** hits the fan, the stink will be terrible. 'young fellas today'....sounds like the Hovis ad, or me da! have little discipline. Too much yes, yes, yes.

A young woman that worked under me a few years ago, asked me a question, I forget which. I said 'no'. An annoying prissy, lazy, numbskull, asked me "why?". Not having the time to get into it ad infinitum, I just said " I don't understand. You asked me and I said no.That's it." To start into the whys and wherefores would have taken the end of the shift. She was unable to take direction.

I'll stop here, too much of a rant,reminds me of an unhappy job experience!!!

flanum

its all down to havin a wee bit of savvy, in all fairness!

i must admit i had a close one one night in belfast walking down donegal rd(i think, the crossroads near the kfc) and like an eejit with a stupid lost southern accent drunkenly asked a group of yong wans for a light, they gave me the light but fair play to them one of them pulled me aside and said "get you into a taxi and dont be here". could have turned bad.

i lived up until last year in the scummiest address in dublin there is, ncr,just off dorset st, across from mountjoy and next to mather, junkies and loonies around all the time... never had one bad experience.

i lived in tel aviv off and on when the **** hit the fan (93-94) when loonies started stepping onto buses off ben yehuda street and blowing themselves up, never had a bad experience, wasnt even aware of it at the time, too busy havin the craic even tho mammy was ringing from ireland telling me to come home... feck off ill be alright!

its up to yourself at the end of the day to have a bit of wit.

speaktofrank

Agree with you there, a lot to be said for cop on. I still remember walking around Harlem at around 2am, looked like something out of a film. Put the hoodie up to blend in and off I went.

flanum

thats it you see, look lost and youll be targeted!

but then again this doesnt answer op original question. where it all went wrong, is there an answer?

i attempted to put my tuppence worth!

flanum

flanum wrote: »

anyway.. where did it all go wrong??

so where did it all go wrong???????
well see in a year or two when we hit the slump!!!

basically the current generation of 15yr old up have never seen a bad day, they are the result of our generations celtic tiger, giving the kids everything we didnt have... playstations, tvs ****ing you name it!!
"da can i have a tenner, im meetin the lads later... etc"

its all our generations fault ,, the feckin celtic tigers fault. these kids never had to do without (god im turning into my dad), but **** it, we suddenly had money and we let the good times roll(as a nation)!

no cure... its going to have to skip a generation, it always does!

wait till the slump, and the KIDS NOW THAT HAVE EVERYTHING, THE ONES DOING ALL THE DAMAGE, WHEN THEY SUDDENLY FIND THEMSELVES SANS WORK/MONEY, AND THEIR KIDS ARE RUNNING RIOT!!!!...... oooohhh

its gonna take a while to mend itself!!

?

tampopo

Ah, no, flanum I agree with you too. Look lost and you'd be targeted, and agree with you overall...

You've given us your opinions, no one is arguing against them.
You've highlighted several possible causes, no one is arguing against them.
As to the solution????
Tougher punishments, confiscate their playstations etc, loss of personal possessions will have a greater effect on them than any fine. (ban their parents from replacing such items).
Curfew backed up by tags!.


Forget ASBO's in the UK they are seen as "badges of honour" by some.

flanum

solution??

is it my imagination or was there a lot less antisocial behaviour going on when the ra ruled the streets? ok i know it wasnt perfect but i seem to remember a lot less joyriding/house breakind/muggings ec?

maybe a new vigilante force like in new york?? the guardian angels???

just a thought!

Red Hand

Are you serious? The IRA are only going to get involved in combating antisocial behavour (lets cheerfully ignore their own antisocial behaviour for a moment) if their business/criminality interests or families are threatened.

Anyway, vigilantes are the ones that often turn into sumbags themselves. Once they'd cleaned up the area that was a problem, some move in as the new criminals. I remember reading about this "Direct Action Against Drugs" actvist who laterr turned out to be a drug dealer.:rolleyes:

L1011

Belfast is safer than Dublin to walk alone in at night. Doesn't matter who you are or where you're walking (as long as you keep your mouth shut); I suspect the parents and girlfriend didn't realise that, though.

flanum

flanum wrote: »

is it my imagination or was there a lot less antisocial behaviour going on when the ra ruled the streets? ok i know it wasnt perfect but i seem to remember a lot less joyriding/house breakind/muggings ec?

Well the risk of losing a kneecap or two is a rather brutal deterrant! anyway the ra were probably giving some of them a purpose as well.

Vigillanties, Guardian angels; not really been there, done that, doesn't really work.

Almost all the crimes you mention are on the decline, cars are harder to nick, houses are better secured, fewer people walk in risky areas.
Crime clear-up rates are improving as well, sometimes it's a "one man crimewave".

I walked from Dame Street to Drumcondra one night, one of my friends said I was mad to do it and the next day my brother said the same thing. I'm just not scared of walking home at night.

buckfast4me

Everyone walking everywhere.. disgraceful.. the poor taxi drivers will be out of business in no time

Keeps their back seats clean!

Dashticle

Stupidly I remember getting so ****ed up drunk that i got lost somewhere Drumcondra on my way home from the pub. I literally remember realising I was lost, not being able to remember how I was standing there, I'd pretty much blacked out for an hour. Was on my own, no one attacked me, some people less drunk than me were even so kind as to point me in the right direction.

Oriel

Where was the gig and where do you live?

Oriel

jahalpin wrote: »

Belfast (along with the rest of Northern Ireland) is probably one of the most dangerous places to be walking around at night.

Rubbish. I've lived in Belfast and Dublin and find Belfast safer than Dublin. By quite a margin. Your fear was in your head before you started to walk.

biko

I've walked around Belfast at night many times drunk, never a bother. Last time was Saturday.
The closest I've been to trouble is a guy in Antrim town wanting to beat me up for pinching his gfs ass. Then his gf came over and say it wasn't me so he left looking for the real culprit.

Oriel

biko wrote: »

I've walked around Belfast at night many times drunk, never a bother. Last time was Saturday.
The closest I've been to trouble is a guy in Antrim town wanting to beat me up for pinching his gfs ass. Then his gf came over and say it wasn't me so he left looking for the real culprit.

Ha! Where were you at in Antrim?

Heisenberg.

This post has been deleted.

biko

Oriel wrote: »

Ha! Where were you at in Antrim?

I don't remember the name but it was a night club/bar on High Street I think. Was offered coke in the toilets, girls were chanting UDA UDA in the chipper afterwards and I was almost beaten up.
Good times

da1&only

I was leaving a night club on the northside of dublin on friday gone at about 1 o'clock as i had to be up early the following morning so i left on my own.I only live about 15 mins from the spot so i decided to walk,as i was half way true the carpark at the front of the night club i was hit from behind in the head for no apparent reason.I turned to defend myself when i realised there was three of them so i decided to make a run for it instead of getting seven shades of sh!te kicked out of me.i ran about 200m and thought i had lost them only to turn around to see they had chased me.At this stage i was shouting at them,asking what the wanted but got no reply.I tries to run again but tripped the next thing i knew i was on the ground getting a beating,cant remeber much but remember coming through with a busted up nose and my watch my gf had got me for xmass from newyork was gone.and all this happend.Needless to say i will be more carefull from now on but i should be able to walk freely on my streets with out being in fear of these scum bags

Collie D

biko wrote: »

I don't remember the name but it was a night club/bar on High Street I think. Was offered coke in the toilets, girls were chanting UDA UDA in the chipper afterwards and I was almost beaten up.
Good times

Antrim forum tbh

Oriel

biko wrote: »

I don't remember the name but it was a night club/bar on High Street I think. Was offered coke in the toilets, girls were chanting UDA UDA in the chipper afterwards and I was almost beaten up.

That sounds like the Kneebreakers or The Steeple bar.

Dinter

Remember one night in Manhattans in Portobello when I was around 18. Went in for a feed but then the homing instinct took over and I left. Didn't say goodbye to anyone so nobody knew I'd gone. Was totally blacked out.

Anyway the next day I woke up and I'd a big gash on my head that had bled so much the pillow was stuck to my face. Turned out a girl I knew had seen me having a massive scrap at Rathmines church and I'd gone home with her. I had absolutely no recollection of it.

I'd say a lot of assaults reported are like that. Drunken idiots. Don't know to this day if I started it or not.